About to buy a boat

[Seajet]

Eric79,

waterproofs are expensive and the smaller the boat the better the w/p's one requires.

She may also require new sails, this is quite likely; ask on these forums before going for any old sailmaker.

The standing wire rigging should be replaced roughly every 10 years, for my 22' boat it cost £450 a few years ago, inc 5mm wire and chrome bronze bottlescrews, the boat you are looking at should be a fair bit less.

Insurance; shop around, some companies might insist on a survey which would be expensive for this boat, compared to her value.

The big question is, where abouts are you and where do you plan to keep her ?

Andy

 

[prv]

Always worth remembering that this is a very small boat being day-sailed locally. So ocean-crossing waterproofs are a bit unnecessary if wet weather means you stay at home and tidy the shed instead of going sailing. As for worrying about the standing rigging - 16 feet is Wayfarer territory, and I betcha most Wayfarers don't have their wires changed religiously at ten year intervals. VHF not necessary unless you know that mobile phone coverage is poor where you sail - though at £50 for a cheap handheld you may as well get one if it interests you.

Above all, get the boat in the water and have fun sailing it

Pete

 

[Seajet]

Who said anything about ' ocean crossing ' ?! Good waterproofs, say modern ' coastal ' standard are much more important on a small boat.

Standing rigging failing is a bit of a bore even on a lake, let alone somewhere with coastal trading ships bearing down on one, which is why I asked where all this is going to happen.

It would be a good idea if funds allow for Eric79 to do a sailing course such as Day Skipper, or even a dinghy course, to be able to get the max enjoyment from the boat, and the course should be fun in its' own right.

 

[Kelpie]

The only rig failures I've encountered on Wayfarers were related to fittings, not the wires. Not related to the age of the materials.
I agree with Seajet about needing better waterproofs in smaller boats- although hopefully the OP will not be in dry-suit territory.

 

[prv]

Who said anything about ' ocean crossing ' ?!

I did

I've done the crashing through icy seas as rail meat with hood brim meeting collar thing - and if you're doing that then you need good kit. And yes, in the same conditions the quality of waterproofs is more important on a small boat than a biggun as you're more exposed. But "same conditions" is the key. Despite aspirations to go further with her, in practice I've mostly used Kindred Spirit the last three years as a weekend Solent potterer - perhaps not dissimilar to how the OP will use his boat (albeit in a different part of the world). And in that time I don't think I've put my oily trousers on once, and the jacket only a handful of times.

I just don't like the idea of people new to sailing, with a cheap and cheerful boat, getting the impression (whether deliberately imparted or not) that they can't possibly start using their boat until they've been out and spent lots of money on "proper" sailing gear. It's just not true. Ask Dylan in his road-mender's jacket

Pete

 

[William_H]

The question you need to ask is do I want a boat and if so how big? Assuming a boat is in reasonable condition it will always need maintenance. So good or bad at the start it soon just becomes maintenance. Far more difficult is to change boats because what you bought is not big enough. Or simply you bought on a whim and are not really a boaty person. So many people have unused boats.
For my opinion however a 16ft will be a bit too slow a very lively in any sort of wind. Perhaps nearer the 22ft mark will be a lot more boat so more comfortable and faster under sail. And not a lot more expensive. Don't set your sights too low. olewill

 

[Seajet]

I did

I've done the crashing through icy seas as rail meat with hood brim meeting collar thing - and if you're doing that then you need good kit. And yes, in the same conditions the quality of waterproofs is more important on a small boat than a biggun as you're more exposed. But "same conditions" is the key. Despite aspirations to go further with her, in practice I've mostly used Kindred Spirit the last three years as a weekend Solent potterer - perhaps not dissimilar to how the OP will use his boat (albeit in a different part of the world). And in that time I don't think I've put my oily trousers on once, and the jacket only a handful of times.

