Anchor size.....advice

[harstonwood]

In a four day keel boat racing regatta next week, and one of the rules(for our class) States we have to take the anchor off the bow rollers

It's to heavy and sharp to put in the anchor locker safely, as it could damage the boat in a heavy sea

I will leave the chain in and wondered what size anchor would do us for emergencies to deploy with our current chain? (We have to carry one anyway and I don't fancy racing without one)

Boat is 40' keelboat (du four 405) sailing area is Abersoch/St Tudwals


I have a 5kg as a spare but think it's to light weight


All advice greatfully received

 

[NormanS]

I don't race, but to me, that seems a stupid and unseamanlike rule. I suppose you could use a lightweight alloy anchor, like a Fortress, which is an excellent anchor and easily handled, when required.

 

[flaming]

I don't race, but to me, that seems a stupid and unseamanlike rule. I suppose you could use a lightweight alloy anchor, like a Fortress, which is an excellent anchor and easily handled, when required.

Sadly, sometimes in racing someone makes a booboo and there's a collision. Would you rather be hit by the bow of a boat - or by the bow of a boat adorned by 25kg of Anchor? Standard racing rule, and has been for donkeys years.

As to what size anchor - just something big enough to keep you off the bricks. Most racing boats have a fortress or similar with 5m of chain and "some" rope. All stashed away at the bottom of the boat somewhere in a plastic box.

 

[harstonwood]

Thanks Flaming
Would you think 5kg would be enough? or I could get a 7/10kg on but would have to open my wallet!
Current anchor is a 25kg beast
I'll probably leave our chain in the locker so that would help I guess
Winds forecast to be strong so not looking to weight save

 

[bbg]

As to what size anchor - just something big enough to keep you off the bricks. Most racing boats have a fortress or similar with 5m of chain and "some" rope. All stashed away at the bottom of the boat somewhere in a plastic box.

I agree - fortress or something light, minimum amount of chain and some rope. Fortunately you have lots of rope on board. In one race I anchored in the Raz de Sein until the tide changed - had to add a couple of spinnaker sheets to the anchor rode in order to reach the bottom.

 

[flaming]

I agree - fortress or something light, minimum amount of chain and some rope. Fortunately you have lots of rope on board. In one race I anchored in the Raz de Sein until the tide changed - had to add a couple of spinnaker sheets to the anchor rode in order to reach the bottom.

Did you hear the one about the boat that kedged mid channel? Tied almost every line they could find to the anchor - jib sheets, kite sheets, even a couple of halyards.

Then when the wind filled in the anchor wouldn't budge and they lost the lot and had to retire. That would be an expensive day...

As to what size anchor for your boat... See the manufacturers sizing charts and then decide if you want to go small on the basis that you'll only use it in light winds, or is it a serious option in heavy winds?

 

[bbg]

Did you hear the one about the boat that kedged mid channel? Tied almost every line they could find to the anchor - jib sheets, kite sheets, even a couple of halyards.

Then when the wind filled in the anchor wouldn't budge and they lost the lot and had to retire. That would be an expensive day...

I was one of several boats that anchored, and at least three or four suffered the same problem I did. In order to make as much ground as possible against the tide, we kept sailing as we lowered the anchors. All of us had lightweight anchors and it turns out that they did not go straight down at all. With only a little bit of chain we sailed past them (at least through the water). On trying to retrieve them about four of us had managed to wrap them round the keel. Three guys just cut the rope. I spent about 45 minutes watching the fleet sail away as I tried (successfully, eventually) to unwrap the rode.

In the end I did it by using the rudders and sails to gybe the boat around the rode. So I am able to tell you just how much fun it is to lie stern-on to a rising current in the Raz du Sein in a small open transomed boat, not knowing if I was going to get the stern all the way around or get stuck stern-on. Even if it was only for a few seconds, the answer is "not much fun".

 

[NormanS]

I was one of several boats that anchored, and at least three or four suffered the same problem I did. In order to make as much ground as possible against the tide, we kept sailing as we lowered the anchors. All of us had lightweight anchors and it turns out that they did not go straight down at all. With only a little bit of chain we sailed past them (at least through the water). On trying to retrieve them about four of us had managed to wrap them round the keel. Three guys just cut the rope. I spent about 45 minutes watching the fleet sail away as I tried (successfully, eventually) to unwrap the rode.

In the end I did it by using the rudders and sails to gybe the boat around the rode. So I am able to tell you just how much fun it is to lie stern-on to a rising current in the Raz du Sein in a small open transomed boat, not knowing if I was going to get the stern all the way around or get stuck stern-on. Even if it was only for a few seconds, the answer is "not much fun".

