Why buy new?

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nicho

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Unless you are megarich and don't care, why buy a new boat? The moment you drive it away, you lose 20% evidently, and reports from various people I know that bought new last year, say their reliability problems are still ongoing, enjoying much attention from manufacturers engineers. One person in our marina has a top whack 50' boat, bought brand new four years ago, and still having problems. As he says, "never new again". I overheard a couple of manufacturers guys working (again) on a newish flybridge boat, complaining that the factory rush build to meet stage payment deadlines, and leave the problems for them to sort out post delivery.
Now, these days it Is not possible for us to spend on a new boat, (we had two new Sealines back in the 90's) so it's not going to affect us, but even if it was, I think I would go for something two years old, nicely kitted with all the extras, and save a bomb.
 
nicho said:
Unless you are megarich and don't care, why buy a new boat? The moment you drive it away, you lose 20% evidently, and reports from various people I know that bought new last year, say their reliability problems are still ongoing, enjoying much attention from manufacturers engineers. One person in our marina has a top whack 50' boat, bought brand new four years ago, and still having problems. As he says, "never new again". I overheard a couple of manufacturers guys working (again) on a newish flybridge boat, complaining that the factory rush build to meet stage payment deadlines, and leave the problems for them to sort out post delivery.
Now, these days it Is not possible for us to spend on a new boat, (we had two new Sealines back in the 90's) so it's not going to affect us, but even if it was, I think I would go for something two years old, nicely kitted with all the extras, and save a bomb.
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+1...most trouble I ever had was with the one new boat I bought.
But some people just like to have new, like they do with cars.......and just as well as we need them to buy our future second hand boats!!!
 
I totally agree. Unless money is really no object then I would really struggle to justify buying new. Having worked in various roles (brokerage, warranty, re-fit etc) I too would be looking at 2-3 years old. Although not always true most issues will manifest themselves in the first year and so the first owner has to deal with all these. The first owner will also have hopefully identified any issues or areas where the boat could be improved and will have added/adapted to improve/overcome them.

I can still remember having a conversation with an owner on the handover when he explained that he was "sick of having things to repair on his boat so that is why he bought new this time". I didn't have the heart to burst his illusions but suffice to say a few months down the line he saw the folly of this reasoning.
 
I've never had a new boat and would be reluctant to by one for the reasons stated above (unless it was a very nice one - I fell in love with a Fleming at the boat show yesterday). Although I did meet a guy who said he bought new as he wanted a loo that no-one else had used.
 
I suppose the main reasons would be:
- You've seen what you want, and it's not available used, or there is limited choice.
- The ability to specify equipment, furnishings, decor just the way you want it. Some things (e.g. Electronics) can be easily retrofitted. The woodwork in the galley, or the cabin layout, less so.
- Any bodges are your bodges, and not somebody else's.
- If you have half a million to blow on something that floats, why not?
 
PlanB said:
Although I did meet a guy who said he bought new as he wanted a loo that no-one else had used.
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Makes me wonder what that chap does when he must sleep in a hotel... I guess he carries around his own bucket! :rolleyes:
Not to mention that replacing the seat cover (or also the whole bowl for that matter) is neither rocket science nor very expensive.
 
I had a new boat back in 99. Stelican (of this parish) used to get a call every Monday morning with a list of list of things that had broken / fallen off over the weekend.

A well sorted 2/3 year old boat previously owned by someone really fussy would be my choice. And not one that's been unused for the past year.
 
We bought new as to be totally honest the deal we were offered ( Squadron 65) was compelling in the face of the second hand market. The market has now changed as discounts of this level are I believe no longer available, but there has been no material change in second hand values upward that i can see - so the hit will be large when you come to sell.

The premium in our case was small and the peace of mind hi.

The boat has had, and continues to have, issues. It is now owned by my ex wife so I am not day to day involved ( I do get the odd call!).

There was little you could directly attribute to Fairline other than squeaks and rattles and there was never anything that stopped it moving.

What went wrong was all sorts. Radar ( Garmin) Dishwasher ( fisher and pykle - flawed as it has closure sensors that on a moving boat go out of alignment). All LED strip light failed. Was a known issue. Cockpit fridge condensate stained the crew cabin ( this one was down to Fairline thinking about it!) many failures of the CAN bus type electrical control system. Chalking ( new "eco " material). LED pop up lights in the table ( they are £700 each!!!!). Under water lights. Cable Master.

Etc.

So for us it was a long list of things that kept going wrong. Some the manufacturer can be "blamed for" but most of it was from the standard marine parts bin , and was the "fault" of others. Eventually most things seem to find their mojo and there are less snags - and of course you just give up and accept it. So a large part of the issue for us was that the kit supplied by the established marine suppliers went wrong . ... which in our case was the heart of the issue - not Fairline. I also dont think they could be pinned for using that kit as Garmin Nav etc well regarded.

