Anchor time......

[FullCircle]

Tried a search and got nowhere. So....

What weight anchors (the different types) is the general consensus for a 35ft 6 tonne Jeanneau? Or is there a website(s) that have good tables?
I am using 50m chain main 10mm, and I have a windlass.
Cruising area not important as this is for equipping a new boat and looking for what you good people are using.
Kedge weights/chain combinations would also be good.

 

[Talbot]

Always go at least one size larger than recommended. Jimmy Green provides a reasonable table for comparitive sizes. Personnally I would recommend a 20Kg Delta for a boat of that size with that chain and a windlass.

 

[snowleopard]

treat recommendations by manufacturers with scepticism. if you search manufacturers websites you will come across things like:

"our 15kg type A anchor is suitable to boats 40-45 ft"
"our 15kg type B anchor is superior to type A and is suitable for boats 30-35ft"

you will also get advice here along the lines of:

"i use a 75kg anchor on my 25ft boat and it has never dragged"
"i use a 5kg anchor on my 50ft boat and it is perfect"

you will soon discover that to criticise anyone's choice of anchor comes slightly below insulting his boat and above insulting his wife.

from 'official' tables you will get recommendations of 8-15 kg for a steel anchor of modern pattern.

IMO 10mm chain is at the top end of the size range for your boat, 8mm would be a bit more like it, and if you're going for all-chain, a few more metres would be a godsend in deep water or bad weather. for a kedge, 60% of the bower size with 5-10m of chain and 40m of rope would suit most people. an aluminium kedge would be easier to handle and stow.

FWIW i have a 16kg delta on 20m 8mm chain + 80m 12mm nylon and it has done the business during around 200 nights at anchor. the boat is 40ft, 5.5 tonnes. it drags in soft soupy mud, then i get out my 3kg fortress kedge.

 

[Guest]

Best is ...

Any poll or ? on this will get as said by other - a mixed bag of answers.

My answer is : the biggest you can handle and store, without breaking your back. Yep - not a helpful answer - but true. Many boats have piddly little things that a) have no weight, b) are just suitable for dinghys not cruisers, c) all chain IMHO is best - but then a strop of nylon to silkence the bow noise is a good idea ......

Honest look around the yards - nows a good time as the boats are out and you can see a lot ...... see what they have similar to your boat ... and bobs the proverbial.

 

[MedMan]

My boat is much the same length and weight as yours.

My bower ancher is a 20kg Bruce on 65 metres of 10mm chain. I have an electric windlass. I deliberately over-specified before setting out long-term cruising and I have never regretted it.

Having got used to 10mm chain, I wouldn't trust my pocket watch on the tichy 8mm stuff some folk use!!! /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[Sea Devil]

I am with med man - I have upgraded from a 25lb Bruce to a 35lb CQR and now have a 45lb CQR with 10mm chain - 65 mtrs of the stuff and an electric anchor winch. If you are serious about anchoring you should be serious about anchoring.

 

[Born]

The French regulation says a 16 kg anchor and a 10mm chain should be used in your case. I think this is a good guess of the lowest value if you use a modern plough anchor made of steel. If you use a aluminium anchor, the weight is lower, obviously.

For my 39’ boat I have a 16 kg Delta and a 16 kg Kobra anchor with 60m (10 mm) chain plus 50m (16mm) rope.

Robert.

 

[duncan]

Welcome to the forum Born

 

[MapisM]

Chain: should I be worried?

I was surprised to see that almost everyone agreed with your choice of a 10mm chain.
I've also got a 10mm chain (100m of it), but with an anchor of 45kg, and an almost 40 tons boat.
Either it's correct for my boat and too much for yours, or correct for your and too small for mine!
Never had any problem so far, but...
...am I going to drift onto the rocks one of these nights? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[Sea Devil]

Re: Chain: should I be worried?

Should have posted 45lb CQR not Kilo -

It really is the right size for my boat - just depends if you anchoring a lot - in varied conditions with no other choice - then the ground tackle becomes vital. Many European boats anchor only occasional and never in bad weather.

 

[Robin]

Re: Chain: should I be worried?

Simpson-Lawrence recommendations used to be 8mm chain to match the 35lb/16kg CQR and 10mm to match the 45lb/20kg CQR. We have 70m of 10mm chain too with a 35lb Delta (rated the same holding power by S-L as the 45lb CQR) for our 41 footer. I would therefore have thought something a bit heavier would be needed in your case, at least 12mm if anchoring is expected in bad conditions.

We had a 45lb CQR/10mm chain combination on our last boat which worked exceptionally well over many years but I have to say the 35lb Delta we have now used for 3 seasons on our current boat is superb, it has never dragged and sets almost immediately it touches the seabed.

