You Favorite Mis-Used Naultical Jargon

[JumbleDuck]

What about plane sailing vs plain sailing?

Don't forget sailplaning, sail planning and plan selling.

 

[Concerto]

Not mis-used, but multiple use. Port can be a harbour, the "left side" of a ship and a nice tipple after sailing.

 

[Skylark]

What about plane sailing vs plain sailing?

I don’t think that I’ve seen a reference to plane sailing on these forums before. It’s the simple use of trigonometry to derive either DR or CTS from last position. Simplified in Traverse Table, Norries.

Does plain sailing exist?

 

[Poignard]

I don’t think that I’ve seen a reference to plane sailing on these forums before. It’s the simple use of trigonometry to derive either DR or CTS from last position. Simplified in Traverse Table, Norries.

Does plain sailing exist?

I understood 'plain sail' to mean the normal working sails of a vessel, ie excluding studding-sails, moon-rakers, water-sails etc.

 

[Hydrozoan]

I understood 'plain sail' to mean the normal working sails of a vessel, ie excluding studding-sails, moon-rakers, water-sails etc.

That was my interpretation, and your ‘etc’ I think includes the charmingly-named drabblers - which I suppose derives from this meaning of ‘to drabble’: drabble | Origin and meaning of drabble by Online Etymology Dictionary

 

[Poignard]

That was my interpretation, and your ‘etc’ I think includes the charmingly-named drabblers - which I suppose derives from this meaning of ‘to drabble’: drabble | Origin and meaning of drabble by Online Etymology Dictionary

I never heard of that before. Thanks.

Thanks also for the link to that intriguing website.

 

[Hydrozoan]

I never heard of that before. Thanks.

Thanks also for the link to that intriguing website.

Pleasure - I guess drabblers are much the same ides as water sails, though perhaps in a different context or era, but the notion of 'drabbling' is rather nice. Perhaps somebody may tell us if there is a difference.

 

[Poignard]

Pleasure - I guess drabblers are much the same ides as water sails, though perhaps in a different context or era, but the notion of 'drabbling' is rather nice. Perhaps somebody may tell us if there is a difference.

Perhaps Dame Margaret Drabble could enlighten us.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

I don’t think that I’ve seen a reference to plane sailing on these forums before. It’s the simple use of trigonometry to derive either DR or CTS from last position. Simplified in Traverse Table, Norries.

Does plain sailing exist?

It's navigation under the assumption that the earth's surface is a plane, not the surface of a spheroid as it actually is. It works fine for small distances but fails over oceanic distances. The vast majority of our navigation is "plane sailing" unless we cross oceans. Its use as a metaphor for straightforward, easy progression is because it is easy to apply; as noted, simple plane constructions, Euclidean Geometry and plane trigonometry work perfectly well over short distances.

 

[st599]

I understood 'plain sail' to mean the normal working sails of a vessel, ie excluding studding-sails, moon-rakers, water-sails etc.

Nope, the term is plane sailing.

It's navigation under the assumption that the earth's surface is a plane, not the surface of a spheroid as it actually is. It works fine for small distances but fails over oceanic distances. The vast majority of our navigation is "plane sailing" unless we cross oceans. Its use as a metaphor for straightforward, easy progression is because it is easy to apply; as noted, simple plane constructions, Euclidean Geometry and plane trigonometry work perfectly well over short distances.

Yep, assuming that the earth is flat to simplify the maths.

 

[Poignard]

Nope, the term is plane sailing.

"Definition of plain sail


: the ordinary working canvas of a sailing ship usually including topgallant sails, royals, and a flying jib"

Definition of PLAIN SAIL

 

[Spuddy]

Thinwater....thanks fro the reminder about Newby and a Short Walk. I've got it plus quite a few others tucked away somewhere so their overdue for a re-read.
I'd always assumed that "Newby" was short for newboy and used by the public schoolboys

 

[JumbleDuck]

Nope, the term is plane sailing.