Interestingly ( staggeringly actually to be honest) my 2004 Squadron 58 had nil issues all summer ( Williams challenges aside ... but it never actually stopped, and a burst water maker membrane that was totally my fault ) whereas I know my Ex wifes boat continued to have challenges.

I would not buy new again unless the deal was such that it was in my favour. It will come around again remember!
 
FlowerPower said:
I suppose the main reasons would be:
- You've seen what you want, and it's not available used, or there is limited choice.
- The ability to specify equipment, furnishings, decor just the way you want it. Some things (e.g. Electronics) can be easily retrofitted. The woodwork in the galley, or the cabin layout, less so.
- Any bodges are your bodges, and not somebody else's.
- If you have half a million to blow on something that floats, why not?
Click to expand...

All that and
Part ex through certain dealers might make for attractive cost to change

Factory visits during the build process are great fun

Warranty and dealer support - new boats we’ve bought through Ancasta have been supported from warranty POV well beyond the first year

New boat smell, its really nice being the first owner, if that floats your boat - its a polarising subject as we’ve seen before in the forum but its mugs like me that feed the second hand market :)

Of course some folk will never buy new but that’s the beauty of it, isn’t it?
 
I simply cant afford what I want new and what I can afford new I dont want. So those people who do buy new, bless you all and for pity sake keep buying please. :encouragement::encouragement::encouragement:
 
I probably wouldn't buy a new large boat, although I would consider a smaller day boat.
the reason isn't the price (which seem to be getting crazy at what ever size) it is the increasing use of electronic technology to control things, leading in my own experience and as jrudge just described, an never ending stream of annoying cr@p.
I have seen other peoples brand new boats arrive and never gave a moments trouble, others have been a disaster from minor electrical issues to water pouring through the flybridge ceiling. It also seems that to some extent as a new buyer your boat is only as good as the delivery company/agent who these days have to fit the IPS drives etc to get the maximum road height down.
I was told by a sealine agent that Sealine don't fit the IPS drives at all in the factory which seems crazy to me.
 
FlowerPower said:
If you have half a million to blow on something that floats, why not?
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Absolutely, but that's the thing: aside from a few notorious Russians, Arabians, Bill Gates etc., anyone who doesn't live in the stratosphere has its own "blowable" amount - whether it's half a million or less/more, it doesn't really matter. Let's call it X.
Now, of course it has always been true that X can buy much more of a used rather than a new boat.

But in this decade, this difference went ballistic, because of the old law of supply and demand:
On one hand, boaters willing to sell had no other choice than lower the asking price accordingly.
Otoh, builders did all they could to reduce the production costs, quite often if not always at the expense of quality (at least for any "behind the scenes" components), but they only could do that up to a limit, for obvious reasons.

As a result, the new/used gap reached peaks never seen before, and even if this situation is gradually changing, if your X is half a million quid, that's already enough to fetch for instance an SL82, no less.
Now, the closer boat that you can buy new is the SL78, even if a bit smaller and arguably not as well built as her predecessor.
More modern she is of course, and I'm not arguing if our theoretical punter prefers her, but he/she must be willing to increase the blowable amount almost tenfold! :eek:
And if he/she is available to do that, why not consider a used 40m Benetti instead...? :rolleyes:
 
MapisM said:
And if he/she is available to do that, why not consider a used 40m Benetti instead...? :rolleyes:
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I would get lost in a 40m boat.
Any kind of berthing "oops" would probably result in removal of not just the pontoon, but some of the dockside as well.
And the maintenance costs of a 40m boat don't go down just because it is now older and worth less.
 
MapisM said:
Absolutely, but that's the thing: aside from a few notorious Russians, Arabians, Bill Gates etc., anyone who doesn't live in the stratosphere has its own "blowable" amount - whether it's half a million or less/more, it doesn't really matter. Let's call it X.
Now, of course it has always been true that X can buy much more of a used rather than a new boat.

But in this decade, this difference went ballistic, because of the old law of supply and demand:
On one hand, boaters willing to sell had no other choice than lower the asking price accordingly.
Otoh, builders did all they could to reduce the production costs, quite often if not always at the expense of quality (at least for any "behind the scenes" components), but they only could do that up to a limit, for obvious reasons.

