A knife to hand at all times?

[Jonny A]

I always wear my Leatherman, and keep a seaman's knife within reach just inside the companionway.

I have learned from experience, one day you will really, really need a knife right away.

 

[Mark-1]

I always wear my Leatherman, and keep a seaman's knife within reach just inside the companionway.

I have learned from experience, one day you will really, really need a knife right away.

You could say that about a defribulator, or a pen, or pliers, or a handheld VHF, or a host of things. It's just totally impractical to carry everything you'll ever need in a hurry 24/7.

And when it comes to knives the galley is pretty accessible. For many of us the galley and back is quicker than fiddling with a lanyard.

 

[capnsensible]

So in those scenarios you'd use a knife...? Only thing I can think of would be to attack the duty engineer.

Cutting various stuff off the propellor. Needed to do that a few times. Oh and cutting a mooring line off a cleat where some nerk used locking turns and left the boat there for at least a year....

 

[capnsensible]

Add. I dont carry a personal knife,

 

[Dockhead]

Lots of interesting stories.

• I've never used a knife to cut a jammed rope. In fact, I can only think of a very few jams, all overrides that happened immediately after some manner of re-rigging. More inconvenience than emergency, and there are better ways of relieving an override than cutting an expensive line. I think maybe a halyard jam also, but the place it might have been cut to some advantage was well out of the reach, Better to work it loose.
• I've used a knife to cut a fishing rope off a prop or rudder, but having it in my pocket would not help. You're going swimming, so there is time and planning. I'm probably changing pants, for starters
• I've used a knife to cut thread and whipping twine (common), cable ties (common), lashing line (hot knife is more common), and many small tasks, but the common "thread" is that I was probably using other tools and it was not an emergency.

I raced dinghies (beach cats) for years, and I plain don't believe the inversion thing. I think you chances of calmly working the line loose are much better than cutting the right line. You need to remain calm. I suspect surfing, kayaking, and snorkeling, and being very relaxed in and underwater helps. I had a sheet around a foot once or twice and didn't really think it was a "thing." Mostly, if you are smart, you get clear of the boat before it goes over. Don't cling, and if it does go over with you in it, go down and away to get clear, before coming up. Same with a kayak.

I can sort of imagine a desperate situation where you might need to cut a line away, but have never experienced it myself -- so far.

Most situations can be resolved by putting another line onto a jammed one with a rolling hitch, winch it to take tension off the jammed part, then calmly undo it. Without destroying any ropes.

 

[Daydream believer]

It would not surprise me that the majority of personal penknives carried by forumites would struggle to open a letter, let alone cut a rope. I expect many have never seen a sharpening device & many would not hold an edge even if they had been properly sharpened.
The average straight bladed penknife will not cut a rope. It needs a serated edged knife. I do a lot of splicing for people & I use a pair of electricians scissors to cut ropes & cordage. If I want to cut 25mm mutiplait in one go I use a 35mm chisel & give it a sharp rap with a mallet over a block of wood

 

[dunedin]

…
I raced dinghies (beach cats) for years, and I plain don't believe the inversion thing. I think you chances of calmly working the line loose are much better than cutting the right line. You need to remain calm. I suspect surfing, kayaking, and snorkeling, and being very relaxed in and underwater helps. I had a sheet around a foot once or twice and didn't really think it was a "thing." Mostly, if you are smart, you get clear of the boat before it goes over. Don't cling, and if it does go over with you in it, go down and away to get clear, before coming up. Same with a kayak.

Modern twin wire skiffs and high speed cars are very different from old style dinghies which tended to have an air gap underneath.
A very experienced friend was caught out and so nearly died - only the very fast response of a nearby boat and a helicopter, plus a huge dose of luck, saved their life. Others have not been so fortunate in dinghy capsizes. Hence why they do carry knives as a class rule in many cases.

 

[dunedin]

100% agree with your logic, but a minor quibble about Pro sailors. The reason I carry a knife now (and some line and a spare shackle) is that I got roped into dinghy instructing at my dinghy club (due to lack of volunteers not due to talent or desire to instruct). A large range of kids dinghies with a variable maintenance attitude means that my knife/line/shackle do get used and I'd be surprised if pro instructors don't also carry some basics to do ad hoc jury rigs.

