Are boat owners "clocking" their boats?

[Thepipdoc]

I don't really expect to get a definitive answer to this question, (I’m not that silly) but I find it very hard to believe that a boat that is 20 years old has done 150 hours! That equates to 7.5hours per year.
The boat in I’m specifically referring to is a 42’ fly bridge and I have to say this is not uncommon. There are loads of boats out there that have done single figure hours per year. I really find this very hard to believe that these so called “low hours” are correct.
I know many boat don’t get used a lot, but c’mon, 7.5 hours a year!?

 

[rubberduck]

We've done less than 5 this year

 

[Bbroomlea]

If its fitted with Volvo's there is a very good chance that the engine hour meter has been replaced - at least once I would guess if its 20 years old.

 

[oGaryo]

We've done less than 5 this year

tut tut.. if you're going to do this, make it worthwhile and clock at least 10 boats a year eh

 

[jfm]

It probably happens, but I'd expect it is much more likely on older (say, pre 2002-ish) boats where the hours data is stored in the tacho/hour meter. On electronic engines it is stored in flash memory in the engine's ECU, so it takes a smarter hacker to change the history

On our old Phantom 42, with pre EDC volvo engines, a tacho failed at about 75 hours so we got a new one. It read zero, being new. So i left the ignition on for 3 days to wind it forward to 75 hours. I suppose that's sort of reverse clocking???

 

[duncan]

entirely possible - especially such a craft that could have just sat afloat as a caravan!

however, it's probably more likely that it's been used more at some time in that period and that something has been replaced at some point (electrics or engines)

I've done 1000 in 10years - but then again I have done about 10 in the last 2 years...

 

[Bbroomlea]

entirely possible - especially such a craft that could have just sat afloat as a caravan!
QUOTE]

Its not unheard of - the boat moored behind us - a nice Sealine 270 is immaculate in condition but hasnt left the marina in 2 years.

 

[henryf]

I have to say I'm not sure I'd pay a whole lot of attention to the hours run on a boat. It's one of those mechanical objects where you buy based on what you see.

An engine doesn't have a given number of hours in it before t gives up the ghost. A daily used commercial boat will perform thousands of hours before components need changing which might require replacement after only a few hundred hours in an older less used pleasure boat.

As I'm always quoted for saying, buy on condition.

Henry

 

[sundancer9000]

Engine hours

166 hours done so far this season on a merryfisher925 flybridge. Absolutely love it. Had a conversation recently regarding the amount of hours and reselling implications. Interestingly arrived at the conclusion that price shouldnt be adversely affected as long as approved appropiate servicing has been carried out by quailified mechanics at the right times. Obviously receipts documentation and dealer stamps required.
Imho i would rather buy a used boat with a quality service history than something with low hours either 'honest hours' or otherwise.

 

[duncan]

166 hours done so far this season on a merryfisher925 flybridge. Absolutely love it. Had a conversation recently regarding the amount of hours and reselling implications. Interestingly arrived at the conclusion that price shouldnt be adversely affected as long as approved appropiate servicing has been carried out by quailified mechanics at the right times. Obviously receipts documentation and dealer stamps required.
Imho i would rather buy a used boat with a quality service history than something with low hours either 'honest hours' or otherwise.

definitely prefer the regularly run and maintained boat over the 'low hours' - just as much damage done by lack of use as use.

 

[Ripster]

I don't really expect to get a definitive answer to this question, (I’m not that silly) but I find it very hard to believe that a boat that is 20 years old has done 150 hours! That equates to 7.5hours per year.
The boat in I’m specifically referring to is a 42’ fly bridge and I have to say this is not uncommon. There are loads of boats out there that have done single figure hours per year. I really find this very hard to believe that these so called “low hours” are correct.
I know many boat don’t get used a lot, but c’mon, 7.5 hours a year!?

Interesting. We looked at Princess 420 - 1996 I think with only 170odd hours on.

 

[OAF]

We all see hundreds of boats that never seem to move off their berths and are used as floating caravans so I guess very low hours are feasible however their are the odd few people who do buy boats, tart them up to sell on so maybe they might just clock them if the hours are very high, I looked at a Princess that was not all that it seemed and had certainly been tarted up, it may well have been clocked but I didn't get that far, it is relatively easy to check a boats history if you can speak with the owner.

Are both clocks exactly the same?

 

[gjgm]

20 years might be a long time for complete service records, but sometimes the hours will be noted on the service sheets, maybe giving a clue?
Still, given how useless the VP rev/hour counters are, my guess is someone replaced them at some pint.

