10 years after my days of boating in the Adriatic, ...

[MapisM]

You are right. I did once see some frozen chicken nuggets in the Conad supermarket in Carloforte and they were a rare treat for me that evening

Can't remember now, didn't you ever join us in some CF dinner with our local friends? Shame on me if I didn't make it happen, sorry!
Trust me anyway, there are good reasons why neither myself nor S are exactly slim - and frozen chicken is not one of them!

 

[MapisM]

in my case, defeat was snatched from the jaws of victory

So sorry to hear that, P.
Eventually, we had a very few boats in our short list, which I would be VERY confident to recommend to anyone.
And a couple of them are amazing value btw (140k Eur ballpark) - but all are a bit larger than you wanted, IIRC - the smaller being a 52', and up to 60' with a 55' in between...
If you wish to have a look, even only out of curiosity, just ask.
All the very best anyway for your search!

 

[MapisM]

Does it have stabs? If not, will you install some and will they be hydraulic or electric ( like Barts)?

Nope P, no stabs. 13 years ago, they were unheard of, in P boats of this size.
There is an area in the e/r where a gyro could fit - and that would probably be my choice, on a boat of this type/size.
But we are thinking to start using her as is first. It's already an high enough expense for us, without adding further upgrades!
And I'm pretty sure after the seatrial that also at D speed she rolls a fair bit less, if compared to the old tub with her stabs turned off.
We'll see... What is difficult to understand in advance is how much we will miss stabs, after 16 years with them, no less...

PS: coming to think of it, back in 2000 I was the first among all boaters I knew, including here in the asylum IIRC, with a stabilized boat.
Now that stabs are becoming de rigueur, I might as well be the first to abandon them...

 

[MapisM]

Sheesh, MM buying a P boat. Think I need to go and lie down, then look for a Northern Marine

LOL, yeah, I see what you mean!
Otoh, if you would find a NM57 for sale at anywhere near the cost of a similar size P boat, gimme a shout and I'll happily loose the deposit on the DP...
There were several pros and cons for each boat that made it to our final short list (all P boats), but one thing is for sure: the reason why there were no D/SD boats was strictly budget-driven.
If the prices of used D/SD boats weren't as ridiculous as they are (or in other words if the prices of used P boats weren't as low as they are), for me it would be a NM/Nordie/Fleming/GB/whatever - anytime.

 

[BartW]

....such a fine choice. I would anytime prefer your boat (or an SL,....) than any mainstream newbuild, irrespective of budget.

+1
perfectly fits in my category "character boats" ;-)
really nice find P, I'm impressed how you took your time to find your perfect fit.
During this process, I had some fear and doubts about certain models you came across , (...even a catamaran was mentioned at some point go figure )
but your search has come to such a fine conclusion eventually !
and I'm sure you gave her a very deep survey, much better than any surveyor can. Did you hire a surveyor apart the one for the engine ?
so also in that respect she must be close to perfect.
I'm sure you and S will enjoy her, even at planing speed every now and then

ones again many congratulations,

re you delivery trip, our planning is still not fixed, (will post more later)
but anyway we have to cross somewhere, so hopefully we can sail together or join for a while ...

I don't remember if you have ever been in Kotor bay,
but there is at least one good reason to come along PM, and that is for bunkering,
I will share some interesting places in south Dalmatia for you to visit, (but I guess you know most of them…)

Oh yes stab’s,
I’m curious from when you’re going to miss them, especially as you are so used to have them, and you have some long passages to do soon.
Why don’t you give a call to AC at CMC he might give you a very good deal on a pair of small fins , and for the installation I’ll be there to help for giving instructions ;-)

 

[stillwaters]

So sorry to hear that, P.
Eventually, we had a very few boats in our short list, which I would be VERY confident to recommend to anyone.
And a couple of them are amazing value btw (140k Eur ballpark) - but all are a bit larger than you wanted, IIRC - the smaller being a 52', and up to 60' with a 55' in between...
If you wish to have a look, even only out of curiosity, just ask.
All the very best anyway for your search!

