An Attempt to board a Yacht off Portugal

[Sea-Fever]

Peter Blake......

You miss my point, the suggestion was that self defense or military training gives you a killer instinct. My suggestion is that it does not, and that people react differently according to their psychological makeup. What training might give you is the ability to make an assessment of a situation, some skills that might help but that, really, action will always beat reaction and if someone wants to shoot you or stab you, no amount of training will help unless you act first. À

With respect to Mr Blake, he appears to have miscalculated what the result of his own action may have been but I wouldnt criticise him. He made a choice and a brave one, unfortunately it didn't work out. I don't think it's useful to cite a single event as the reason to act one way or another. Perhaps it is best to let them on board, who knows, every situation is different.

 

[skipmac]

especially the attacker

And if this occurred in a third world country or remote island it could be pretty bad for the shooter. Killing a local, even when you would see it as justified self defense, can put you in the local jail for a long time and jails in the third world can be very nasty. Your being proven innocent or justifiable homicide is not assured, considering the deceased's uncles and cousins will likely be on the jury.

 

[cherod]

And if this occurred in a third world country or remote island it could be pretty bad for the shooter. Killing a local, even when you would see it as justified self defense, can put you in the local jail for a long time and jails in the third world can be very nasty. Your being proven innocent or justifiable homicide is not assured, considering the deceased's uncles and cousins will likely be on the jury.

you are now getting away from the point a bit,, the incident took part ( as i read it ) just off S spain , yes there will be a investigation but it is still not a third world country and the outcome will certainly be better than you and your wife getting murdered .

 

[GHA]

I had a discussion with a boater that was cruising some of the poorer areas of the Caribbean. His position, "I have an older, smaller (32') boat and an old dinghy neither of which looks shiny and fancy so I won't be a target for the thieves. I pointed out that in a country where many live on a few dollars a day anyone that lives on a yacht and doesn't have to work dawn to dusk, 6-7 days a week is a rich American to the locals. When you're hungry and you have a hungry family at home, being nice isn't the first concern. And exactly, possessions can be replaced.

This came up a little while back over a beer with some cruisers who had made friends ashore in Madagascar or somewhere like that. From their point of view (the locals) any boat whatsoever in the anchorage was just far beyond any kind of financial comprehension, that someone could be so unimaginably rich as to afford one was hard for them to understand .
Didn't matter what state the boat was.
Like a high end winnibago parked up an ally way in the poorest most desolate housing estate you can think of anywhere in the world. Hats of to how nice nearly everyone is in these places that crime against cruisers is as low as it is. And embarrassing that lot of that crime is by other cruisers.

 

[Sea-Fever]

you are now getting away from the point a bit,, the incident took part ( as i read it ) just off S spain , yes there will be a investigation but it is still not a third world country and the outcome will certainly be better than you and your wife getting murdered .

That's exactly 50% true in my case


Ooh, sorry darling I was just joking.

 

[capnsensible]

and how would you suggest getting your boat from Gib to the Algarve ?

Well Ive done that dozens of times. Now there is a report of an incident, prudence suggests staying inshore and doing battle with ten billion pot markers. See if there is a second. Or more. The Straits after dark do have high speed vessel movements after dark quite a lot. But their cargo is probably worth more than you will ever have and they are not interested in yachts.

How would you do it?

 

[cherod]

Well Ive done that dozens of times. Now there is a report of an incident, prudence suggests staying inshore and doing battle with ten billion pot markers. See if there is a second. Or more. The Straits after dark do have high speed vessel movements after dark quite a lot. But their cargo is probably worth more than you will ever have and they are not interested in yachts.

How would you do it?

same as i have done it before , and you also i think , and countless others every year, so trying to tell people not to go there is pretty silly , if " they " are not interested in yachts why do you advise avoidance ??

 

[Sea-Fever]

Well Ive done that dozens of times.....

Quelle surprise!

 

[capnsensible]

same as i have done it before , and you also i think , and countless others every year, so trying to tell people not to go there is pretty silly , if " they " are not interested in yachts why do you advise avoidance ??

I don't think you quite got my reply. There is piracy and there are smugglers. Try again?

 

[capnsensible]

Quelle surprise!

When it comes to crossing the Straits to Africa, make that hundreds. ?

