Refueler
Well-known member
The swivel (if fitted) on a ships anchor is literally just to have anchor rotate to stow in the 'pipe'
Anchor Bracket.
- Thread starter Andrew_Trayfoot
- Start date
vyv_cox
Well-known member
That looks identical to mine. I tested Loctite for a year before I used it for real. It works exactly as it says on the bottle.
I use a swivel because my foredeck crew prefers it. If the anchor comes up reversed I have to go forward to rotate it. This causes various problems, so it is far easier for her to turn it using the swivel
dunedin
Well-known member
With no swivel ours comes up the right way around 90% of the time (it was just 50/50 with the swivel before we removed it).What's needed is a new and more intelligent breed of anchor, which, when it comes up to the roller, rotates itself.
Or alternatively, you can use a "bent link" or "boomerang", which will do it for you.
And our intelligent anchor does tend to self align if necessary - simply reverse and the Rocna cleans the mud off and aligns the right way around
Neeves
Well-known member
You cannot be serious.
If you broke a shackle pin - it must have been made of plasticine. You are lucky you 'tested' it before it broke when you used it for what you intended.
Go and buy rated shackles! Crosby, Yoke, Peerless, Campbell They are hardly expensive (unless its made by Chaineries Limoges).
However I had the same problem, over generous use of a red Loctite. Mole wrench, shackle in jaws, galley blow torch soon releases the adhesive. Surely you have a small blow torch to make your creme brûlée.
Wire is not a panacea.
This is a wired, rubbish, shackle. The shackle failed. The pin pulled straight out of the thread (Loctite would have been no use either).
The owner lost a new Anchor Right Excel anchor - check the value of the anchor on Jimmy Green's website - lost because of a non rated shackle.
Jonathan
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Refueler
Well-known member
Neeves ... -- so you have never had a seized shackle ???
Get real ....
I'm not some kid that just happened onto boats .....
I am 100% sure that I am not only one that has had the 'eye' of a shackle twist / deform trying to get it undone .... and I am not in the mood to add to it with Loctite !!
I prefer to be able to easily remove / change / service gear ... and wire moused shackles allow that. What you do does not mean I want to follow.
Get real ....
I'm not some kid that just happened onto boats .....
I am 100% sure that I am not only one that has had the 'eye' of a shackle twist / deform trying to get it undone .... and I am not in the mood to add to it with Loctite !!
I prefer to be able to easily remove / change / service gear ... and wire moused shackles allow that. What you do does not mean I want to follow.
NormanS
Well-known member
I have never been keen on the principle of using Loctite, or similar. As a one time maintenance engineer, I much prefer locking threaded items including shackles, by mechanical means. This could be locknuts, suitable wire, split pins, grub screws, tab washers etc. Most shackles, including all my mooring shackles, and anchor shackles, are smeared with Copaslip before installation, and then after tightening, are locked by appropriate mechanical means. The Copaslip protects the threads from corrosion, and facilitates removal.
(Copaslip is a copper based grease. Other similar products are available).
(Copaslip is a copper based grease. Other similar products are available).
Bouba
Well-known member
It would only take one piece of stainless cut twice to make three pieces, weld twice to make one piece and drill four holes
Refueler
Well-known member
Thank you ... some older people may know Copperslip from mounting wheel hubs etc ?? Not something you see very often now ...
On the subject of wired shackles ... I have rarely seen a wired shackle when done well - wear through the wire ... especially if its an anchor that spends most of its life sitting on deck doing nought !!
vyv_cox
Well-known member
I investigated Loctite 242 to use in conjunction with a Kong swivel and a Wichard countersunk pin shackle. Neither of these can be fixed using wire. I have been using this method for something like 15 years now, disassembling each winter, when every time it took some effort to unscrew them.
Refueler
Well-known member
I dont say ALL situations .. of course there are various where mechanical means will not work ...
My comment is based on a standard eyed shackle pin.
I've worked with / alongside commercial mooring providers who not only service but lay moorings ... many years on ship .... laid moorings etc and wired mechanical means has been used in all. I've never seen Loctite used by any of them ..
For me - each to their own .. I was voicing my personal preference based on own observation / use and experiences ....
Given some of the "toilet chain" moorings I've seen some boaters lay - whether wire or Loctite is another matter !!
