Another "where to winter/liveaboard in the Med" thread

[taikohax]

The short version is I've reached decision paralysis and I'm hoping some wiser and more experienced heads than I can help me break a deadlock and make some recommendations for places to Winter in the Med.

In essence I'm lucky enough that I can work remotely (or, if the relevant residents visa precludes working, then I can live off existing dividends until a Digital Nomad visa comes in) and I'd like to take my boat, a Beneteau Oceanis 45 (45ft, 2.3m draft) and my two cats (they have EU Pet Passports), down to the Med this September - winter for 6 months [somewhere] and then ideally head East, do a clockwise loop into Greece and back out of the Med before doing the Atlantic in 2023. My intent is blunt the Schengen issue by getting either a Digital Nomad visa (if/when it comes in) or one of the residency ones - but that's not the purpose of this thread, i'm only interested in locations really.

What I'm ideally looking for is :

• Close ish to a decent airport for ad hoc flights back to the UK (maybe less than 2 hours away ish?)
• Short walk from a decent enough beach to carry on learning (badly) how to Wing Foil - in fairness mostly for my own sanity and staying healthy so it's pretty important
• Some kind of civilization/niceness for shops, food, culture etc - aka not in the back end of beyond
• Some kind of Marina community/acceptance of liveaboards would be lovely (and probably necessary in some visa situations)
• Must have decent internet access. Even if i'm not working I have enough stuff that I'm involved with (I help with a charity) that i need decent connection - I may solve that with a starlink

With bonuses for :

• Better than UK winter weather pls, i don't want to go to all this effort to freeze to death in a different country!
• er...i guess a cattery nearby is kinda important but not necessarily something anyone on here would know about
• Bonus if the airport is a major carrier rather than a budget one (budget carriers won't allow me to cargo cats, major ones usually will)
• Within striking distance of other interesting sailing once the weather starts to clear

I'm currently organising logistics of getting the boat moved (with or without me - i'm currently still under contract with a client and I have to balance the money earnt working those weeks vs the positive experience of taking the boat across with more experienced skippers), visas and refitting.

I have looked at :
Marina Di Ragusa - Consulate may have (new) issues accepting a boat as a residence for visa purposes (which makes me nervous), dunno about cattery :
Cartagena - No beach
Port Ginesta - looks like a possibility?

I'm interested in :
Er...anyone done livea boarding in the French Riveara? Saint Tropez etc? Any experiences?

I've ruled out :
Greece - looks like it's one too many complexities i'd prefer to warm up to, plus 3-4 weeks to get my boat over there (which i couldn't afford to take off OR pay someone else to do)
North Coast of Africa - can't depend on the internet plus i'd rather warm up to it
Croatia etc - too far East again, can't afford the time off right now

So folks.
Any recommendations for marinas etc that might fit the bill?

P.S. apologies but i'm going to cross post this on some other liveaboard forums, apologies if you see this multiple times.

 

[capnsensible]

Gib?

 

[taikohax]

Gib?

Took me a moment to work out where you meant.
I think Gibraltar doesn't really fit the beach thing tbh, trying to strike a balance.

Plus, and I am making huge assumptions here, i'm happy to escape British culture for a bit (and one assumes Gib still carries that?)

 

[capnsensible]

Lovely beachacross the border in La Linea. Excellent marina too but a bit of a walk for victuals. Airport is so close you can smell the burning rubber. But like most of the Med, winters are.....wintery. .

 

[capnsensible]

3 hour sail across to the Spanish enclave of Ceuta. Another 2 hours or less down to Marina Smir inMorocco. Lovely beaches....

 

[taikohax]

3 hour sail across to the Spanish enclave of Ceuta. Another 2 hours or less down to Marina Smir inMorocco. Lovely beaches....

