Jodles123
Active Member
I'm not sure that two engines are enough.
Now that's more like it!!!! Where can I get me one of them????
Are two engines better than one?
- Thread starter Jodles123
- Start date
Now that's more like it!!!! Where can I get me one of them????
paultallett
Well-Known Member
Let me see if I undersood... You're a woman that insists her hubby buys a bigger and more expensive boat?...
Blimey, you're a keeper
Brilliant
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Not necessarily.
At the size of boats you are talking about, just sticking a small "get-home" outboard on the transom, as has been suggested, is inherently safer than a twin engine boat in more ways than one, and isn't going to break the bank.
Though that's neither going to give you more comfort, nor kitchen facilities, of course...
superheat6k
Well-Known Member
I agree a 21' cuddy boat is too small for family boating other than brief days out. You also suffered the number 1 cause of a sea breakdown - fuel problems. ~ 27 - 28' provides a lot more space and feeling of safety when not moving in the direction intended.
Sea start definitely with only one engine. With two, very debatable - if the skipper is an engineer probably less critical as he will likely sort it and get he boat home. Seastart charge more for more engines, I guess because they reckon there is more to go wrong, but I would only call them if I couldn't fix it and couldn't get back to the mooring.
Sailing boats have two means of propulsion so if one doesn't work the other does. If offshore I believe this is essential too, although there are many many fishermen who rely on one horrible stinking lump of an old old diesel without any problems, as do most of the large cargo ships plying in and out of the Solent.
If you hubby is ex Navy make sure he plays the Old Pals act with Nick Eales who runs it - Ex RN Artificer.
A bigger boat will make you feel safer even if you are drifting into shipping lanes, but mostly these are safer than a lee shore. I know its difficult but the worse thing for me is trying to keep everyone calm when a potential disaster is playing itself out. Don't panic Mr Mainwaring (been there got the T Shirt, and one more than one occasion nearly took up golf !).
Nice to see you supporting Gafirs and the RNLI. I regard my contributions as a form of additional insurance, fortunately not had to put a claim in (yet !).
Sea start definitely with only one engine. With two, very debatable - if the skipper is an engineer probably less critical as he will likely sort it and get he boat home. Seastart charge more for more engines, I guess because they reckon there is more to go wrong, but I would only call them if I couldn't fix it and couldn't get back to the mooring.
Sailing boats have two means of propulsion so if one doesn't work the other does. If offshore I believe this is essential too, although there are many many fishermen who rely on one horrible stinking lump of an old old diesel without any problems, as do most of the large cargo ships plying in and out of the Solent.
If you hubby is ex Navy make sure he plays the Old Pals act with Nick Eales who runs it - Ex RN Artificer.
A bigger boat will make you feel safer even if you are drifting into shipping lanes, but mostly these are safer than a lee shore. I know its difficult but the worse thing for me is trying to keep everyone calm when a potential disaster is playing itself out. Don't panic Mr Mainwaring (been there got the T Shirt, and one more than one occasion nearly took up golf !).
Nice to see you supporting Gafirs and the RNLI. I regard my contributions as a form of additional insurance, fortunately not had to put a claim in (yet !).
ontheplane
Well-Known Member
Another vote for an auxiliary on a bracket.
Cheap, cheerful, and with it's own remote tank, it relies on NOTHING from the main boat - pull start, separate fuel (nothing to stop you running another fuel feed from the main tank if you want, but always have a portable tank as well in case the problem is the fuel somewhere).
With two engines you have twice as much chance of a breakdown and if it's fuel or loss of 12v to start it then you will probably lose both anyhow - and because you have two engines you won't have an aux on a bracket.....
And don't worry about getting something massive - a 10hp on a 21footer will be fine with the right prop fitted.
Agree with seastart as well they are good.
Main thing is an aux engine gives you thinking time - if the engine packs up in a tricky situation, and you don't know why you can have it lowered and fired up within a moment or two. Then it will hold you where you are against tide and wind, or make some progress until you can have a look at what's gone belly up in main engine area.....
But don't think an aux engine will always get you home - to my mind that's not the point of them. They allow you to have some control over where you drift, to keep you out of shipping lanes, off rocks etc until help arrives.
If you were regularly going seriously cross channel, or very long cruises, you can make an argument for twin engines - however fun in the Solent they might be nice to haves but far from essential.
Can I ask one question though - why were the kids screaming?????
You had a VHF, an Anchor and I am assuming you weren't in any immediate danger - so why were they so frightened.
I lost my main (only) engine in the solent once, it wouldn't rev over 1200rpm - so we still had steering and some drive and we were admittedly fairly near in. I explained to all aboard the situation, where we were, and how long we had before we were in any danger at all etc etc. I gave everyone a job to do, made a PanPan on the VHF and got everyone to don lifejackets etc. It was all very calm, everyone knew we were in no danger, and help was on it's way (fishing boat diverted on it's way to harbour and gave us a tow about 20 mins later).
It concerns me that you panicked - and the kids picked up on it. Again an aux engine gives you that ability, the chance to stay calm and think carefully about the situation and what you need to do without panicking.
