At this rate I'll be banned by the end of November

[Ohdrat]

Re: From zero to nine in three days

Whilst I hold no truck with speeding (and yes I have been known to drive faster than the speed limit, but acknowledge that if I choose to do so I run the risk of being caught/fined/pointed) I have to say the police generally seem to be an unhelpful bunch of jobs worths who in addition really do not appear to have an iota of intelligence or initiative..... so no I don't respect them.. or the people who dream up "traffic calming" schemes and the law generally.. some of it is OK but much is ludicrous and misjudged and out of date. The police to be effective need effective law and powers so they aren't the only public body which should be held to account for the general lack of respect for the law and enforcement agencies.

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[jimi]

Re: From zero to nine in three days

I was rammed by a white van several months ago, I phoned the police from the spot, theyy were'nt interested as no one was injured. A friend of my daughters was assaulted by yobs in the village to the extent he had 3 broken ribs, again the police were'nt interested. A street in the village has drug dealers, underage drinking and car races every night, again the police are not interested. They are only interested in soft targets IMHO, and as such seem to have lost the rationale for operating as a police force.

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[Little_Russel]

Re: From zero to nine in three days

The Police are losing the respect of the very people they occasionally turn to help for simply because of Revenue Cameras. Also I heard on the radio today that they may stop appearing on 'Crimewatch OK' because the BBC aired that recent documentary.

<hr width=100% size=1>Sail the Se7en seas...

 

[Sybarite]

Re: From zero to nine in three days

I lost 4 points a few weeks ago (in France) the first penalty I have had in over 40 years of accident-free driving. This now categorizes me as a dangerous driver. I was on a dual carriageway where the speed panel was just as I was coming out of a tunnel and difficult to see because, with the sun behind it, it was silhouetted. Visibility on the road itself was perfect. The 30mph (50 kph) limit was to allow for urban driving conditions some 400m further on. Most of the traffic was doing about the same speed (approx 60mph).

This trap was not about road safety in my opinion. It was about maximizing convictions because Chirac instructed police to take a tougher stance. This helps them to attain their quotas more quickly. Those regularly driving at 40mph in the 30mph urban zone are much more dangerous than those on the dual carriage way.

I have already commented on the time I was driving in Surrey with my French plates. A police car peeled off a line of traffic to sit behind me for about 5 miles. He eventually got his chance and pulled me over because I had touched 34mph! Although I didn't get booked, I had to sit through a long lecture about what a danger I was to society and that I was lucky that he didn't lock me up (yes he did say this). I felt like saying (but didn't) that I had already had my license for 10 years when he was born.

I think somebody should print out this thread and send it to (a) David Plunkett, (b) their MP and (c) a paper.

While everybody wants to see accidents and crime figures reduced, the attitudes expressed here seem to make a mockery of police attitudes.

There are a lot of driving voters.

John






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[Rabbie]

Re: At this rate I\'ll be banned by the end of November

Wheres me white charger? It looks as if I am one of the very few here who think that most of our bobbies should have our support. God help us then. Think of the alternative. If you feel so bad about it - why not do something?. Blunkett for starters.


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[Ohdrat]

Re: At this rate I\'ll be banned by the end of November

These rants don't surprise me in the least.. for years this country has suffered under mediocre legislature and enforcement.. I don't think it is any worse than it was it's just the General Public are in general better educated and informed and as a result more critical.. which is good.. It's about time we had excellence in our legislature and enforcement.. that's what has to change!

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[bedouin]

Re: At this rate I\'ll be banned by the end of Nove

I think really most people on this forum do support the Police - but there appears to be a fundamental problem with their priorities.

While in the wrong conditions speeding can be dangerous, in many cases speeding is not, and so is a victimless crime. What people are saying here is that we would rather the Police spent their time addressing crimes that have a more direct impact on our lives.

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[Jools_of_Top_Cat]

Re: At this rate I\'ll be banned by the end of November

Rabbie, I speed through the back de-restricted roads through Wales, I never speed through the villages, does this mean you are going to give me a good kicking; You might as well have a go as it seems the only way to stop crime round these parts is through vigil-anti.

Are you going to restrict your obvious threats to the motorists, or is it ok in your opinion to allow all these children or car targets play on dual carriageways and motorways at night, as you said, all speeding means mowing down children.

It is a well known fact that speeding is not dangerous, it is where the speeding occours, I never drive at more than 25mph in built up areas, I have prolly saved the life of at least one child who ran out in front of me when its mother was chatting and not looking after it, but on open roads I speed up a bit, is that more dangerous than some of the idiots I saw this afternoon on their Sunday drives through Wales swerving about at 30mph; Dropping to 20 while they coasted around long corners.

Sailing, well, most of us rely on our cars to get to the boat, most of us drive on back roads to get to the boat, most of us come and go at wierd times from the boat.