I'll take another ganders. Still would prefer something further East if I can stretch it.
Thanks for the recommendation

 

[sailaboutvic]

Can I ask if you plain to leave Sept how far are you planing to get

 

[taikohax]

Can I ask if you plain to leave Sept how far are you planing to get

A few things affect that (and I'm going to make a decision in the next couple of days but luckily I'm not wedded to any one place).

If i do the whole thing and bring in a skipper for an assisted passage then I can probably only afford two weeks out of my current contract (I can then go back, tie up my current contract and bounce back over)

If my chosen destination is more than 2 weeks away, then I might have to only do part of the passage (maybe to Gibraltar) and use a skipper to take the boat the rest of the way.

But (weather dependent) leaving early Sept feels like the right time (for insurance purposes if nothing else)

In short in looking for a nice location I'm trying to balance time vs cost/distance - appreciate if i super flex one of those i'll have more choice but I have to be pragmatic for the moment.

 

[RO'D]

Maybe somewhere on the Algarve might be more pragmatic, given a September departure?
At that time of the year you may well be ducking out of bad weather, adding time to your trip.
My tuppeny worth would be slow down and reduce your expectations around distances, everything takes longer than you think.
Best of luck with it.

 

[taikohax]

Maybe somewhere on the Algarve might be more pragmatic, given a September departure?
At that time of the year you may well be ducking out of bad weather, adding time to your trip.
My tuppeny worth would be slow down and reduce your expectations around distances, everything takes longer than you think.
Best of luck with it.

Some good advice there, but not really somewhere I'm looking to winter (very pretty mind). If necessary I'll have to take it across in hops

 

[sailaboutvic]

Hi
I may have read your posting wrong but if you talking two weeks UK to Gib, I wish you well .
Depending when your jump point is thats min 1000nm .
Even if you manage to avg 5 kts all the way that's 200 hours.
We are both very experience sailors and I wouldnt be look covering that distance that time of years on that coast ,
I'm not saying it can't be done ,
It can , it just your putting yourself on a time limit and we all know what happens when we do that.
The suggestions of some where on the Portuguese coast was a good one .

As for MDR (ragusa) or a bit close Licata are both pretty good marinas , both safe both have beaches , licata is cheaper and has a large Sicilian town but both are quite away from the airport , about a few hours bus ride .
Both have a good winter community.
As far as cattery goes , it's not a Sicilian thing ,
When we sailed with our cat and dog if we left for a few days we would ask other cruisers to fed and keep an eye on him,
But that was winter months ,
You find summer months there be hardly any one other there other then locals in the marina.
Best of luck.

 

[taikohax]

Hi
I may have read your posting wrong but if you talking two weeks UK to Gib, I wish you well .
Depending when your jump point is thats min 1000nm .
Even if you manage to avg 5 kts all the way that's 200 hours.
We are both very experience sailors and I wouldnt be look covering that distance that time of years on that coast ,
I'm not saying it can't be done ,
It can , it just your putting yourself on a time limit and we all know what happens when we do that.
The suggestions of some where on the Portuguese coast was a good one .

As for MDR (ragusa) or a bit close Licata are both pretty good marinas , both safe both have beaches , licata is cheaper and has a large Sicilian town but both are quite away from the airport , about a few hours bus ride .
Both have a good winter community.
As far as cattery goes , it's not a Sicilian thing ,
When we sailed with our cat and dog if we left for a few days we would ask other cruisers to fed and keep an eye on him,
But that was winter months ,
You find summer months there be hardly any one other there other then locals in the marina.
Best of luck.

Yeah I realise i might be being brutally optimistic in hoping for a cattery
In terms of MDR - i heard that the Italian consulate* isn't accepting boats as residencies anymore, I don't know if you'd heard anything similar?

* i say that as if they're one hive mind with consistent rules, which I appreciate they probably aren't

 

[Yngmar]

Liveaboards are usually fine in the med, although you may want a place where you're not the only one.