Cheap, cheerful, and with it's own remote tank, it relies on NOTHING from the main boat - pull start, separate fuel (nothing to stop you running another fuel feed from the main tank if you want, but always have a portable tank as well in case the problem is the fuel somewhere).
With two engines you have twice as much chance of a breakdown and if it's fuel or loss of 12v to start it then you will probably lose both anyhow - and because you have two engines you won't have an aux on a bracket.....
And don't worry about getting something massive - a 10hp on a 21footer will be fine with the right prop fitted.
Agree with seastart as well they are good.
Main thing is an aux engine gives you thinking time - if the engine packs up in a tricky situation, and you don't know why you can have it lowered and fired up within a moment or two. Then it will hold you where you are against tide and wind, or make some progress until you can have a look at what's gone belly up in main engine area.....
But don't think an aux engine will always get you home - to my mind that's not the point of them. They allow you to have some control over where you drift, to keep you out of shipping lanes, off rocks etc until help arrives.
If you were regularly going seriously cross channel, or very long cruises, you can make an argument for twin engines - however fun in the Solent they might be nice to haves but far from essential.
Can I ask one question though - why were the kids screaming?????
You had a VHF, an Anchor and I am assuming you weren't in any immediate danger - so why were they so frightened.
I lost my main (only) engine in the solent once, it wouldn't rev over 1200rpm - so we still had steering and some drive and we were admittedly fairly near in. I explained to all aboard the situation, where we were, and how long we had before we were in any danger at all etc etc. I gave everyone a job to do, made a PanPan on the VHF and got everyone to don lifejackets etc. It was all very calm, everyone knew we were in no danger, and help was on it's way (fishing boat diverted on it's way to harbour and gave us a tow about 20 mins later).
It concerns me that you panicked - and the kids picked up on it. Again an aux engine gives you that ability, the chance to stay calm and think carefully about the situation and what you need to do without panicking.
westernman
Well-Known Member
I read somewhere in an aviation forum that in proportion a far higher percentage of twin engine private planes have fatal crashes than single engined private planes.
Conclusive proof that two is not better than one?
Conclusive proof that two is not better than one?
Canopy Locked
Well-Known Member
Just an observation about Aux engines... they don't always work when needed.
An Aux engine hanging off the transom from month to month, never being started, never being flushed when it's been started and run is very likely to fail at the time you need it most. They need to be treated just like a normal engine and used regularly. The other observation I have regards an Aux on a 20' + boat is that there is often very little thought given to the practicality of steering - it hangs off the aux bracket - you swing the bracket down into the water and then somehow you're supposed to lean over and hold the tiller throttle. Fine if on a small open boat where the transom is accessible, but perhaps not so easy with a sloping transom or with a swim platform.
Based on my experience with a 15HP aux on a 24' Hardy.
FWIW, Nowadays - 50m of anchor rope - no need for chain; a drogue (if in deep water); VHF and some flares.. and the fuel pre-filter is changed regularly. I have a single engine outboard on a 24ft Merry Fisher - no aux.
An Aux engine hanging off the transom from month to month, never being started, never being flushed when it's been started and run is very likely to fail at the time you need it most. They need to be treated just like a normal engine and used regularly. The other observation I have regards an Aux on a 20' + boat is that there is often very little thought given to the practicality of steering - it hangs off the aux bracket - you swing the bracket down into the water and then somehow you're supposed to lean over and hold the tiller throttle. Fine if on a small open boat where the transom is accessible, but perhaps not so easy with a sloping transom or with a swim platform.
Based on my experience with a 15HP aux on a 24' Hardy.
FWIW, Nowadays - 50m of anchor rope - no need for chain; a drogue (if in deep water); VHF and some flares.. and the fuel pre-filter is changed regularly. I have a single engine outboard on a 24ft Merry Fisher - no aux.
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davids0865
Well-Known Member
Having flown as private pîlot, on both singles and twins for 30 years + I have often heard the truism/joke that "In the event of an engine faiure in a twin, the remaining engine flys you to the scene of the accident"
rosssavage
Well-Known Member
A bit of an unfair comparison really - the majority of light twin crashes are due to marginal power remaining in the operable engine and thus a failure to maintain Vmc. That's doesn't happen in boats!
davids0865
Well-Known Member
Totally agree, really just agreeing with michealchapman.
Jodles123
Active Member
Thank you for those words of wisdom. Yup, hubby is indeed ex-Navy! Looking into Sea Start right now, seems like a very good idea.
Funnily enough, we've supported GAFIRs for about 10 years now.....long before we ever thought about getting a boat - such an amazing job those people do.
Jodles123
Active Member
Kids were screaming because the older one is really quite highly strung and doesn't like things not going to plan. Plus we were in the roughest sea we've ever been out on (forecast had changed slightly while we were overnighting). I was doing my best with the "singing songs, cracking jokes and generally being happy normal mummy" routine. Which in hindsight probably freaked her out...
Jodles123
Active Member
Just wanted to say a big thank you to EVERYONE for your contributions here.....we are very much in the learning stage and eager to get things right - and input like this from you experienced folk is fantastic.