I just don't like the idea of people new to sailing, with a cheap and cheerful boat, getting the impression (whether deliberately imparted or not) that they can't possibly start using their boat until they've been out and spent lots of money on "proper" sailing gear. It's just not true. Ask Dylan in his road-mender's jacket

Pete

Pete,

I once set off into the Solent expecting a bit of a slog, and ended up in long 55 knot squalls; my crew, who was very experienced, had cheapo waterproofs and suffered hypothermia to the point where he just shut down and curled up in the corner of the cockpit.

As it was a relatively short sail I just got us to Cowes ASAP, but on a longer trip I'd have had to bundle him into the cabin somehow and get him warm.

I didn't have an autopilot then in the early 1980's and we were being knocked down a bit in the squalls, still going but fore reaching with sheets flying.

Since then I've always carried space blankets in the first aid kit, but modern waterproofs would have avoided all that.

 

[maby]

Assuming that the OP is as new to sailing as he portrays, there are several possible outcomes and he needs to plan to avoid wasting a lot of money in any of them.

1) He and his family could take to small boat sailing like ducks to water (so to speak), find that this particular boat is just what they need for the next several years and spend that time pottering around the estuary - treating is as a Wayfarer with a lid on with possible overnight spells - they don't need a lot of gear for fair-weather river hopping and have a great time at little expense.

2) he and his family love sailing, but quickly decide that they want to move up to bigger things. They sell this boat, plus almost everything else they own, take several more jobs, sell off spare organs and buy something bigger before setting off on long distance open water cruising - they need really good gear and don't want to waste money on entry level coastal gear that does not get used.

3) One or more of them really does not like it at all and he decides that he has to sell up and get out. If he's only paid £800 for the boat he probably will not lose much, but there's little market for second hand lifejackets and cheap offshore oilies.

It makes the most sense to assume the first scenario - minimum investment up-front - he needs to spend the next couple of months getting the boat cleaned up, checking her over and learning to move it short distances - by then, the weather will be improving and they can cut their teeth with a bit of short distance fair weather pottering before taking stock and planning what they need next.

 

[Arida]

. I've had a quick look at insurance but most want a survey which I don't think will be worth it so will probably go 3rd party. I'm currently doing my day skipper and have booked up some lessons with a local skipper once the season starts.

Since the boat is less than 23ft, you should be able to get comprehensive "Small Craft" insurance without the need for a survey. Possibly worthwhile if it is going to be left moored up or you do not have secure storage for the trailer. I do just this with my old Kingfisher 20 - insured with Navigators and General via www.boatinsurance.org.uk, full 12 month "in the water" cover (Chichester Harbour) and not much more than 3rd party in my case. No idea what they are like if you actually have to claim, but expect it will be ok unless it comes down to an argument about whether the boat was in seaworthy condition.

We did almost exactly the same as you last season and have not regretted it. Just beware of the initial temptation to spend lots of money straight away - the chandlers can easily take as much from you as the initial purchase did. Get the basic safety stuff sorted first and then get sailing - you'll soon work out what you really need and what you can get by without.

Good luck!

Rob

 

[Kelpie]

I would add to the above advice that, if sailing with kids, don't underestimate how quickly they will get cold/bored/hungry. I'm not saying you need to splash out on toddler versions of Musto oilies, but sensible clothing and footwear- and lots of snacks. Maybe even a Nintendo if there's risk of boredom. Although lots of kids are perfectly satisfied by towing a fishing line, and of course they can go on the helm from a pretty early age too.

 

[Seajet]

I learned the hard, expensive way that bigger is not better, quite the opposite when one wants FUN from a boat, however that depends on the design and how one uses it.

If children are involved, I'd try to get them to read ' Swallows & Amazons ', ' We Didn't mean to go to sea ' and the other Arthur Ransome books, a friend did just that and now has a keen crew.

When new to sailing it's natural to make mistakes and end up doing things the hard way; I was lucky to be taught by a friend who had been through hell in WWII and I suspect just dreamed of having his own little boat; one of the things he taught me is ' the best sailor in the world is the laziest, he'll have worked out what he's going to do long before and expend minimum effort doing it '.

 

[bert49uk]

the pictures of your boat are taken in Ilfracombe Devon, i dont recognise her, she is not a local boat

 

[Eric79]

wow lots to digest!