So if we count paid dinghy instructors as pros then I strongly suspect those pro sailors *do* carry multitools/knives and I bet the wrong tool for the job is frequently used. Mangled screwheads on someone else's boat is a small trade off for keeping a paid lesson going. (I have no direct experience of this.)

….

Haha. Actually I wasn’t thinking of dinghy instructors in the term “pro-sailors” (and indeed my son was most irked when I referred to his paid weekend work as “instructing” as he told me firmly it was race “coaching” and very different from instructing).
But yes club sailing instructing is a very important (usually volunteer not pro) role and will have a lot of boat maintenance challenges. But one also wanders with all the H&S and safeguarding rules these days, quite what they might make of an instructor carrying a knife when doing the paperwork !

 

[Sea Change]

Our new boat came with a diving knife and for want of a better place to store it, I've lashed it to the pedestal. It gets used for opening coconuts and cutting the heads off larger fish.

Previously I would keep my Leatherman just inside the companionway. I was more likely to want pliers than a knife. Handy for getting fish hooks out.

 

[BobnLesley]

Growing up on a farm, my having a penknife in my pocket is second nature, no doubt having been reinforced when I began climbing and later sailing. I still do, but I've finally got into the habit (actually, Lesley usually reminds me just in case) of transferring my penknife from pocket to checked-in bag whenever I'm at the airport; I got caught out when boarding a cruise ship mind; I hadn't considered it being an issue on one of those.
However, a couple of months ago when out with friends I turned my penknife out onto the table while looking for something in my over-filled pocket and one, a serving police officer, advised that my penknife was illegal/an offence to carry, as while the blade's no more than 2.5 - 3" long, it 'locks' in place and that apparently is a big no-no. During subsequent discussion I got the impression that as a mid-sixties white bloke no policeman was ever likely to do more than tell me that it was illegal and not to do it again, but it is technically an offence to have a lock knife of any size about your person in public.

 

[Mark-1]

Haha. Actually I wasn’t thinking of dinghy instructors in the term “pro-sailors” (and indeed my son was most irked when I referred to his paid weekend work as “instructing” as he told me firmly it was race “coaching” and very different from instructing).

The big difference is Race Coaches don't help you with ratios which is critical to a Club trying to use RYA quals as framework for Junior activities.

 

[dunedin]

Growing up on a farm, my having a penknife in my pocket is second nature, no doubt having been reinforced when I began climbing and later sailing. I still do, but I've finally got into the habit (actually, Lesley usually reminds me just in case) of transferring my penknife from pocket to checked-in bag whenever I'm at the airport; I got caught out when boarding a cruise ship mind; I hadn't considered it being an issue on one of those.
However, a couple of months ago when out with friends I turned my penknife out onto the table while looking for something in my over-filled pocket and one, a serving police officer, advised that my penknife was illegal/an offence to carry, as while the blade's no more than 2.5 - 3" long, it 'locks' in place and that apparently is a big no-no. During subsequent discussion I got the impression that as a mid-sixties white bloke no policeman was ever likely to do more than tell me that it was illegal and not to do it again, but it is technically an offence to have a lock knife of any size about your person in public.

For somebody who says he carries a knife in his pocket every day, it is quite frankly staggering to hear you suggest you didnt know it was an offence to carry a blade that locks as been the law for ages. And often discussed on here.
Yes you may be less likely to be searched, but you risk a criminal record. Not worth it.
As noted, huge numbers of us live lives without needing a penknife in our pocket. I use a knife at least three times a day, but I get it from the cutlery drawer each time. Ditto if I need a tool I get from the tool drawer or box.

 

[Alicatt]

Our new boat came with a diving knife and for want of a better place to store it, I've lashed it to the pedestal. It gets used for opening coconuts and cutting the heads off larger fish.

Previously I would keep my Leatherman just inside the companionway. I was more likely to want pliers than a knife. Handy for getting fish hooks out.