Downside is, marinas with more than a few liveaboards generally have useless internet. You'll have to rely on mobile networks. Get a local SIM card and a big data package. Starlink won't work on a boat rolling left and right in weather and marinas generally discourage people from plonking their junk (including satellite dishes) on the pontoons, not that those are much more stable anyways. View of the sky for Starlink is generally extremely cluttered in a marina full of sailboats with masts sticking up all around.

Algarve is the obvious choice, especially given your odd timing. All three relevant stops (Lagos, Portimao, Albufeira) have beaches in walking distance, although you may find the winter weather sometimes challenging to surf in. Not sure there's any cat hotels, mostly liveaboards just make friends and have them look after the cats (and boat) while they're away. Albufeira has a cat colony, although they already have plenty of cats and don't need yours, but they may know someone that can house yours for a bit: https://www.agacatcharity.com/

Almerimar has a beach next to the marina too.

When checking for flight connections, make sure you check for winter flights. A lot of sunny beach holiday destinations have far fewer connections in winter months.

 

[capnsensible]

Hi
I may have read your posting wrong but if you talking two weeks UK to Gib, I wish you well .
Depending when your jump point is thats min 1000nm .
Even if you manage to avg 5 kts all the way that's 200 hours.
We are both very experience sailors and I wouldnt be look covering that distance that time of years on that coast ,
I'm not saying it can't be done ,
It can , it just your putting yourself on a time limit and we all know what happens when we do that.
The suggestions of some where on the Portuguese coast was a good one .

As for MDR (ragusa) or a bit close Licata are both pretty good marinas , both safe both have beaches , licata is cheaper and has a large Sicilian town but both are quite away from the airport , about a few hours bus ride .
Both have a good winter community.
As far as cattery goes , it's not a Sicilian thing ,
When we sailed with our cat and dog if we left for a few days we would ask other cruisers to fed and keep an eye on him,
But that was winter months ,
You find summer months there be hardly any one other there other then locals in the marina.
Best of luck.

For a delivery, probably 10 days to Gib. Pit stop for fuel somewhere probably. Last time I did it......last year....just one short stop in Nazare, 3 hours iirc.

 

[sailaboutvic]

For a delivery, probably 10 days to Gib. Pit stop for fuel somewhere probably. Last time I did it......last year....just one short stop in Nazare, 3 hours iirc.

As I said it can be done , 8 days friend on a mission did it in .
But again an experience sailor like yourself and extra good weather.

 

[sailaboutvic]

Yeah I realise i might be being brutally optimistic in hoping for a cattery
In terms of MDR - i heard that the Italian consulate* isn't accepting boats as residencies anymore, I don't know if you'd heard anything similar?

* i say that as if they're one hive mind with consistent rules, which I appreciate they probably aren't

Actually MDR was being used as an address for resident permits two years ago .
Where Licata cruisers couldn't, some thing to do with licata marina didn't have a proper address .
MDR is now Maltese own, maybe that's got something to so with it .

 

[Star-Lord]

Fcuk the Med!! Summer in Galicia and winter in Algaeve. Loads of beaches. Bring Pingers for Orcas. (I have been in Med for a few years now). Can’t wait to get back to the Atlantic.

 

[Kelpie]

We wintered in Portimao and really liked it, I think it would tick all your boxes although I don't know about a cattery!

 

[Trident]

Cartegena does have a nice beach a 15-20 minute walk away - Calla Cortina
Great weather , great town, close by airport and about 30 minutes out of the town a great cattery run by retired Brits who adore their cats

 

[blampied]

Gibraltar should be top of your list.
There are some decent beaches on the East side of Gib.
We are there now,
Gib is no where near as British as it was when we were last here 7 years ago.
More to the pity, Now days many local restaurants display menus only in Spanish, can’t even be bothered displaying an English menu and staff who only speak Spanish.
Close airport? How close do you need, from my berth in the marina it takes 17 minutes to walk to the check in desk.
But best of all Gib has still not joined the EU Schengen milarkey so no 90 day problems, so if you overwinter in Gib you have your full 90 days to use sailing in the Med from day 1.