It was my birthday a few weeks ago and my lovely wife brought me a coastal sailing coat and trousers that make Simon Cowel look fashionable! They are Gill which I hope was a good make. If the rest of the family take to it will be investing in some gear for them too but was hoping to get away with layering them all up for the first few trips.

Thanks for the tip about insurance will follow that up if we buy it.

I have done a bit of sea sailing as a child and few hours in a dingy more recently, but would still describe myself as a novice. I am currently doing the shore based part of Day skipper. I have booked up a few lessons once the season starts with a very experienced (and expensive) skipper. I've also joined the local Yacht club so was hoping to blag a few days crewing as well.

Our long term plan has always been to sail around the world once we have shipped the boys off to university/homeless hostel. The plan was to get our first boat in two years once I had gained some experience but this one looked to good to miss.

Yes Bert it was taken in Ilfracombe harbour and you win the prize of a free day showing me how to sail my boat! It is a local boat however the owner has not had the time to use it recently.

I'm not sure my kidneys will raise much - to pickled, but the boys are still in good condition .........

So far the boys are very keen on getting the boat (9 and 13) and I think we have some fishing stuff some where but will take the DS's just in case.

I'm planning to keep it moored in the Taw/ Torridge estuary near Instow, I have the details of the firm that sorts the mooring but not called them yet until I see the boat.

Sorry if I have missed anyone else's comments out.

Thanks for all the tips and advice its very much appreciated

 

[alahol2]

One thing you will need and haven't yet mentioned is a suitable dinghy (and maybe outboard depending on distance) to get to and from your mooring. Somewhere to keep the dinghy also. Another thought is that, with kids, they like to get ashore to the beach. That boat does not lend itself to just running it up on a beach and jumping off. Don't want to put you off, just point out things to consider, there are a lot of cheap boats about.

 

[Seajet]

Eric,

talking of dinghies reminds me, even with a deep water mooring, access via dinghy can be strictly tidal, or an SAS-like assault course dragging the thing over mud or stony obstacles !

Something to bear in mind, but I get the impression you're going to have a lot of fun, in the best sense.

Andy

 

[Eric79]

I'm going to look at it tomorrow I'm hopping it comes with a dingy, but then I'm a hopelss opptimissed!

I was watching one of the ghastly Storage Wars on T.V. and someone got a locker with a self inflating dingy, Looked very cool but I suspect will cost more that the boat.

I can keep the dingy at the yacht club.

 

[Zagato]

Good luck with her, keep your eye out for other boats in the meantime, maybe something with a lifting keel to get you up the creeks overnight! Loads for sale in this price bracket, check out Boats and Outboards, Apollo Duck etc online, do a bit of window shopping and avoid the "Corr look at that, I wish I had got that now" scenario. They say the best part of boat ownership is when buying one...and then selling one!! Some marques sell better than others when it's time to move her on. Also, if you have it, for another 1K you can get something bigger and maybe more practical long term. You don't want to be in a position having to sell it in a couple of years. As an aside there is a nice Hurley 20 for sale in my yard for the same money but without sails or engine!

I didn't need a survey on my old Drascombe or Crabber for insurance. Shouldn't be more than £130... You can pick up a scruffy dinghy for £50 - £100. Good luck, have fun...

 

[maby]

I'm going to look at it tomorrow I'm hopping it comes with a dingy, but then I'm a hopelss opptimissed!

I was watching one of the ghastly Storage Wars on T.V. and someone got a locker with a self inflating dingy, Looked very cool but I suspect will cost more that the boat.

I can keep the dingy at the yacht club.

I suspect that a good dinghy is worth almost as much as the boat, guv!

Fingers crossed!

 

[Eric79]

I went to see it today was not quiet as good condition as I had hoped.

There is a little bit of damage on the keel but a gel coat fix kit of £25 and some anti-foul paint for £35 should make it seaworthy already arranged for a friend to help me do it. The guy selling it is going to arrange transport for me so just need to get a mooring and of course do the repair and generally tidy the boat up. I would post the pics but for some reason its not working.

 

[Zagato]

Congrats keep us posted