I thought about a leatherman type tool but it is too fiddly and takes too long to open when you get caught up on a bollard in a canal. It does not happen often but it does happen, watching the bollard rise above you as you are going down is slightly alarming, we don't hitch fast to the bollards, just looped around them so we can pay out some slack until the bollard comes to it's senses and obeys the law of gravity. There are many different systems of being fast to the side of the canal lock here in Belgium, each one is different, some are bollards up top, some have bollards going down the side of the lock, big ones and little ones for freight and pleasure boats, some are just a fixed rod that you loop around and others are the floating bollards, then there is the speed they fill or empty the lock, you can ask for a slower fill but you don't always get it.
You have seconds to fix a hung up line, it's not really the time to fiddle with the likes of a multitool.

It's a Nor Mark 3" folding lock knife I keep in an old multitool pouch on my life jacket, the multitool has been replaced by the knife that I use, and before that it was the bread knife.

The Leon Paul, Wilkinson, and Solingen swords I keep under lock and key. Yes I fence and shoot arrows from a bow - not necessarily at the same time

 

[ylop]

During subsequent discussion I got the impression that as a mid-sixties white bloke no policeman was ever likely to do more than tell me that it was illegal and not to do it again, but it is technically an offence to have a lock knife of any size about your person in public.

It's not a problem right up until the moment it's a problem and then it becomes a big problem. Yes, your demographic advantage does mean you are less likely to get challenged and maybe even get away with confiscation rather than prosecution. But that's about officer discretion - get one who takes a dislike to you, doesn't want to reinforce the stereotype, who is looking to make an impression with "management" or who thinks that a few hours in the warm dry police station processing you is good option and your luck might run out. Once it's reported to the prosecutor, I can't imagine any discretion applying in the current culture.

There are cases where people who habitually carry a knife for "practical" purposes have fallen foul of the law. One of the ways to walk into that "mess" is to have it in your pocket when you turn up at court as a witness / jury duty etc. airport style security is now common.

 

[ylop]

For somebody who says he carries a knife in his pocket every day, it is quite frankly staggering to hear you suggest you didnt know it was an offence to carry a blade that locks as been the law for ages. And often discussed on here.

Even more staggering that he only discovered this a couple of months ago when out with friends yet took part in this thread over a year ago: Yachtsmen Carrying Knives (UK)

Don't underestimate the willingness of a police officer or prosecutor with a point to prove to dig through your past to undermine your "I didn't know the law" mitigation. Especially if your argument is tied into "well I'm white, male and middle class, so not a threat"...

 

[RunAgroundHard]

In the Oil and Gas Industry, UK and some other regions, knives are banned because of the high incidence of hand and finger injuries due to misuse or a knife being the incorrect tool for the job. Contractors that require knives such as catering companies obviously are allowed them, but must use the correct knife for the activity and wear the appropriate hand and finger protection. Other trades are expected to have the correct tool for the job e.g. cable strippers. It was common to see deck hands with knives, but that too has gone in some regions. There was a big fuss and all sorts of reasons and scenario's postulated when industry knife bans were introduced, but like seatbelts and motor cycle helmets, most have got used to it and its a none issue in reality. In my earlier post, I don't think my safety knifes have ever been used.

As far as I can recall, a figure of eight in a spinnaker sheet that had to be dumped, was cause for a knife (late 70's) and a lot of old rope around my anchor on recovery (80's), which was still connected to the seabed. Other than that, I can't recall needing one.

 

[capnsensible]

I can sort of imagine a desperate situation where you might need to cut a line away, but have never experienced it myself -- so far.

Most situations can be resolved by putting another line onto a jammed one with a rolling hitch, winch it to take tension off the jammed part, then calmly undo it. Without destroying any ropes.

Consider fishermen's pot lines around your prop. As well as lines, there are those 'builders bags' that blow out to sea and lurk semi submerged.

 

[john_morris_uk]

I was answering someone who said he’d been forced to use a knife because he had forgotten to unlash the tiller.

I’m still waiting for a list of the scenarios where having a knife instantly to hand is necessary. (to the point of keeping one by the mast, one by the helm and one in the companion way) As I said before, in 50 years of sailing, I can’t remember any such incident occurring. Have I been extraordinarily lucky?

 

[john_morris_uk]

Consider fishermen's pot lines around your prop. As well as lines, there are those 'builders bags' that blow out to sea and lurk semi submerged.

That’s perfectly true, but in these scenarios I nip down to the galley and get the bread knife and start taping it to the end of the boat hook. I’m not convinced that the few seconds saved by having a knife by the helm is doing me any favours.

 

[Roberto]

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