2013 Bavaria 35 Sport HT

[P4Paul]

I had to make less than ten outputs with winds of 15 knots and less waves less than 1 meter.

And while I feel for you and hope you find an answer to the position you find yourself in, I struggle to comprehend that 10 trips in calm waters result in the outcome shown in the photos.

My view means nothing. The dealer's opinion is irrelevant as it is just an unqualified opinion. Without being rude, the survey you commissioned is a report based on getting the result you want.
Bavaria are not commenting until they can start taking the boat apart and see what the real issues are.
Somewhere there appears to be another survey but I am not sure you have shared any information from that one, if you have, then it hasn't been made clear.
There is a question about the timing between build and handover and now I think you suggest that the dealer used the boat as much as you did.

You are absolutely right, this shouldn't happen to a boat of this sort in normal use. You have a very unique issue which doesn't appear to have happened to any of the other 100's of same, hull, deck and hull mouldings.

It is Bavaria you need to be having a constructive conversation with, but based on the above, I personally think they are doing the right thing by offering to return the boat to the factory, carry out a full repair, fully warrant the outcome and return the boat to you in time for the 2016 season.

Once the boat is returned following repair, you then will have all the information required to make a partial or full refund claim.

I hope you get a satisfactory solution without being too costly. Let us know the outcome when the time is right.

 

[P4Paul]

Doan, thanks for explaining the above, it fills in the gaps and starts to offer a fuller picture to us all.

I can feel your frustration coming through in your post and therefore it is time for me to leave the debate and keep my opinions to myself.

I genuinely hope you find an acceptable resolution and quickly end up with a boat, either this one or another, you can finally relax on and enjoy.

Please come back and let us know the outcome.

Best wishes for 2016.

 

[lionelz]

Well I have followed this one and I have seen what a lot of you are saying I am going to take DOAN at his word. It all well and good saying that he should do this and that, I am fairly sure that if it was you you would be demanding your money back! It is very easy to make a statement when you are not emotionally involved. IMO opinion (I'm not a lawyer) In this country he is entitled to reject the goods as they are not fit for the purpose for which they are sold. The sales of goods act supports this. He has been sold a boat that as far as can be ascertained is not safe to take to sea in the conditions it was stated it could. He can therefore reject the goods and demand his money back. Most items that are that expensive come with a manufacturer's Guarantee so Barvaria would be responsible if this is the case. Now is this routes the best course of action, possibly not, but he has spent a load of money and by the sounds of it has been delivered a bag of crap, Now of course we have only heard doans side of the story and there are always 2 sides. there may be more than meets the eye. but either way I would not want to keep that boat.

 

[Whitelighter]

You are quite correct, but the issue is you reject to the dealer, not the builder as that is who your contract is with.

Even in this country, if the dealer goes bust the manufacturer does not legally pickup that responsibility.
Of course a manufacturer may wish to assist in such a situation, as Bavaria are here.

But you could not reject the boat to Bavaria, only the supplying dealer as that is who your contract is with

 

[BruceK]

DOAN, I think if you had told the whole story right from the start you may well have got a different reception and less speculation. That is nasty, and you have my sympathies and best wishes. I too would be trying to offload that boat back up the chain to whomever I could for a full refund. Whether you are in a position to do so, or legally entitled, I don't know, but I do wish you the best of luck in getting your money back.

 

[Whitelighter]

I too wish you luck - I think you are going to need it but I hope you get the result you want some how

 

[rafiki_]

DOAN many thanks for your explanation. It is clear from your post that the boat had many defects at delivery, and while Bav has responded well, you have discover further problems as you have looked deeper into the boat. I agree that Bav should take this boat off your hands and i expect that they will offer you a like for like replacement. I think you will have to fight quite hard to get a refund, but I would be doing the same in your position. You can have little faith in their product. You will note that there are several Bav owners, both mobo and sail on these forums, and generally they are very happy with their boats. I think you will find the same for pretty much all boat builders, mainly very happy customers, but with 1 or 2 horror stories. I love my Azimut, but you don't have to look too hard to find some disappointed buyers.
Anyway, very best of luck with your claim, and please keep us posted on progress. There are members of this forum who know far more about the legal process than I do, but this is a quiet time of year for posting, as some are away enjoying their boats, but will probably see your post next week, and may have some constructive advice to offer.

