A word of warning about filters!

Portofino said:
From my Sunseeker " shield " policy
Seaworthy:

The insured property is seaworthy if it is maintained and crewed in such a way as to be able to operate safely in the conditions which can reasonably be expected. If you are unable to maintain/ operate the insured property due to lack of knowledge, time or skill you must engage the services of somebody to do so on your behalf.
And
" We will not pay out " -
Damage to insured property caused or contributed to by not being maintained in accordance with the manufacturer’s recommendations and/or warranties

Check your policy Gary's right -opens up a " cop out "

Ps I use genuine parts from VP
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I would suggest Gary is incorrect 'Damage to insured property caused or contributed to by not being maintained in accordance with the manufacturer’s recommendations and/or warranties'. Filters which meet manufacturers specifications cannot be construed as not being maintained in accordance with manufacturers recommendations. Genuine parts only takes us into EC Horizontal Directive territory............

OEM branded filters is a bit of nonsense, CAT filters manufactured by Donaldson. Are we seriously saying that Cat engined Sunseeker with Donaldson filters would be uninsured?
 
volvopaul said:
Paul,

The fuel line.

Tank, pre filter to inlet side of lift pump, out of lift pump to two fine filters on engine , fine filter to injection pump which is Bosch inline .
Lift pump is roller cam from camshaft in injection pump, also has bolt on vertical hand primer.

Two fine filters are under pressure from lift pump when engine running.
Click to expand...

Bosch pump mounted lift pump is putting out around 17psi dependent on length of spring.
 
Latestarter1 said:
I would suggest Gary is incorrect 'Damage to insured property caused or contributed to by not being maintained in accordance with the manufacturer’s recommendations and/or warranties'. Filters which meet manufacturers specifications cannot be construed as not being maintained in accordance with manufacturers recommendations. Genuine parts only takes us into EC Horizontal Directive territory............

OEM branded filters is a bit of nonsense, CAT filters manufactured by Donaldson. Are we seriously saying that Cat engined Sunseeker with Donaldson filters would be uninsured?
Click to expand...

Well they could argue the case ,as I said opens up a " cop out " fight

If the claim is refuted at the first pass by drawing attention to deviating from using genuine parts ,then as long as you can show the underwriter ( Zurich) a recent letter from CAT endorsing AN OTHER filter like Donaldson as opposed a CAT part
,then you should be ok -I reckon .
But if it's fitted with CAT unendorsed AN OTHER part that seemingly failed and resulted in the claim
Then the policy holder may regrett fitting " knock off parts "

As I said my green lumps have genuine VP parts ( + invoices to show) -so no Nytol for me tonight - sweet dreams
 
Last edited:
Portofino is correct :)

Taken directly from page 6 of the Volvo Penta Sterndrive manual and I'd be very surprised not to find the same quote in all their manuals

Replacement Parts

Replacement parts for the sterndrive are subject to various
national safety requirements, for example the United States
Coast Guard Safety Regulations. Volvo Penta original spare
parts meet these specifications. Any type of damage which is
the result of using replacement parts that are not original
Volvo Penta spare parts for the product being serviced, will
not be covered under any warranty or guarantee provided by
Volvo Penta.
Click to expand...

Why risk it to save a couple of quid?
 
Sorry to hear of your frightening experience but glad to hear you managed back to safety. I will be watching this with interest as I have the same engines. I'm not sure what I would have done in the same situation other than panic a bit with diesel spraying around.
 
oGaryo said:
Portofino is correct :)

Taken directly from page 6 of the Volvo Penta Sterndrive manual and I'd be very surprised not to find the same quote in all their manuals



Why risk it to save a couple of quid?
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This argument is surely only relevant to warranty claims which could arise from use of non genuine parts when the Volvo is still under guarantee. I doubt if insurers could reject a claim because a non VP part was used as long as it was a matched filter although I accept your position that you'd rather have the piece of mind from having paid the extra few quid for the genuine parts. I've formulated my view from reading posts on this forum that I'm happy with non VP parts where the difference is more than a few quid. Do the VP loyal parts users also use VP oil?
 
Latestarter1 said:
Bosch pump mounted lift pump is putting out around 17psi dependent on length of spring.
Click to expand...

No way would 17 psi blow off a filter , unless there was little or no thread there in the first place. Otherwise , I cant see that happening. 17psi may be enough to unscrew them with engine vibrations etc but they would need to have been slack for this to happen so unlikely too.

There isnt any chance that the old seal was stuck to the filter head and a new filter with seal put on ie 2 seals fitted as this would cause a leak and eventually could cause the filter to unscrew ?
 
SEARANGER ANCASTER said:
No way would 17 psi blow off a filter , unless there was little or no thread there in the first place. Otherwise , I cant see that happening. 17psi may be enough to unscrew them with engine vibrations etc but they would need to have been slack for this to happen so unlikely too.

There isnt any chance that the old seal was stuck to the filter head and a new filter with seal put on ie 2 seals fitted as this would cause a leak and eventually could cause the filter to unscrew ?
Click to expand...

was the new filter seal lube`d up prior to fitting, sounds like badly fitted to me
 
Two things come to mind:
1) Fire risk, not mentioned since the original thread. Am I not right in saying that, unlike petrol, there is unlikely to be anything in the engine room that would ignite the diesel and cause a fire under these circumstances? Dont you need an actual flame to get diesel going?
2) Regarding insurance / warranty copouts, if you done the work yourself, unless you could demonstrate that you are a qualified mechanic, wouldn't that over ride any argument regarding using OEM filters or not?
 