 

[Latestarter1]

I don't really expect to get a definitive answer to this question, (I’m not that silly) but I find it very hard to believe that a boat that is 20 years old has done 150 hours! That equates to 7.5hours per year.
The boat in I’m specifically referring to is a 42’ fly bridge and I have to say this is not uncommon. There are loads of boats out there that have done single figure hours per year. I really find this very hard to believe that these so called “low hours” are correct.
I know many boat don’t get used a lot, but c’mon, 7.5 hours a year!?

As you are extremely unlikely to wear out a modern engine in recreational use, you are up against 'marine aging'. Owners may ignore time based servicing, paying out big $$ when vessel has remained unused does not come easily. Charge air coolers love to sit full of stagnant sea water......RIP (Rot Into Pieces). Water pump impellers harden and break up.

Zero magic in low hour vessels, country cottages. Give me a well used high hour well serviced vessel any day.

As commented electronic engines are generally immune from clocking even if calibration is re-flashed as hours, electronic data plate etc have to be inacessable by law in the US thefore applies to us by default. Any dealer level service tool cannot access this data.

 

[omega2]

Use it or lose it, I want a boat not a caravan on water!!

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

As commented electronic engines are generally immune from clocking even if calibration is re-flashed as hours, electronic data plate etc have to be inacessable by law in the US thefore applies to us by default. Any dealer level service tool cannot access this data.

Thats what they say about cars but car clocking is still rife. I have no doubt that some techno savvy low life could easily clock the hours on electronically controlled marine engines if he put his mind to it. Whilst we're on the subject of low v high hours, I do agree that a well used regularly maintained boat with high hours may be a good buy but the likelihood is that many of the other components on the boat have been well used too which means that they are closer to the end of their lives. In addition, my observation is that high hours means that cosmetic stuff like woodwork, carpets, upholstery etc is also more worn. There is no question that on the used market a low hours boat commands a higher price than a high hours one and any broker that tells you different probably has a hgh hours boat to sell

 

[Latestarter1]

Thats what they say about cars but car clocking is still rife. I have no doubt that some techno savvy low life could easily clock the hours on electronically controlled marine engines if he put his mind to it. Whilst we're on the subject of low v high hours, I do agree that a well used regularly maintained boat with high hours may be a good buy but the likelihood is that many of the other components on the boat have been well used too which means that they are closer to the end of their lives. In addition, my observation is that high hours means that cosmetic stuff like woodwork, carpets, upholstery etc is also more worn. There is no question that on the used market a low hours boat commands a higher price than a high hours one and any broker that tells you different probably has a hgh hours boat to sell

I rarely have anthing to do with modern boats, as to decor, and electronics they are all the subject of potential refurbishment/upgrading, so soft shiny bits of zero interest.

In the US people actually use their boats so I can see why lower hour vessels have more attaction there.

Still 99.9% confidant that anybody trying to mess with the electronic data plate in the ECM/ECU would have huge technical problems to overcome. I know that whilst more easy to access than Volvo via the J1939 data link, CAT and Cummins both record the 'footprint' of the last service tool to visit the ECU. ECM/ECU security and actual ownership of the infomation has been discussed at SAE conferences. There is a heap of infomation locked up inside that box which cannot be re-set with the service tool. In the event of an engine failure manufacturer can perform complete download of engine duty cycle.

I would be prepared to eat humble pie should anybody prove that the ECM dataplate can be re-set on CAT, Cummins, or Detroit. By comparison cars are easy peasy as they have a number of devolved ECU's, just a matter of finding the correct controller holding the mileage, taking a binary dump, then tweaking it.

I think you can be confident that electronic dataplate infomation on a marine engine is a reliable source of infomation.

 

[Csail]

less than an hour this year.Mines not clocked but 500 ish hrs in 6 yrs.

 

[CX54WEK]

Ours is sort of clocked. When we were buying it the hour counter started playing up, no surprise it is the VP one, so the broker (stock boat) changed the hour counter for us. It was reading 240 hours but was reset back to 0. It now reads 725 hours but the actual hours the boats has run is closer to 965. Not an attempt to pull the wool over anyones eyes by any means.

 

[Whitelighter]

Shouldnt think so, not that it matters anyway.

Anyone who buys a boat on hours is a total ass.

Condition, service history, usage history and equiptment are all much more important.

I would rather buy a boat with 3,000 hours and a service history akin to the encyclopedia brittannica than a boat with 300 hours that has sat in the marina and been looked at by a mechanic bod once or twice on the basis 'well we dont go out that often, sod the service this year'.