As a result, the new/used gap reached peaks never seen before, and even if this situation is gradually changing, if your X is half a million quid, that's already enough to fetch for instance an SL82, no less.
Now, the closer boat that you can buy new is the SL78, even if a bit smaller and arguably not as well built as her predecessor.
More modern she is of course, and I'm not arguing if our theoretical punter prefers her, but he/she must be willing to increase the blowable amount almost tenfold! :eek:
And if he/she is available to do that, why not consider a used 40m Benetti instead...? :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

But that’s missing a pretty important point - isn’t it? I’m happy spending 500k on a new boat, or second hand for that matter but I cant afford to run an 80’ boat and those who can afford to run an 80’ boat probably don’t want last years model. So your supply/demand chart is going to vary dramatically depending on the cost to run. :rolleyes:
 
There are many factors from boat show fever to wanting a newly introduced model. For me it was the dealer package which included the trade in and finding us a berth. And yes a whole lot of boat show fever;)
 
I bought my first boat new, antares 36, sold after one year for almost the same price I bought it for (due to crash in the pound). Current boat is just over 18 months old (Prestige 500) and not really had an issue. Bought new for piece of mind and the fact I can spec what I wanted - seakeeper being just one of many extras I added. Only issues have been a small water leak on an engine and impeller went on the geny. Few minor gremlins from delivery (anchor cam had a poor connection).

Will look to upgrade again in around 3 or 4 years to around the 65 foot mark - or at least something less than 5.5m in width so can fit on a 18m x 5.5m mooring. Will I buy new? Probably as quite like the look of the Squadron 64 to be released next year, but also like the manhatten 66 and anything else that comes out in the next few years. Buying new gets me exactly what I want, admittedly for a premium.
 
nicho said:
Unless you are megarich and don't care, why buy a new boat? The moment you drive it away, you lose 20% evidently, and reports from various people I know that bought new last year, say their reliability problems are still ongoing, enjoying much attention from manufacturers engineers. One person in our marina has a top whack 50' boat, bought brand new four years ago, and still having problems. As he says, "never new again". I overheard a couple of manufacturers guys working (again) on a newish flybridge boat, complaining that the factory rush build to meet stage payment deadlines, and leave the problems for them to sort out post delivery.
Now, these days it Is not possible for us to spend on a new boat, (we had two new Sealines back in the 90's) so it's not going to affect us, but even if it was, I think I would go for something two years old, nicely kitted with all the extras, and save a bomb.
Click to expand...

I have had 13 motorboats, all secondhand, and for my next boat I had decided that I was going to treat myself to a new boat but after about a year of looking at new boats I have changed my mind and here's why. These comments apply only to my own situation and are my own opinion only. Firstly there is the price of new boats which over the past few years has way outstripped inflation. 10yrs ago the going rate for a UK made 65footer was £1m. Now it is £2m+. Can anyone explain this 'coz I can't. Then there is the fall in Sterling since the Brexit vote which makes European and US made boats 15% more expensive in Sterling terms. Secondly and this is where it all gets a bit subjective, I don't think modern boats are built as solidly or finished as well as boats built 10yrs ago. My suspicion is that faced with the 2008 financial crisis, boat builders looked to cut costs wherever they could and that mentality has carried on into the present day. Some builders are also building their hulls lighter and narrower in the beam and then fitting smaller engines, albeit more highly tuned to give the same power, to take advantage of that. And lastly some features that were standard on some manufacturers' boats in the past have been phased out. And then as the OP mentioned, depreciation on new boats is just plain silly but thats nothing new as its always been like that. And also, depending on the manufacturer or the dealer, there is always the chance that one or other goes belly up with your money

I'm not going to name manufacturer's names but, in my situation, what it comes down to is this. I have a 12yr old 63 footer which is very good condition and which we like very much. I could sell that and pay 3-4 times as much for a new 67 footer from the same manufacturer which is narrower in the beam and has V8 engines instead of the V12 engines in my existing boat, albeit the same power output and which lacks certain features fitted to my 63 footer. And then in a few years when I sell the new 67 footer, I can kiss goodbye to several hundred thousand quid. Why would I do that?

I'm not in any way criticising people who buy new boats. In fact I applaud them for doing so and keeping the industry going and many thousands of people in work and, of course, providing a steady supply of used boats for people like me;)
 
Mike

I ended up buying a boat which was a couple of years old. You do seem to get a lot more value for money on boats say, over 6-7 years old. How do you find the reliability / maintenance costs of your boat, as a relative newcomer to boating that's what put me off getting an "older" boat that may cost more in repairs etc.
 
I never understand these posts, you see them on car forums a lot too. I can't afford a brand new boat but if I could afford to do so comfortably at the size I want without affecting my finances over the long term, why on earth not?

Could I get a bigger boat for the same money? Maybe, but why would I want a bigger boat than the size I want? Could I get one cheaper secondhand? Almost certainly. I could have bought the shirt I'm wearing (or at least one a bit like it) cheaper if I'd gone to a charity shop and bought one second hand too, but I didn't.

Life shouldn't be about exiting this world with the biggest pile of cash possible (and if it is, buying a boat new or used is best avoided!)

Some people can afford new boats - good for them, the rest of us who need to buy used would be stuffed without them!
 
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