Buy the right boat...... or the right engine

[potentillaCO32]

Sail it over with a delivery skipper?

In terms of is it legal. No-one knows until you weigh and measure it. If it meets those requirements then a normal car licence would allow you to tow it.

However, i say this as an hgv driver , i would not want to tow anything of the size of that behind a car. So that puts you into commercial transport. A ferry journey will add to the cost not just because the cost of a lorry on a ferry is way higher than a car but the added hours at port and on the ferry.

The lower vakue the boat the less worthwhile.

Delivery skipper or competant friend to hop across makes sense. But i think most of those petrol US 24 - 26 footers are primarily used as lake boats there.

 

[jakew009]

What is the issue with the VAT?

Was the boat commercially owned, in which case the exVAT price should be 20% lower to reflect this, and you pay the VAT on purchase?

Or are you worried about the complex VAT position created in NI by Brexit? VAT boats in NI on Brexit day shoukd in theory be accepted as VAT paid in both EU and UK. Worth checking paperwork but if UK VAT paid in NI then should be no issue bringing ing to mainland GB.
But worth checking details if a complex case or previous owner somehow dodged in an unusual way.

Could have been bought in Jersey and sailed to the UK. You see quite a few like that where the seller is a bit clueless as to what he has done.

 

[Mr Googler]

Get it put on a low loader….on the trailer. Works a treat! The fella i used had a manito to pull it on. That thing was 33ft long and 5,5 ton

Or just buy a dmax and go for it

 

[ontheplane]

No, everyone with a category B license now has B+E by default. Doesn’t make any difference if it’s on your license or not but I’m surprised she’s not got B+E on her license if it’s been renewed since 2021.

Really these are the relevant categories today:

B = 3.5ton car
B+E = 3.5ton car + 3.5ton trailer
C = anything as long as it doesn’t bend in the middle
C+E = sky’s the limit

I have:-

A
B1
B
C1
D1
BE
C1E
D1E
fklnpq

So it would seem I can drive most stuff other than Arctic - up to 12000kg (although I have no idea what kind of tow car / trailer combo would be legal at 12 ton!)

 

[ontheplane]

What is the issue with the VAT?

Was the boat commercially owned, in which case the exVAT price should be 20% lower to reflect this, and you pay the VAT on purchase?

Or are you worried about the complex VAT position created in NI by Brexit? VAT boats in NI on Brexit day shoukd in theory be accepted as VAT paid in both EU and UK. Worth checking paperwork but if UK VAT paid in NI then should be no issue bringing ing to mainland GB.
But worth checking details if a complex case or previous owner somehow dodged in an unusual way.

There is absolutely no VAT paperwork, so there is nothing to show whether it is VAT paid or not. Because it could have been bought in Southern Ireland, and it's been kept there, its quite possibly EU VAT paid but again no proof, it's all a bit risky.... so you'd have to pay VAT or take a total flyer....

 

[potentillaCO32]

I have:-

A
B1
B
C1
D1
BE
C1E
D1E
fklnpq

So it would seem I can drive most stuff other than Arctic - up to 12000kg (although I have no idea what kind of tow car / trailer combo would be legal at 12 ton!)

C1 and C1e is a 7.5 ton 'lorry' that you have under grandfather rights. It allows you to tow a trailer to a higher max train weight.

But... it is not valid for use for hire and reward as it is offered under grandfather rights so only to be used for own account personal use.

The definition of hire and reward is incredibly tight and even includes shared fuel costs. A number of horseboxes have been caught by this when they share costs for going to an event. They also commit at least 2 other offences unwittingly. Driving without DCPC and no tacho card.

P.s. you cant drive a proper rigid lorry over 7.5 tons either

 

[Mr Googler]

There is absolutely no VAT paperwork, so there is nothing to show whether it is VAT paid or not. Because it could have been bought in Southern Ireland, and it's been kept there, its quite possibly EU VAT paid but again no proof, it's all a bit risky.... so you'd have to pay VAT or take a total flyer....

