3rd Reef in Main?

[Babylon]

St Thomas, in his article on summer storms in this month's issue of YM, is adamant that every yacht should have a third set of reefing points for deep reefing in heavy weather.

We don't, although we're cutter rigged and the main is therefore already fairly small. My view (not having thus far experienced much extreme weather) is that should it come on to blow that hard, I'd roll away the heads'l completely, drop the main, and continue under just the hanked-on stays'l. If it got any worse, I'd hand the stays'l and hank the heavier, even smaller storm stays'l onto the same inner forestay.

But, should I still have the mainsail adapted for cringles on the luff and leach for a third reef?

What's your setup?

 

[Salty John]

By way of contrast, on Adriana we had a single reef in the main which halved its area. We had no headboard and no battens. We did have a storm trisail set on a separate track alongside the main track. This arrangement suited us well for three years cruising US eastern seaboard, Bahamas and Caribbean.

 

[Wansworth]

By way of contrast, on Adriana we had a single reef in the main which halved its area. We had no headboard and no battens. We did have a storm trisail set on a separate track alongside the main track. This arrangement suited us well for three years cruising US eastern seaboard, Bahamas and Caribbean.

HalRoth had a easy to use trysail as yours and he quite rightly said it was impossible to build a mainsail fro all ranges of wind.

 

[photodog]

I think for the average awb in inshore waters a third reef is absolutely needed.

We regularly use ours... ( but we do benefit from reefing early..). And I think many coastal awb sailors will press on with a unbalanced plan when a third well set reef would make the boat far more comfortable... Often the wind justifies it even in a Modest sea state....

Here is a good example of us making good comfortable progress under the third reef in almost flat conditions...

Feckit I can't get the link to photbucket to work... What is wrong with this site that half the markup
Is disabled?!???

 

[Gerry]

Cutter rig, three reefs in the main. Yes we use the third reef. In severe weather down to third reef and with part furled staysail have a wonderfully balanced sail plan that keeps us moving forward without too much canvas.

It's seen us through a number of storms, the worst of which ran for 5 days with winds peaking at something over 75 knots! The main did rip on the final blast of that storm but goodness only knows what speed winds we were getting at that point!

Bringing the centre of balance in at both ends of the boat to the mast works extremely well.Would thoroughly recommend the set up to anyone.

 

[kyleview]

I think for the average awb in inshore waters a third reef is absolutely needed.

We regularly use ours... ( but we do benefit from reeding early..). And I think many coastal awb sailors will press on with a unbalanced plan when a third well set reef would make the boat far more comfortable... Often the wind justifies it even in a
Modest sea state....

I fully agree with your comments. Our previous yacht did not have one and we really longed for it at times particularly in smooth water when reaching - really moving fast, but just overpowered at times. One particular sail in a westernly F6 from Skerries to Howth inside Lambay sticks in my mind after which we got the main altered to take the 3rd reef but never got round to "rigging" into the boom before selling.

Needles to say we selected it from the option list for our next/current boat. We do not use it a lot but when we do it makes for a very pleasant passage in stronger winds - I would not be without it!

 

[dunedin]

Depends on the boat - some boats are very under canvassed in light winds, so "full sail" is effectively the same as a faster boat's first reef.
But in our case our boat was transformed by adding the third reef. Use it regularly when the breeze is properly up and want to go to windward (often overtaking other AWBs who have given up and motoring upwind slower than us)

 

[chrisedwards]

Just realised that I have 42 reefing options in my junk rigged ketch. Blondie Hasler said there was nothing better for beating off a lee shore in a gale. Instant reefing and a perfectly set sail each time.

 

[Krusty]

St Thomas, in his article on summer storms in this month's issue of YM, is adamant that every yacht should have a third set of reefing points for deep reefing in heavy weather.

We don't, although we're cutter rigged ................ (not having thus far experienced much extreme weather) ..................I'd hand the stays'l and hank the heavier, even smaller storm stays'l onto the same inner forestay.

But, should I still have the mainsail adapted for cringles on the luff and leach for a third reef?

If you intend to leave coastal waters and safe refuges behind, I am sure you should. A Vancouver will almost certainly survive without it, but a third reef and small staysail is far more seaworthy, less stressful and faster.

