90/180 and the Covid Certificate.

[syvictoria]

Again I’ll tell you that innocent people are of NO interest to the ’Authorities’.

Except commercially, when they decide to sell your data!

 

[nortada]

The difference between us is largely perspective. There has never been any directives for anyone here in Sweden.

BB Spot on and our perspective is largely a result of our experiences.

Yours is based on Sweden, mine is based on Portugal and syv, EU/UK.

I speak only from experience in Portugal where surveillance as strictly controlled by law.

Rather than widespread concerns, about QR-coding, apart from you, I have yet to hear any adverse comments expressed.

Whatever, like it or not, it is here to stay.

 

[dslittle]

Except commercially, when they decide to sell your data!

Ahhh that is a whole new can of worms to worry about - especially after you’ve had an ’accident’ which they want to help you with…

 

[nortada]

This is my last word on this. If you still do not get it and appreciate the danger that an implicit universal ankle bracelet produces then everyones freedom is at severe risk. You are using existant data bases as the boiling frog.

Appreciate this was your last word but please translate your last sentence. ‘the boiling frog’

 

[dslittle]

Appreciate this was your last word but please translate your last sentence. ‘the boiling frog’

He‘s relating to the ‘story’ often used to describe how gradual change will eventually result in a bigger change.
If you put a frog into boiling water it will jump out, but if you put a frog in warm water and then bring it to the boil it will (apparently) just lay back and relax until it is boiled to death.
I’ve never tried it but I’m not sure that it would work - and anyway, who wants to boil a frog???

 

[nortada]

In the above scenario, the mobile phone in your pocket would I suspect provide far more information than a QR cide on a piece of paper or in an app! Do you carry a phone? If so, I'm afraid that you are already traceable almost all of the time.

Ref phone. Having just arrived in the UK, we are still in the 10 day quarantine and receiving a daily phone call from NHS T&T.

A call to a mobile phone - what does this prove If GPS is involved, then our location is continuously known. If you do not reply, a knock on the front door soon arrives.

Who needs QR-coding to track you when your phone has got you banged to rights

 

[nortada]

Seems I've stumbled into the paranoia thread !

Perhaps the best answer for those concerned about big brother is don't use a mobile phone, or only turn it on briefly when you make a phone call

Nah, a novelty on these forums, an interesting discussion, expressing differing opinions in a courteous manner

Will it catch on Doubt it

 

[syvictoria]

Ref phone. Having just arrived in the UK, we are still in the 10 day quarantine and receiving a daily phone call from NHS T&T.

A call to a mobile phone - what does this prove If GPS is involved, then our location is continuously known. If you do not reply, a knock on the front door soon arrives.

Who needs QR-coding to track you when your phone has got you banged to rights

It's the cellular data/regular pings to the network operator's masts that give the location away (to those who have access to such data). GPS, etc. need not be enabled.

 

[st599]

A call to a mobile phone - what does this prove If GPS is involved, then our location is continuously known.

If you've got a mobile phone, it's position is continually known anyway, without GPS. They know it's signal strength at a number of cell towers and can interpolate position to within 100m or so. Test and trace know you're answering so you are with the phone. They already knew where the phone was.

As for the QR codes - the EU one has a published spec. and a published data format. The data you need to see is embedded in the QR code, along with the issuing authority. It needs to get the issuing authorities public decryption key to see the data (which proves it was for example Portugal's health ministry). If the data comes out gobbledegook, it's not genuine.

As of next year, ETIAS will require you to pre-register all details before travelling to the EU and the Schengen database will track entry and exit (it may even track location during as many hotels, marinas, campsites etc. already take your passport details to give to the local police - not too hard for that to be integrated)

 

[syvictoria]

Test and trace know you're answering so you are with the phone. They already knew where the phone was.

Genuine question. Do T&T really have access to phone location data?

 

[nortada]

Genuine question. Do T&T really have access to phone location data?

Good question, don’t know but suspect they do. If not at at grass-root level, higher up the food chain.

When you get the daily scripted call one question is, “Are you at the location stated in your PLT?” Is this a trick question?

 

[AndersG]

Genuine question. Do T&T really have access to phone location data?

I very much doubt it. The network operators don't give out any info about their customers unless they are legally required to do so.

 

[syvictoria]

I very much doubt it. The network operators don't give out any info about their customers unless they are legally required to do so.

I agree. The data protection issues would be immense given the access required and the number of staff at T&T who would need access to it.

 

[Beneteau381]

Ref phone. Having just arrived in the UK, we are still in the 10 day quarantine and receiving a daily phone call from NHS T&T.

A call to a mobile phone - what does this prove If GPS is involved, then our location is continuously known. If you do not reply, a knock on the front door soon arrives.

Who needs QR-coding to track you when your phone has got you banged to rights

Weve just had two emails only, no calls, no visits

 

[RMW124]

I don't feel that the Covid Passport really presents a new or greatly increased threat, no. As you've demonstrated above, the authorities already have more than enough tools in their arsenal to know what we're doing and where we've been.

What specific additional information do you believe the use of a Covid Passport will generate/record above, for example, the current Track & Trace app?

As an aside, I read the other day that the EU are considering a ban (temporary at least) on the use of facial recognition in public areas. This I wholly support.

It will allow them to criminalise, locate you and arrest, you if at some time in the future you decide that you are unwilling to allow an experimental medicine to be injected into you.

 

[nortada]

It will allow them to criminalise, locate you and arrest, you if at some time in the future you decide that you are unwilling to allow an experimental medicine to be injected into you.

Welcome to this forum and an interesting point of view.

I do not subscribe to your supposition and fail to see how a Covid Passport could lead to a greater risk of being criminalised, located and arrested.

The way things are heading, lack of a Covid Passport could impede travel and limit access to certain venues.

The tone of your message suggests to me that, of choice, you have yet to be vaccinated but I could easily be wrong.

 

[BurnitBlue]

It will allow them to criminalise, locate you and arrest, you if at some time in the future you decide that you are unwilling to allow an experimental medicine to be injected into you.

It will be much worse than that. Without a Covid Certificate you may not be allowed to set sail out of the marina to protect the shellfish. Remember Tributanyltin and reflect that some people on this planet consider shellfish and seahorses to be more important than a man in a boat

 

[nortada]

It will be much worse than that. Without a Covid Certificate you may not be allowed to set sail out of the marina to protect the shellfish. Remember Tributanyltin and reflect that some people on this planet consider shellfish and seahorses to be more important than a man in a boat

You post with great conviction.

At present we have EU Digital Covid Certificates and although we are advised that our vaccinations are recorded in our NHS records, we still await our NHS Covid Passports so it is going to be interesting to see if our EU Certificates will be accepted in the UK.

As a back up, we also carry our Covid vaccination cards issued by AstraZeneca.

 

[Graham376]

It will allow them to criminalise, locate you and arrest, you if at some time in the future you decide that you are unwilling to allow an experimental medicine to be injected into you.

The Covid "passport" is just another vaccination certificate, many of which have been required for decades for travel to various countries. The app can be removed from phones if you're unhappy and a paper copy used. Phones can already be tracked regardless of Covid so, why the paranoia?

 

[RMW124]

Maybe I am being paranoid, but i do expect that there will be booster doses of the vaccine, which it will become a criminal offence not to have. The app doesn't only track, it also records who you have contact with and when. I wasn't aware that a paper copy could be provided, thats interesting.
Are there other vaccine certificates that also monitor and contact people to ensure they are abiding by self isolation etc?