But, I will do as you say and give full and absolute respect to a police force who think it is socialy acceptable and within our human rights to give road side medicals and fitness checks to older drivers as they see fit, obviously your average bobby, fuzz, gestapo, feds (delete as applicable) has been medically trained.

Also with N Wales zero speeding tolerance, the Ch Constables daughter was caught speeding the very day after he had made his idiotic statement. N. Wales police has gone speeding and motoring crazy.

I defy you to drive through Conwy on the A55 and keep to the limits, through the tunnels there must be at least 8 or 9 changes within 5 miles, I even got total symaphy from the traffic copper when I got flashed by the revenue camera. I stopped at the first police telephone and called to complain, saying I had set the the cruise control to 38mph so should not have gone over the 40mph limit.

It was actually a 30 zone, but the traffic fuzz also like me thought it was a 40, so what chance do we stand, I did not get done in the end.

Right, I am awaiting my kicking please !

<hr width=100% size=1>Julian

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.topcatsail.co.uk/TC_IrishCruise_2003_00.html>Irish Cruise</A>

 

[MartinGPerry]

Re: At this rate I\'ll be banned by the end of November

Get yourself an OriginBlue or RoadAngel less than £200 on eBay

Both are in-car GPS systems with each camera marked as waypoint - audible & visual alarms sound when approaching a fixed camera. RoadAngel also alerts to blackspots. Waypoints on both systems can be updated on the web

I am a driver doing 30,000+ miles each year, I was also caught three months ago doing 36 in a 30 mph zone. The mobile camera was on a dual carriageway ouside town, no houses nearby just 10 yards before the start of the 40mph zone. Purely a money making exercise no other reason



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[Rowana]

Re: Attitude! !

By jove jimi, you've started something here ! !

I agree with a lot of the sentiments expressed in that the police have lost public simpathy and support.

My own PERSONAL view is this -

If I was a common or garden plod, and nicked someone for breaking it to someone's house/car/boat or whatever, and when the case comes to court, he gets a mild slap over the wrist in the form of a fine (which he has no intention of paying), or "Community service", whatever that is, where is my incentive??

On the other hand, I can sit in my nice warm plod car, point a speed gun out the window, and get a few bob from otherwise law-abiding citizens, without any fuss.

Which would you do ? ? ?


BTW, I've been driving for nearly 40 years, and have never had so much as a parking ticket, but I wholeheartedly support Tony Martin. If any B***er ever breaks into my house, I'll beat the crap out of them with whatever comes to hand, as I have no faith WHATSOVER in the JUDICIAL system of this country.



Britain used to be an Empire, ruled by an Emperor,
Then we became a Kingdom, ruled by a King,

NOW WE'RE JUST A COUNTRY !!!



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[Neraida]

Don\'t you lot read???

I'm still waiting for one of you to offer me a nice waterside IT job!!! I'm very good, and would consider market rate for someone of my fabulous knowlege....

If I don't get an offer soon I will be forced to sulk!

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.ybw.com/cgi-bin/forums/postlist.pl?Cat=&Board=forsale>Bargain Laptop for sale </A>

 

[Little_Russel]

Re: At this rate I\'ll be banned by the end of November

Have a look at this from the Association of British Drivers...

The ABD web site has some interesting stuff on speeding, especially the 30% = 7% myth.

A rigorous analysis of Government-published figures undertaken by the Association of British Drivers shows that since 1993, the significant reduction in broad-based road safety education and police road traffic patrols - in favour of revenue-generating speed cameras - has been accompanied by the loss of over 5000 lives to date.
The figures show that as the numbers of speed cameras soared from 1993 onwards, the downward trend in road deaths that had existed for decades was almost completely lost. Had the former trend (a year on year 6% decrease in fatalities) continued, about 5500 people that have died on the roads in the last decade would be alive today.
It is now widely accepted that the switch from traditional traffic patrols to policing by camera has caused problems on the roads. Drivers who would normally be looking for potential hazards now have to split their attention and concentrate on spotting speed cameras and watching their speedometers. At the same time uninsured, drunk and dangerous drivers now enjoy a greatly reduced chance of being apprehended as traffic police are switched to other duties. Further evidence of this is provided by the steady reduction in those apprehended for careless, dangerous and drunken driving from 232,000 in 1990 to 144,000 in 2000, a decrease of 37% in absolute terms, and a decrease of over 45% when increased traffic is allowed for.
A spokesman said "The figures are even worse than we had expected. Regrettably, they are quite clear and undeniable. I wouldn't want to be running one of the so-called Safety Camera Partnerships when this gets out".
The partnerships operate both the familiar roadside cameras and the increasingly unpopular "Talivans". The partnerships, made up of police, magistrates, and local councils, have always sought to justify their actions by claiming to save lives. The usual basis for this claim is that in locations where cameras are installed, the number of accidents reduces in the period immediately following their installation. What the partnerships invariably fail to acknowledge is that they place cameras at locations where there have been unusually high numbers of accidents in the three year period preceding the camera installation, and where accident numbers would probably have reduced by a simple process of chance. This effect is extremely well understood and is known to statisticians as "regression to the mean" - the tendency for unusually high numbers of crashes to occur from time to time but not to be repeated year in and year out.
These fatality figures will be a body blow to the statistical chicanery of the camera partnerships, removing the central plank of their justification and exposing its real cost in human lives.
ABD Chairman, Brian Gregory commented "This makes me so sad and angry. We have been warning for years that speed cameras make the roads more dangerous. How many more will have to die before we return to traditional and proven road safety values based on skills, individual responsibility and consideration? This speed camera madness must end right now"