 

[cherod]

I don't think you quite got my reply. There is piracy and there are smugglers. Try again?

yes , and ?

 

[RupertW]

and regret and guilt would come if i ever felt i could have done more to protect my wife

Trouble is that being aggressive to criminals with anything less than a machine gun surprising them is likely to cause your family much greater harm compared to a robbery. No good answers but provoking them with less effective weapons than they have doesn’t sound like a good idea to me.

 

[skipmac]

And embarrassing that lot of that crime is by other cruisers.

In 40+ years of cruising the Bahamas, Caribbean and Latin America I recall three thefts from my boat: a dinghy in Ft Lauderdale that was stolen by locals, a stereo stolen from a marina also by locals in south Florida, and a Omega nav computer stolen by an American cruiser when I was anchored in the Bahamas. Never lost a thing to residents in the islands.

 

[skipmac]

you are now getting away from the point a bit,, the incident took part ( as i read it ) just off S spain , yes there will be a investigation but it is still not a third world country and the outcome will certainly be better than you and your wife getting murdered .

Have not forgotten that the original incident that prompted the discussion occurred off the Spanish coast. However the discussion seems to have drifted into much more general issues involving security.

 

[Jamie Dundee]

And if this occurred in a third world country or remote island it could be pretty bad for the shooter.

I have lived in Spain and, whilst occasionally a bit rough around the edges, I wouldn’t really classify it as 3rd world.

 

[FlyingGoose]

Trouble is that being aggressive to criminals with anything less than a machine gun surprising them is likely to cause your family much greater harm compared to a robbery. No good answers but provoking them with less effective weapons than they have doesn’t sound like a good idea to me.

To assume all criminals as just poor locals with no food and all they want is your laptop, has the potential to get you killed quicker
As many on here have commented the locals are not the problem but within any society there are bad apples , the fact that they are attempting to board your boat is a red flag waving,
Do you take the risk that they only take your laptop or rape your wife.
Frankly I could not live with that after the event knowing I did nothing.
The flight and fight response is different in all of us those that you think are nerdy may suddenly become Bruce Lee if his family were under threat.
I know my wife the sweetest lady you will ever meet not a bad word about anyone in the 20 years together, but I fear for anyone that hurts her daughter.
The best defence is to not let them on the boat, as mentioned through out out a line to catch their propeller, boot hook, fill a high powered water gun with petrol and light a flame, molotov bombs, petrol on the water through a match, they have to board on a moving boat not easy , baseball bat on the head, throwing of a knife, ropes, spiniker pole, get the gas canister out and create a nice flame thrower, but I will never let them board , they will see the whites of my crazy eyes and think is it worth it. Do you feel lucky punk
And they only wanted to sell me some fish

 

[Buck Turgidson]

lol

 

[Sea-Fever]

To assume all criminals as just poor locals with no food and all they want is your laptop, has the potential to get you killed quicker
As many on here have commented the locals are not the problem but within any society there are bad apples , the fact that they are attempting to board your boat is a red flag waving,
Do you take the risk that they only take your laptop or rape your wife.
Frankly I could not live with that after the event knowing I did nothing.
The flight and fight response is different in all of us those that you think are nerdy may suddenly become Bruce Lee if his family were under threat.
I know my wife the sweetest lady you will ever meet not a bad word about anyone in the 20 years together, but I fear for anyone that hurts her daughter.
The best defence is to not let them on the boat, as mentioned through out out a line to catch their propeller, boot hook, fill a high powered water gun with petrol and light a flame, molotov bombs, petrol on the water through a match, they have to board on a moving boat not easy , baseball bat on the head, throwing of a knife, ropes, spiniker pole, get the gas canister out and create a nice flame thrower, but I will never let them board , they will see the whites of my crazy eyes and think is it worth it. Do you feel lucky punk
And they only wanted to sell me some fish

I'm still laughing....

 

[Beneteau381]

I'm not convinced an air rifle could actually put a hole in the tube of a decent sized RIB. if anybody is in a position to find out, please report back.

Mine would

 

[Beneteau381]

I can hit a clay pigeon at 40yds with a 12g, I’m fairly sure I could hit a RIB at 20’. Possibly more legally I’m also pretty sure I could chuck a couple of lit red hand flares into a RIB which was close enough to fend off with a boat hook.

An open can of outboard fuel and a hand held or para flare would do the biz!