 

[ChrisE]

At the risk of being slightly contrarian about the weight of anchor, weight is not the only determinant, it is holding power.that is important. I've used a fortress which at 9kg sets and holds a damn sight better than my 35lb CQR, in most conditions. This is on a 10t 38' boat, we've spent over 400 nights at anchor on this arrangement

 

[MapisM]

Re: Chain: should I be worried?

Well, yes, maybe 12mm would be more appropriate for the boat/anchor size.
But my doubt is, is 10mm just a bit light with regard to supporting the anchor's holding power?
Or could it even break apart?
I'm saying this because I already experienced some windy nights, with 40kn gusts and 70-80 m. of chain.
Occasionally, the chain was under significant strain, but the boat was always confortable enough to sleep well.
Hence my doubt: if the chain would break in such situation, the wake up wouldn't exactly be amusing...

 

[john_morris_uk]

Re: Chain: should I be worried?

I'll add my tuppence and point out that the weight of the boat is one factor - I will argue that its the cross section size (and therefore windage) of the boat that is just as important.

The weight of the boat and its keel configuration will determine how she dances around her anchor.

The cross section and windage determines the static load that the anchor is required to hold.

In reality there's no such thing as a static load - the tide and wind combine to move the boat about on the anchor and the load varies. In survival conditions its the snatch load as the boat sails about her mooring that usually breaks the anchor out.

 

[MapisM]

Re: Chain: should I be worried?

I fully agree with your analysis. Based on experience, the behaviour of my boat is as follows:
it does not dance a lot around the anchor initially, but with strong wind - even if regularly blowing from the same direction - it is heavily affected by its own inertial force.
I mean, when it starts moving, it takes a while before it stops (in spite of a rather long and deep keel), thus when bouncing on the other side it tends to increase the "pendulum swing", if you see what I mean.
...but at the end of the day, I guess that calculating if the maximum snatch load can be beared by a 10mm chain or not is practically impossible...
What do you think, is it possible with a visual inspection to realize if the chain suffered any extraordinary load?
Or is it a yes or no issue - I mean, does it either break apart, or remain unspoiled?
It's galvanised, by the way.

 

[TheBoatman]

Re: Chain: should I be worried?

I agree with both of you. To many people seem to think that a b***dy great anchor attached to a B****dy great chain will be OK when it's all connected to a windlass or deck cleat held down with 2 or 4 8mm bolts! The whole system is only as good as the weakest link and on that point don't forget to tie the end of the chain to the strong point also tie an old knife there too! so that if it all goes seriously pear shaped you can cut the whole lot away "quickly". There's nothing worse than the RNLI turning up and you've got 1/2 a ton of chain and anchor that is "permanently" attached to the boat.

 

[john_morris_uk]

Re: Chain: should I be worried?

I can't imagine (or would rather try not to imagine) the conditions in which the snatch load of a boat on her anchor was sufficient to deform the chain, or load the chain to stress it beyond its safe limits.

My theory would be that the catenary of the chain in the water helps removes the shock load and the anchor eventually dragging at very high loads limits the absolute load.

I have only had to use an anchor in hurricane conditions once. As the Antiguans said - 'any tactic that survives is the one that works!' and I guess that if we are talking about survival conditions, then any anchor that holds is the one for me.

Of course there may be others on here who have seen/experienced chain deforming. I can only say that I have never seen any decently sized chain deform under normal anchoring conditions - whatever the weather.

 

[hylass]

[ QUOTE ]

What weight anchors (the different types) is the general consensus for a 35ft 6 tonne boat?

[/ QUOTE ]

It is generally accepted now that anchor WEIGHT as very few relation with the holding of an anchor..

Holding is much more related to three factors:

1°) the SIZE of the anchor (or the efficient surface area of the blade)
2°) the shape of this surface (concave the best)
3°) and also the stability of the anchor.. some anchors are unstable by desing, under havy loads they corkscrew and break free.. Some others, again with strong pulls, will slightly drag but remain set and holding..

 

[hylass]

Re: Chain: should I be worried?

[ QUOTE ]


My theory would be that the catenary of the chain in the water helps removes the shock load


[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry but I have a completely different theory!.. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
have a look at the highly interesting web page: Tuning an anchor rode http://alain.fraysse.free.fr/sail/rode/rode_b.htm
and you will excatly know why!..

The ONLY ways to remove a shock load are:
a) To use a mixed Chain / Rope mooring line
b) if using an all chain rode, to use an efficient snubber to attach the chain to the boat.

[ QUOTE ]
I can only say that I have never seen any decently sized chain deform under normal anchoring conditions - whatever the weather.

[/ QUOTE ]

Again I have a different experience.. or let's say not "deforming" chains but BREAKING chains..

 

[sailorman]

Hi Jim
i have 30 m of 8m/m chain + 30m of 18m/m multiplat spliced to the chain used with a 10kg bruce, works well on thr East Coast.
if the brown sticky hits the round whizzie thing i have an unused ( for 26 yrs ) 35 lb cqr stowed below + oodles of 18m/m warp