Not wishing to tread on anyone else's toes, but I'd be interested to see what other boats passed your experienced eye. As you already know, I'm really looking for an SD, but much like yourself and despite being prepared to spend more than the budget you set, due to the lack of anything being out there at the moment, I may have to settle for a P boat that is also usable at D speeds for much of the time. I can well imagine that you succeeded in narrowing down some good ones - and wouldn't it be such a shame to waste all the hard work you've put in?:encouragement:

Exciting times ahead for you, I would imagine, P,

 

[MapisM]

Did you hire a surveyor apart the one for the engine ?

Nope B, after jfm and silverdee made a DIY job on the Aquastar, I had to take up the challenge!
Besides, having no less than the builder available to answer each and every question on the boat construction, and lending me also the moisture measurement kit, didn't leave a lot of room for big surprises...
Well, I hope so, anyway!

Why don’t you give a call to AC at CMC he might give you a very good deal on a pair of small fins

Naah, you know AC, he's only interested in much bigger stuff - as you surely remember, he considered even BA as a borderline boat size, even for their smaller equipment.
Though if I should consider fins, I would have zero doubts to go for electric, particularly in a retrofit.
Maybe I should look at that Humphree stuff... Not for this season anyway, that's for sure.

Ref. the trip plan, yep, all agreed, we also are still unsure about it.
But PM is definitely in my radar, and we'll have to meet somewhere anyway.
Very much looking fwd to that! :encouragement:

 

[MapisM]

I'd be interested to see what other boats passed your experienced eye
...
I may have to settle for a P boat that is also usable at D speeds for much of the time.

I'll email you in a minute.

But generally speaking, I don't think there's such thing as a P boat that is NOT usable at D speed.
Sure, some heavier ones, with a deeper V at the bow can be a tad better than others, but at the end of the day, you don't want to be out there with ANY P boat, whenever the sea FORCES you to slow down at D speed.
Otoh, when the sea ALLOWS you to slow down comfortably, just about every P boat is fine, imho.

 

[stillwaters]

I'll email you in a minute.

But generally speaking, I don't think there's such thing as a P boat that is NOT usable at D speed.
Sure, some heavier ones, with a deeper V at the bow can be a tad better than others, but at the end of the day, you don't want to be out there with ANY P boat, whenever the sea FORCES you to slow down at D speed.
Otoh, when the sea ALLOWS you to slow down comfortably, just about every P boat is fine, imho.

Thanks for sending that, I'll get back to you when I've had time to digest it.

Yes for sure, but for me it would still be great to be able to push through rougher stuff if the need arose, and as you say yourself, the best type for that is not an unstabilized P boat. However, with a distinct lack of SD boats out there, I am beginning to realise that maybe I will have to go the same route as yourself - only maybe with stabs for good measure, and as you say, perhaps Humphrees being worth a look.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

you don't want to be out there with ANY P boat, whenever the sea FORCES you to slow down at D speed.

Agreed although there are sea states where it is more comfortable for a P boat to speed up rather than remain at D speed, say in a following or beam sea, but in general you are right; if its that bad that you have to slow down in a P boat then you should have stayed in port that morning

 

[[2068]]

Agreed although there are sea states where it is more comfortable for a P boat to speed up rather than remain at D speed, say in a following or beam sea, but in general you are right; if its that bad that you have to slow down in a P boat then you should have stayed in port that morning

I'd have to agree with this.

Slowing down to "minimum planing speed" isn't an issue.
But being forced to slow down to 7/8 kts and having to retrieve bits of radar reflector and GPS antenna that were left dangling on wires by green water going straight over the top of the radar arch just isn't fun, and boating is supposed to be fun.

 

[BartW]

Nope B, after jfm and silverdee made a DIY job on the Aquastar, I had to take up the challenge!
Besides, having no less than the builder available to answer each and every question on the boat construction, and lending me also the moisture measurement kit, didn't leave a lot of room for big surprises...
Well, I hope so, anyway!


Naah, you know AC, he's only interested in much bigger stuff - as you surely remember, he considered even BA as a borderline boat size, even for their smaller equipment.
Though if I should consider fins, I would have zero doubts to go for electric, particularly in a retrofit.
Maybe I should look at that Humphree stuff... Not for this season anyway, that's for sure.