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Neeves
Well-known member
I am serious about the use of rated shackles
This image was supplied by a member here. Not a rated shackle, failed on retrieval of a Rocna anchor. Apart from not being rated its the wrong shackle anyway. Use a bow (sometimes called an anchor) shackle
I have tested to destruction using NATA approved test facilities many 10s of rated 3/8th" shackles either G60 or G80. Some did not meet the suppliers specification - until I tested (and then they changed the specification to meet my results). Without exception all the shackles failed with the shackle pin shearing at the pin. Crosby, Yoke, Peerless and Campbell all met the manufacturers specification. I have not tested Van Beest shackles, difficult to source in Australia. I have tested other shackles - but if you want a degree of certainty choose from my list - some are easy enough to source in the UK, including Crosby and Yoke. I have bought Crosby shackles fromTecni, I think based in Bristol.
I think you will find a number of people recommend the use of rated shackles from reputable manufacturers. Wiring a shackle bought from a hardware store will not, ever, make it stronger. I have never heard of anyone actually breaking a shackle by twisting, by hand or even helped by shifter. A rated G80 3/8th shackle takes 10t to break it - yet you did it easily.
You cannot be serious.
By all means mouse a shackle pin, its an excellent idea - but for anchors mouse only reputable shackles - not ones you can break by hand, or using hand tools.
If you know of a source of reputable shackles subject to independent testing please post so that the members can enjoy the information.
Jonathan
NormanS
Well-known member
That photo of a failed shackle is literally amazing. It is very difficult to imagine the forces that were applied to it to cause it to fail in two separate places at the same time. Is there something that we're not being told here?
Neeves
Well-known member
Maybe the member who sent me the image will respond.
rogerthebodger
Well-known member
First I would like to see the fracture face to see what the grain structure looks like.
From the pic it looks like a brittle fracture but difficult to see clearly
I would to love to here vyv's comment
From the pic it looks like a brittle fracture but difficult to see clearly
I would to love to here vyv's comment
Neeves
Well-known member
This is a link to Tecni and their 3/8th" Crosby shackle. This a rated shackle G80, Class B. They cost just under stg15 each + postage. Your anchor costs stg100s, your yacht costs a little bit more.
By all means save money by buying from your local hardware store - but restrict the use of the hardware store shackles to secure your dog - not your yacht's anchor.
If you buy a rated shackle, buy 2. Put one in a vice and try to destroy it using a shifter. If you can destroy it - post here
Jonathan
By all means save money by buying from your local hardware store - but restrict the use of the hardware store shackles to secure your dog - not your yacht's anchor.
If you buy a rated shackle, buy 2. Put one in a vice and try to destroy it using a shifter. If you can destroy it - post here
Jonathan
Neeves
Well-known member
rogerthebodger
Well-known member
Yes brittle fracture but the grain size looks big so I would question the heat treatment process and the hardness of the final metal
Comparing the chain size with the shackle size the shackle being bigger this must be a faulty shackle
What grade is the shackle and the chain
Comparing the chain size with the shackle size the shackle being bigger this must be a faulty shackle
What grade is the shackle and the chain
vyv_cox
Well-known member
That is very strange. It does have a brittle appearance with no obvious sign of progressive failure as with fatigue. It appears to be a galvanised steel shackle that pretty much rules out SCC.
The only suggestion I have is temperature related. A dead mild steel with no manganese content has a ductile/brittle transition temperature close to 20C. I can see slight plastic deformation that implies load application. Not knowing the circumstances, if a sudden load was applied at a temperature below 10C it could result in a brittle fracture, which would at least explain the twin breaks.
The only other example I have worked on was a windlass drum on a ship in the Arctic. I know of many others, Liberty ships, refinery vessels, etc but most were at 0 - 5C.
Neeves
Well-known member
I don't have the pieces - only the picture and the sorry tale of the lost Rocna anchor.
Never guess but the I might assume a G30 chain. The shackle is unrated, no Grade - just one of those shackles, maybe, you can buy in your local hardware store (to secure your dog)
The owner said the shackle failed when it hit the bow roller - so I assume (again never guess) that the actual failure occurred prior and the hitting of the bow roller was the final straw that broke the .....Interestingly the shackle shows little distortion.
I was interested that the owner lost his anchor but saved the pieces. I don't question the veracity of members willing to send me pictures - I think them both honest and generous and I am grateful.