In the nautical sense it can be either "plain" or "plane":

In the figurative sense of "easy or uncomplicated progress" the OED lists "plane sailing" as "rare" and "plain sailing" as the common usage, cited back to the early 18th century.

 

[thinwater]

A fun example of capsizing that does not involve inversion, flooding, or a knockdown in the conventional meaning of the word.

AC75 Capsize

 

[Ohlin Karcher]

Also, knots can 'capsize', in fact a bowline can be capsized, that's the movement you make, to undo a tight bowline.

Just thought of another one, the 'bow' in bowsprit rhymes with COW, not slow.

Someone said the other day, that the line from the shanty, 'Drunken Sailor' which goes:
'Put him in bed with the captain's daughter' is not what you think, but refers to flogging, bed meaning sickbay bed, and the captain's daughter being the cat,

 

[Skylark]

It's navigation under the assumption that the earth's surface is a plane, not the surface of a spheroid as it actually is. It works fine for small distances but fails over oceanic distances. The vast majority of our navigation is "plane sailing" unless we cross oceans. Its use as a metaphor for straightforward, easy progression is because it is easy to apply; as noted, simple plane constructions, Euclidean Geometry and plane trigonometry work perfectly well over short distances.

How about the derivation of the word “departure” used as Long distance in Plane Sailing prior to conversion to dLong by Cos midLat?

I’ve read that Plane Sailing will probably give an acceptable DR with runs of up to around 600M. I guess this is also dependent upon the NS or EW element of the track.

I’m surprised that Plane Sailing methodology isn’t taught during any of the RYA navigation courses.

 

[LittleSister]

I was alluding to the erroneous application of Beaufort force numbers to gusts. The Beaufort scale relates to continuous winds. A gust of 35 knots does not amount to Gale Force 8.

You have that backwards a bit, I think. Originally the Beaufort scale was used to describe sea conditions, with wind speeds derived from that. Nowadays it is simply a list of wind speed ranges, so there is nothing at all wrong with saying "gusting force 8" - the word "gusting" implies that waves are not developed to original force 8 size. The Met Office recognizes this: when they say "gale force gusts" the wind actually has to be significantly stronger than F8.

I think it is you that is mistaken.

'In the early 19th century, naval officers made regular weather observations, but there was no standard scale and so they could be very subjective – one man's "stiff breeze" might be another's "soft breeze". Beaufort succeeded in standardising the scale.

The initial scale of thirteen classes (zero to twelve) did not reference wind speed numbers but related qualitative wind conditions to effects on the sails of a frigate, then the main ship of the Royal Navy, from "just sufficient to give steerage" to "that which no canvas sails could withstand".

. . . In 1916, to accommodate the growth of steam power, the descriptions were changed to how the sea, not the sails, behaved and extended to land observations.'
Beaufort scale - Wikipedia

'The Beaufort Scale is an empirical measure that relates wind speed to observed conditions at sea or on land. Its full name is the Beaufort wind force scale.

Below is a table showing the Beaufort Scale with speeds in knots, miles per hour and kilometers per hour. Please note that these are these are mean speeds, usually averaged over 10 minutes by convention, and do not capture the speed of wind gusts.'
Royal Meteorological Society

 

[Stemar]

I'm reminded of a French version that includes "dogs blown off their leashes" and, a couple of forces higher, "owners blown after their dogs"

 

[Old Bumbulum]

So, never heard the expression plane sailing before, but then their are so many word's routinely misused in the English language it would absolutely take to long too list them all, as I'm sure your aware.

 

[thinwater]

So, never heard the expression plane sailing before, but then their are so many word's routinely misused in the English language it would absolutely take to long too list them all, as I'm sure your aware.

... Which begs the question...


In other words, one day's misuse becomes another day's standard English, a never ending challenge bedeviling those who would try to nail down modern language and usage.

(Actually, I just like the cartoon.)