I had a Pionier 10, modified to carry a small staysail made tough enough for heavy weather and always set unless broad-reaching or running. It was invaluable; she was notably faster than other boats in the vicinity and clearly sailing easier whenever a wild weather-front arrived.
(You might see my album, 2nd page)

 

[BobnLesley]

If you intend to leave coastal waters and safe refuges behind...

We have three reef-points in the mainsail, but only two can be accomodated in the through-boom single-line reefing system. So coastal sailing we have the first & second reef points rigged and if it looks like we might need the third (or indeed the second) we're unlikely to set out. But if we're heading for a long offshore passage, we permanently tie-in the first reef to the outhaul and reeve the single line reefing to points two and three; off the wind we rarely use a full mainsail anyway, indeed whenever possible we use only the headsails offshore.

 

[mainsail1]

My main has four reefs! Three is essential as you should not get rid of all your main in strong winds. In very strong winds you need four reefs and do not need to carry a trysail that takes up storage space for almost its entire life.

 

[Iain C]

I've just had new sails made for my Sabre. I also elected to have a 3rd reef put in as I did get caught out once on the old set up where I wanted less rag up. Can't remember how much it was...well under a hundred quid and a bit of a no-brainer really.

 

[Sandy]

St Thomas, in his article on summer storms in this month's issue of YM, is adamant that every yacht should have a third set of reefing points for deep reefing in heavy weather.

Well that is one point of view. I wonder what is research consisted of? Have there been a spate of boats sinking with only two reefing points in summer storms; the crew being picked up from their life rafts muttering, incoherently, if only we had a third reefing point?

I have two reefing points. No plans for a third on this or any other boat in the future.

 

[john_morris_uk]

My main has four reefs! Three is essential as you should not get rid of all your main in strong winds. In very strong winds you need four reefs and do not need to carry a trysail that takes up storage space for almost its entire life.

I believe that there are times when you might run off with only a storm jib set. I haven't heard ever of 4 reef main before. Usually three reefs and the option of a storm trysail is sufficient.

Well that is one point of view. I wonder what is research consisted of? Have there been a spate of boats sinking with only two reefing points in summer storms; the crew being picked up from their life rafts muttering, incoherently, if only we had a third reefing point?

I have two reefing points. No plans for a third on this or any other boat in the future.

It depends what sort of sailing you do. Most boats won't sail to windward in a bucketful of wind without either a storm trysail or a deep third reef. If you are confident that you will never need to make ground to windward in a gale then you don't need a third reef or storm trysail...

 

[prv]

We only had two on KS, with no real way of rigging a third even if the sail had had the cringles (square wooden boom with one pendant down each side). There were definitely times I would have liked to pull down a third, and she was certainly not an offshore ocean voyager.

Pete

 

[Krusty]

Well that is one point of view. I wonder what is research consisted of? Have there been a spate of boats sinking with only two reefing points in summer storms; the crew being picked up from their life rafts muttering, incoherently, if only we had a third reefing point?

I have two reefing points. No plans for a third on this or any other boat in the future.

The typical modern 2-reef mainsail seems to be intended for the typical "Cruiser-racer" with the cloth supple enough for good light- and strong-wind performance, but not really hard weather.
For the serious offshore/ocean sailor with operational simplicity in mind a two-reef mainsail with its second placed where the third usually is (the first mid-way between) is perhaps a good solution, in a cloth robust enough for seriously heavy weather. I doubt the existence of such a cloth also supple enough for a decent light-weather racing performance.

So for my money second time round (I wish!) it would be the two-reef sail above, plus the short-luff trysail I had on Piota, shaped so that it could be rigged on a mast broken above the hounds. It was sheeted to the aft mooring cleats with the boom-end lashed to the side-deck. In northern waters it was great. (Album, P3)

Horses for courses!

 

[capnsensible]

Have sailed too often with 3rd reef in to not feel that its very important.....

 

[oldbilbo]

There have been times when a fully-loaded StackPac was about as much sail as I wanted set....

 

[Sgeir]

When we ordered a new mainsail a few years ago, I took Webcraft's advice for us - three reefs and spectacles, both excellent suggestions. Only used the third reef once or twice but certainly seemed effective in heavy conditions. Well worth it, IMHO.

 

[Babylon]

When we ordered a new mainsail a few years ago, I took Webcraft's advice for us - three reefs and spectacles, both excellent suggestions. Only used the third reef once or twice but certainly seemed effective in heavy conditions. Well worth it, IMHO.

Aside from objects helpful to gradually deteriorating vision, what are spectacles?