PCUK & MrB, re the engines still running. There wasn't "no filters attached". One filter (same position - primary) on each engine detached itself. One filter (the secondary) on each engine was still there. The two are normally placed side by side on a manifold assembly. I assume (not an expert) that there was a sufficient amount of fuel finding it's way through the manifold to the second filter. Or maybe the second filter was full of fuel and would have eventually run out. I am not certain, but they did keep running. The s/b engine was still running about 30 mins after the event during the tow back to the marina. I berthed the boat using it.

Sailorman. I am not sure you refer to my incident as the filters being badly fitted by myself, or Volvopauls reference to a previous incident. I doubt if VP would install a filter badly, so I assume it must be me! For my part there is virtually no chance of faulty installation. My logic on that issue is that what's the chances of a being hamfisted enough to cock up two installs on two different engines, with the same make/model of filters, enough that the both blow off/fall off? A quick bit of arithmetic suggests I have fitted about 68 spin on filters over the past 16 years servicing my engines/generator and this is the first post installation problem I have ever come across. No doubt that's a small fraction of what a professional like Volvopaul would install, but I think I would like to think I would have got the hang of it by now.
 
asteven221 said:
PCUK & MrB, re the engines still running. There wasn't "no filters attached". One filter (same position - primary) on each engine detached itself. One filter (the secondary) on each engine was still there. The two are normally placed side by side on a manifold assembly. I assume (not an expert) that there was a sufficient amount of fuel finding it's way through the manifold to the second filter. Or maybe the second filter was full of fuel and would have eventually run out. I am not certain, but they did keep running. The s/b engine was still running about 30 mins after the event during the tow back to the marina. I berthed the boat using it.

Sailorman. I am not sure you refer to my incident as the filters being badly fitted by myself, or Volvopauls reference to a previous incident. I doubt if VP would install a filter badly, so I assume it must be me! For my part there is virtually no chance of faulty installation. My logic on that issue is that what's the chances of a being hamfisted enough to cock up two installs on two different engines, with the same make/model of filters, enough that the both blow off/fall off? A quick bit of arithmetic suggests I have fitted about 68 spin on filters over the past 16 years servicing my engines/generator and this is the first post installation problem I have ever come across. No doubt that's a small fraction of what a professional like Volvopaul would install, but I think I would like to think I would have got the hang of it by now.
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Lets be having some part numbers as , from reading all of the above , I have a theory that you have been supplied with suction filters instead of pressure filters. This would cause the core of the filter to collapse with no where for the fuel to go causing a back pressure which has blown the filters off. I would get the pressure on the lift pump checked though as still doubt 17 psi would blow off the filters ?? Just my theory.
 
asteven221, please don't think for one second i was implying this didn't happen, far from it, just honest curiosity to how they kept running with a break in the line.:o
 
Portofino said:
Well they could argue the case ,as I said opens up a " cop out " fight

If the claim is refuted at the first pass by drawing attention to deviating from using genuine parts ,then as long as you can show the underwriter ( Zurich) a recent letter from CAT endorsing AN OTHER filter like Donaldson as opposed a CAT part
,then you should be ok -I reckon .
But if it's fitted with CAT unendorsed AN OTHER part that seemingly failed and resulted in the claim
Then the policy holder may regrett fitting " knock off parts "

As I said my green lumps have genuine VP parts ( + invoices to show) -so no Nytol for me tonight - sweet dreams
Click to expand...

Seems like rampant thread drift to me caused by forum members suffering from years of VP brain washing.

We are NOT talking about 'knock off' parts we are talking about consumables from reputable suppliers meeting the correct OE specification.

Simply inventing scenarios for insurance cop out's due to use of non branded filters is a nonsense. Just think about it.... Volvo Penta D1 fitted with a Perkins Powerpart filter, label on the engine says manufactured by Perkins. Yanmar LP with a Toyota branded filter, Nanni with Kubota branded filter. Filter head on Volvo looks like standard Mann & Hummel filter head also used on many Deutz motors, VP and Deutz branded fuel filters both manufactured by Mann & Hummel, are we saying one cannot fit Deutz marine engine with Mann & Hummel VP branded fuel filter, calling it a 'knock off' part.

How about engines no longer in production, for example Ford Sabre 212, some fitted from new with Sabre branded CAV fuel filters, some with Ford Motorcraft branded CAV. CAV brand is now Delpi and Sabre branded fuel filters have not been around for years, sort that one out.
 
Along the lines of latestarters thread, in my previous boat, fitted with Merc diesel engines, marinised versions of the Isuzu engine used by General Motors, if you bought Mercruiser boed parts, these were Mahler fiters in a Merc box, cost £34 a pop. From the Vauxhall dealer they were under £5, exactly the same Mahler filter. The Merc box was thus retailing at £29!

Apologies for the Fred Rift.

However, none of this helps the OP, whom I feel very sorry for, and I hope can get to the bottom of this problem, and share with us.
 
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