<hr width=100% size=1>Sail the Se7en seas...

 

[qsiv]

Re: From zero to nine in three days

Whilst I dont spend as much time in France as you, it does seem the French attitude has changed. Years ago I would simply put a couple of fines in the glove locker - now I have to say I try not to speed - but there are so many empty straight roads where it is all to easy let the speed creep up. It's more than 10 years since I did Le Havre to St. Malo in an hour and three quarters, but I dread to think of doing it now - even though I only saw three cars on the entire trip.

I think the last time I let adrenaline run away with me was on a day out at Thruxton.

I drive in England even less often than in France - but the place seems overrun with cameras (it almost makes Singapore seem a liberal state) - if only the same level of effort could be applied to other areas I doubt people would grumble.

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[ParaHandy]

Re: At this rate I\'ll be banned by the end of November

thar's room oan ma pillion fer ye ... ??

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[Romeo]

Re: From zero to nine in three days

As a cyclist and pedestrian, as well as a motorist, I cannot agree with the assertion that speeding is a victimless crime. My enjoyment of country and town roads is marred and I am put in danger by motorists driving too fast for the comfort and security of other road users. Cocooned in a safety cage with air bags and seatbelts IMHO it is too easy not to realise what your speed feels like to other road users.

I agree that speed limits are a bit of a blunt tool. It is no doubt often safe to drive above the speed limit especially on a deserted dual carriageway in the early hours of the morning. I have been done for it myself which I am not proud of. Equally it is often unsafe to drive at the speed limit. I have never come accross someone being prosectuted for driving at 25 in a 30 speed limit when it was unsafe to drive at that speed. So speed limits are a blunt tool but they are the only tool so lets respect them.

I see double standards at play here. Start a thread on policing of speed limits on PWCs and I believe many attitudes will change.



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[Chris_Robb]

Re: At this rate I\'ll be banned by the end of November

Jimi - I just picked up 6 in 1 week on the A303. one at 6 in the morning - 72mph on 60 limit no trafic at all, and the other 65 in 59 at 11.30 at night. camera is set over the top of a hill. I was being a good boy with cruise control set at 55mph (not knots). unfortunatley going down the hill allowed the speed to increase to 65 - big flash..

How long do points stay on license - last 3 was in June 2000. Think it is 4 years???

Chris

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[Romeo]

3 years (nm)

that points stay on for.

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[jimi]

Re: At this rate I\'ll be banned by the end of November

Think its 3 years, last one I had was 7 years ago, when I was stopped by an unmarked police car doing 89mph on the A303, police chap explained to me at the time that they only stopped cars exceeding 85mph or were driving dangerously. A form of policing I respect.
RobbieW, blunt instruments, injustice and inequity go hand in hand. I resent being classed as being the same danger to society as someone doing 59mph in a 30mph zone at 8:30am when I was doing 39mph on a totally empty well lit dry dual carriageway at 23:58 on a wednesday night. As others have said this is not policing but revenue generation, the shame is that if I nick a car and go joyriding I'm more liable to get away with it as the speed cameras reduce the necessity for police presence. So sensible law abiding people get hammered and the real offenders get away scot free. Something far wrong ...


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[tome]

Re: At this rate I\'ll be banned by the end of November

Jimi

Were you flying your cruising chute whilst distracted by the parrot?

Seriously, the speed cameras have caused much resentment and are indeed a blunt tool. They could make it better by having a sliding scale of points, maybe 1 point for a 5-10mph infringement building rapidly to 3. I don't suppose you'd be too upset with the fine if you only had 2 points added to your license.

If they don't do something to ease this situation they are going to live to regret it, especially when our rates increase for policing was some 18% this year. Time the government scrapped all the idiotic targets and allowed them to get back to basics.

Tom

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://home.btconnect.com/Amaya/Amaya_Web1.htm>Cherbourg Data site</A>

 

[Romeo]

Re: At this rate I\'ll be banned by the end of November

"sensible law abiding people"

Is that people who abide only by the laws that they consider sensible?



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