 

[Colvic Watson]

Thanks for the update Doan, I think a few on YBW owe you an apology for assuming you wrecked your boat. Even the best boat builders can make a mistake and something really bad has happened in Bavaria's quality control of this yacht. They should take it off your hands but don't hold your breath for that.

 

[lionelz]

You are quite correct, but the issue is you reject to the dealer, not the builder as that is who your contract is with.

Even in this country, if the dealer goes bust the manufacturer does not legally pickup that responsibility.
Of course a manufacturer may wish to assist in such a situation, as Bavaria are here.

But you could not reject the boat to Bavaria, only the supplying dealer as that is who your contract is with

I think the big issue is the dealer has gone bust because of course the dealer or supplier of the goods would send the item back up the chain. I just hope that do an can get some sort of resolution that will satisfy him

 

[P4Paul]

I think the big issue is the dealer has gone bust because of course the dealer or supplier of the goods would send the item back up the chain. I just hope that do an can get some sort of resolution that will satisfy him

I think you need to re-read Doan's post #20

 

[lionelz]

I think you need to re-read Doan's post #20

Mixed messages then has it gone bust of not? Although not really my issue

 

[A_8]

Interesting how quiet this thread went all of a sudden. Anyways and probably not important anymore but the only conclusion I can draw is that the boat has been damaged during transport or handling, it does not take much to wreck a hull mishandling it out of the water and as I said before a good surveyor should be able to figure out where the offending forces have been applied which in turn will give you when and where the hull was damaged.

Another and similar experience of mine was with a well known Swedish builder that supplied a couple of years old boat with factory guarantee that after a month or so proved to have similar damage as this boat, maybe worse as it had a innerlining that had detached from maybe 66% of the hull. The boat was a mess, soft and wobbly with cracks all over.
It was a drawn out process that started with a demand for a complete refund but the builder offering a repair. The arguments where similar to yours.
The end result was a mixed deal, the builder was to repair the boat and then sell it at which point the unlucky original buyer would get his money back.
A bit risky but it worked out fine in this case and I would assume the "big deal" was that they had already banked the sale and going back on it was not an option so this way sort of made it work for the builder.

 

[BruceK]

DOAN has asked these to be put up with the words: I think that the cracks were present before the first launching.

I'll leave him to explain:

 

[Whitelighter]

Where should we be looking for the cracks

 

[steve930]

The line where the control panel fascia meets the carcase ?? I'm confused

 

[BruceK]

PB downsizes photos, here is the original cropped to the relevant detail.

 

[Whitelighter]

I don't know about the wedges.

 

[Tranona]

I find the use of wedges in that location very odd. I assume they are used because the furniture is not square to the bulkhead. They look like they are machined specifically for the job rather than "bodge" pieces. However really cannot see a reason why the bulkhead and furniture should not be a perfect fit. My new Bavaria (built 6 weeks after this boat) is very precisely put together with consistent joints between different components.

What I find strange about this whole story is that the boat seems to have so many defects when it was made in a factory and using processes where consistent production is one of the main aims. I don't have enough experience of Bavaria powerboats, but one of the reasons for buying my Bavaria sailboat was the evidence of good design and construction compared with its main competitors.

 

[Nick_H]

What is your opinion about the wooden wedges?

I would imagine the fitters use wedges to hold the various panels in position during the build, prior to securing them properly with glue, screws etc. I guess they should gave removed them, but it's hardly a big issue. Why do you think they are evidence of a previous repair?

I thought your problems related to major issues with the hull, not small gaps in the cabinetry.

I'm also confused ...

 

[Sishoe]

My Bavaria Virtess seems pretty well screwed together, certainly no worse than my previous Gobbi or Sea Ray. I've noticed the chest of draws in the forward cabin has pulled away from the bulkhead its mounted to, although its still securely fixed (to whatever its fixed to) and no big deal.
I'd of thought most new production boats need a certain amount of breaking in once commissioned, where the fit out will settle. and possibly joinery will need to be adjusted.
If the problem is structural to the hull, would it not be normal to expect crazing to the gel coat? Otherwise is this simply a fit out issue?