As I said previously, a stupid and unseamanlike rule.

 

[bbg]

As I said previously, a stupid and unseamanlike rule.

I didn't have a bow roller on that boat, so I guess I wasn't very seamanlike. Actually the boat didn't have mooring cleats. Or (when I was racing) a motor. Or, for that matter, anyone else on board so I guess I was about as unseamanlike as I could possibly be!

 

[harstonwood]

Ok thanks all
Have opened my wallet and ordered a fortress (made of gold judging by the price)
The annoying thing, is the bow rollers still protrude out and would do some damage in a collision. Anyway rules are rules!

 

[Birdseye]

In a four day keel boat racing regatta next week, and one of the rules(for our class) States we have to take the anchor off the bow rollers

It's to heavy and sharp to put in the anchor locker safely, as it could damage the boat in a heavy sea

I will leave the chain in and wondered what size anchor would do us for emergencies to deploy with our current chain? (We have to carry one anyway and I don't fancy racing without one)

Boat is 40' keelboat (du four 405) sailing area is Abersoch/St Tudwals


I have a 5kg as a spare but think it's to light weight


All advice greatfully received

I use an aluminium anchor nowadays but I didnt hesitate to put the old Manson into the anchor locker, and thats racing in the bristol channel in winter. I'm sure your boat is designed to carry the anchor in the locker and if it isnt then its not fit for purpose.

Dump the chain fpor weight reasons. Empty the water tanks too. And clear out the rest of the cruising rubbish we all accumulate. Likely you will save half a tonne.

 

[lw395]

I don't race, but to me, that seems a stupid and unseamanlike rule. I suppose you could use a lightweight alloy anchor, like a Fortress, which is an excellent anchor and easily handled, when required.

On a fully crewed boat, it takes very little time to get an anchor from down below over the side.
I'm not aware of any incidents where it's been a problem.

 

[lw395]

Did you hear the one about the boat that kedged mid channel? Tied almost every line they could find to the anchor - jib sheets, kite sheets, even a couple of halyards.

Then when the wind filled in the anchor wouldn't budge and they lost the lot and had to retire. That would be an expensive day...

As to what size anchor for your boat... See the manufacturers sizing charts and then decide if you want to go small on the basis that you'll only use it in light winds, or is it a serious option in heavy winds?

For kedging in deep water, carry a 220m roll of lorry rope.
Cheap, light and quite strong for occasional use.

 

[Birdseye]

I hope that doesnt mean you are prepared to dump the rope, for it then to wrap round someones prop

 

[lw395]

I hope that doesnt mean you are prepared to dump the rope, for it then to wrap round someones prop

That would mean dumping the anchor!
I'm not made of money

 

[lpdsn]

Dump the chain fpor weight reasons. Empty the water tanks too. And clear out the rest of the cruising rubbish we all accumulate. Likely you will save half a tonne.

+1.

With the chain it is not just weight, it is weight in the bow which increases pitching and costs time, especially when beating.

 

[Birdseye]

That would mean dumping the anchor!
I'm not made of money

In which case why suggest cheap gash anchor rope? Whats more the sort that floats.

 

[lw395]

In which case why suggest cheap gash anchor rope? Whats more the sort that floats.

Because 220m of very strong rope for very occasional use or 'just in case' can be bought very cheaply.

 

[AngusMcDoon]

Because 220m of very strong rope for very occasional use or 'just in case' can be bought very cheaply.

Would a light aloominum anchor have the weight to sink 220m of buoyant polyprop rope? I could imagine the situation where the anchor sank to a certain depth and then was held afloat by the buoyancy of the rope above it.

 

[Racecruiser]

Would a light aloominum anchor have the weight to sink 220m of buoyant polyprop rope? I could imagine the situation where the anchor sank to a certain depth and then was held afloat by the buoyancy of the rope above it.

I don't know about that but it sounds similar but different to the old J boats when they had to put a tail rope on someone being hauled up the mast as the fall of the halyard was heavier than the body after a critical point!

But back to anchors - personally I would be careful about moving to a light anchor and taking off the chain. When you need to anchor you don't want to pi55 about and it may be when the mast has come down or the steering has failed on a lee shore - then of course it will be blowing and thoughts of kedging on a sunny day with a F1 will be the last thing on your mind.

ISAF regs for Cat 3 state 'For yachts of 8.5 m LOA (28 ft) and over there shall be 2 anchors together with a suitable combination of chain and rope, all ready for immediate use'.
Cat 4 which is what most inshore races are categorised under says 1 is ok.

As others have said putting the weight somewhere sensible is recommended - our wardrobe doesn't see much clothing but does accommodate 1 or 2 anchors (neither light) with chain and warp.