Ref. the trip plan, yep, all agreed, we also are still unsure about it.
But PM is definitely in my radar, and we'll have to meet somewhere anyway.
Very much looking fwd to that! :encouragement:

re survey,
that moisture meter, did it give you any valuable or usefull info,
iirc my surveyor at the time (G Ciriaci) did such a measurement but according him such a measurement wasn't very usefull.

re stabs,
just FYI, CMC has one model of drive smaller than mine, (mine is 3.5kw and they also have a 2Kw iirc) and on their website they claim to have systems from 60ft up.
some time ago (1.5y) AC told me that they were looking in to the market for smaller boats,
anyway, if you consider stabs I would give him call, not only because he's Italian but mainly because I'm so pleased with their product, and they have a well proven track record.
Re Humphree, when I spoke with a guy on their booth at messe last january, they were not really convincing about their references, and still none found on their website (despite the fact that they have changed their design to another gear and motor with much less noice, similar technology like the one from CMC).
I raised some eyebrows when he mentioned about a stab system installed in a catamaran ???

re our plans for this summer,
we still have the plan to go to that yard in Monopoly remember, (end of may, beginning june, dates tbc)
and than start our summer holliday first week of july, starting from there and sailing to Sicily,
I'll mail you some dates later, that are fixed (guests comming, etc ... )

 

[BartW]

...... if its that bad that you have to slow down in a P boat then you should have stayed in port that morning

Mike,
when you have stabilisers the sea state can be A LOT worse while still enjoy comforteable cruising.
I'm not only speaking about strong wind, but big swell in general, sometimes on a perfectly Sunny day fe "after" a thunderstorm, or far away from the bad weather.
If we didn't have stabs, we would have never been able to do some of the long trajects or busy summers as we did (at least not in a comforteable way)
and that would have spoiled a lot of our own planning and arrangements with guests...

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

Mike,
when you have stabilisers the sea state can be A LOT worse while still enjoy comforteable cruising.

Yup fair comment. Dont worry I'm getting there

 

[MapisM]

re survey,
that moisture meter, did it give you any valuable or usefull info,
iirc my surveyor at the time (G Ciriaci) did such a measurement but according him such a measurement wasn't very usefull.

Well, what did he use then?
I mean, I agree that for widespread osmosis and also blistering, you don't need a lot of instruments: in the worst cases, you can find it visually, sometimes without even scrapping the antifoul to bare gelcoat in the most critical spots along the hull, which is normal practice anyway.
But afaik, a moisture meter is the only thing that can highlight potential future problems that might develop over time (also in wooden boats, btw).
And fwiw, I found the readings pretty consistent: hull and superstructure dry as a bone in general, with only a few spots in which higher readings were expected (for reasons irrelevant in this context, and not worrying at all), that were clearly identified by the instrument.

I wasn't aware that CMC now build an equipment smaller than yours, that's interesting. Not for this year anyway, neither time nor budget allow that!
Haha, it would be interesting to tell AC that at Humphree they suggest their fins also for cats. I bet he would ROTLF, rather than just raise his eyebrows...

All good ref summer plans, we'll keep in touch! :encouragement:

 

[BartW]

these pics are on my Phone for while,
but I didn't want to post them not to interfere with MapisM boat search,

anyway, another good reason to pass along Porto Montengro, is to have a look at Spellbound,
who is resident here from a year ago.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

anyway, another good reason to pass along Porto Montengro, is to have a look at Spellbound,
who is resident here from a year ago.

Looks like a proper boat. Is that a Northern Marine?

 

[stillwaters]

Looks like a proper boat. Is that a Northern Marine?

Yep, 2007 84ft Northern Marine as shown on youtube when for sale a few years back. If I wasn't such a lazy b*****d on Sundays I'd post the link - I imagine 'Motor Yacht Spellbound' will find it though.

 

[MapisM]

another good reason to pass along Porto Montengro, is to have a look at Spellbound

Whoa! For me, that's actually a reason for NOT passing in PM, sort of.
During a trip to the PNW, I had a chance to see a NM 57 and also a 64 in Anacortes - both great vessels indeed, but way outside my budget.
I can't even start thinking what sort of proper small ship the 84 can be... Have you been onboard?

 

[TwoHooter]

(no custard needed btw...)

Well that's just favouritism.

Custard is unheard of down here

Excuses, excuses. All we ever get is excuses, never custard.
https://www.britishcornershop.co.uk/birds-custard-powder-original


(Great boat BTW)