Its not a complete gamble. VAT is a transaction tax. If the seller (an NI resident?) and you arent VAT registered and are not selling or buying it through a business……VAT cant be applied to the transaction. Also….who’s going to care as long as you dont take it abroad.

What it does do is impact resale value for some (not all) buyers. Adjust accordingly come offer time and go boating!

 

[jakew009]

Its not a complete gamble. VAT is a transaction tax. If the seller (an NI resident?) and you arent VAT registered and are not selling or buying it through a business……VAT cant be applied to the transaction. Also….who’s going to care as long as you dont take it abroad.

What it does do is impact resale value for some (not all) buyers. Adjust accordingly come offer time and go boating!

VAT paperwork is even more of a complete farce nowadays in a world where ChatGPT could generate you a set of VAT invoices in a few seconds.

 

[dunedin]

Its not a complete gamble. VAT is a transaction tax. If the seller (an NI resident?) and you arent VAT registered and are not selling or buying it through a business……VAT cant be applied to the transaction. Also….who’s going to care as long as you dont take it abroad.

What it does do is impact resale value for some (not all) buyers. Adjust accordingly come offer time and go boating!

But VAT is payable on the transaction of “importing” a boat - and because of the complexities, NI to GB could be “importing”, depending on circumstances.
If had correct paperwork all may be well. If not a 20% reduction in the offer might be appropriate.

 

[Mr Googler]

But VAT is payable on the transaction of “importing” a boat - and because of the complexities, NI to GB could be “importing”, depending on circumstances.
If had correct paperwork all may be well. If not a 20% reduction in the offer might be appropriate.

Hence my question about the seller being an NI resident. As i understand (and I am absolutely not an expert), a mainland resident buying from an NI resident is the exact same as mainland UK resident buying from a mainland UK resident. Time spent in Southern Ireland (therefor Europe) whilst in this owners time or a previous owners time is a problem for them and cant be proved either way given theres no VAT history anyway.

 

[Dino]

It might be worth checking with MGM Boats. They are the main Jeanneau dealer for Ireland and NI. They may have a record of the original sale or their finance provider may have details

 

[ontheplane]

It might be worth checking with MGM Boats. They are the main Jeanneau dealer for Ireland and NI. They may have a record of the original sale or their finance provider may have details

Not a bad shout that one! Thank you

 

[potentillaCO32]

There are many, many, many boats looking for new owners. No need to buy one in the 'too difficult' category.

 

[oldgit]

There are many, many, many boats looking for new owners. No need to buy one in the 'too difficult' category.

When "WE" were taking back control ( No downsides only Up ) a chum was selling a Broom 33 with Mercruisers.
After his purchase, discovered it was dog slow and put the thing back on the market pronto with well known broker.
Buyer flew over from Eire to have look and for a quick road test. No survey involved.
Deal was done and hands shaken ,prices to get it back home sorted.
A few days later buyer contacts seller and states that due to B***** ,VAT (about 12K) will need to be paid and would the seller please deduct this from the asking price.
Was told to Go Forth and ......
Boat was sold shortly afterwards at a reduced price.
Several helpful suggestions on here from posters suggesting why not take boat to NI and then slip across the border when nobody was looking.

 

[potentillaCO32]

When "WE" were taking back control ( No downsides only Up ) a chum was selling a Broom 33 with Mercruisers.
After his purchase, discovered it was dog slow and put the thing back on the market pronto with well known broker.
Buyer flew over from Eire to have look and for a quick road test. No survey involved.
Deal was done and hands shaken ,prices to get it back home sorted.
A few days later buyer contacts seller and states that due to B***** ,VAT (about 12K) will need to be paid and would the seller please deduct this from the asking price.
Was told to Go Forth and ......
Boat was sold shortly afterwards at a reduced price.
Several helpful suggestions on here from posters suggesting why not take boat to NI and then slip across the border when nobody was looking.

Ah... B , the nonsense that keeps giving.

 

[sailorman]

Every boat in the price range I am looking at are sterndrives - just petrol or diesel are the options….

sterndrives i believe need mucho servicing anually& weave about @ low spds