Who still uses paper charts as their primary navigation tool?

[Talulah]

As a follow up to the original question you could ask "Who uses a Road Atlas instead of paper charts?"

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

I
@Deleted User,
be warned though,
we all know that the electronic charts are not alway's up to date and not 100% accurate,

ones on a trip in Croatia there was a marina, but NO mention on the plotter,
(don't remember exactly, Sibenic area IIRC)

on another trip our track was over land , at least on the display,
(over island to be correct)

Yup, Bart, I'm well aware of that and it's not just in Croatia. I've found many anomalies on electronic charts, even brand new ones, in Med cruising areas. As I said in my post, whilst I now use the electronic plotter as my primary nav tool, I always consult paper charts before plotting a route and keep the paper charts open next to me when I'm helming the boat to cross check whether the hazards shown on the paper charts are depicted on the electronic charts. I still can't bring myself to rely completely on electronic charting and besides that, I like paper charts in the same way as I prefer newspapers and paper books to electronic versions

 

[old_salt]

I think it is still a BOT legal requirement to keep a hand written log both of "ship movements" and "engine movements" (That being the correct terms) which should include entires on a paper chart.
I think you would still be very vulnerable in court without an up to date hand written log as evidence.

 

[neale]

I plot on chart first then transfer to plotter and keep chart to hand. Always have charts on board. I enjoy the paper work to be honest.
L

+1

I think planning the cruise on a paper chart at home is a great part of boating, especially when you are planning to visit new ports or completely new areas.

 

[mbird]

We have the paper charts, and tend to plot the course on them first and then transfer waypoints to the plotters and write out a passage plan. Now having 2x C90W plotters though, it does seem a bit laborious doing the paperwork. I still like the idea of a bit of redundancy though, just incase!

 

[prv]

Paper is very much the primary for me. I have a small plotter, but it's portable and spends most of its time in a locker down below. I don't like navigating on it - it's too hard to see enough area without missing essential detail. I also like the ability to draw and plot and measure and sketch arbitrary lines on a chart, not necessarily according to any textbook method. Free chart corrections online vs buying a whole new cartridge for the plotter is a nice bonus too.

What works beautifully for my way of navigating is a Yeoman, which uses an NMEA feed from the GPS to let me instantly plot my position on the chart, or display range and bearing to any feature I put the puck over.

In theory it will even do dead-reckoning for you if there's no GPS signal, using speed and compass data either from NMEA or manually entered, together with manually-entered tide. Never tried that though, and the usefulness is limited for me because there's no speed and compass on my NMEA bus.

I built the Yeoman into my new chart table, with the blue mat invisible below a layer of sapele-faced varnished ply, so I guess it's staying on this boat. I would definitely buy another if I changed boat though.

The plotter is potentially useful once I go from navigation to pilotage, into an unfamiliar port. That's what I have it on board for.

This is at 4 or 5 knots on a small sailing boat, of course; at 20 knots with space and power (and cash!) to run a big plotter, my choices may well change.

Pete

 

[MapisM]

er...are you Francesco Schettino?

'course not. I'm pretty sure they had also paper charts on Concordia bridge.
...so, your point was?

 

[lufc71]

Your comment of '..life's too short..'.
I don't get that logic. It's a bit like saying 'I don't wear a seat belt...because life's too short..'.
Seriously though, have you considered what you would do if it went on the blink?

 

[MapisM]

Seriously though, have you considered what you would do if it went on the blink?

Yes I have. In any meaningful passage, I always keep a notebook running in parallel (totally separate from boat instruments) with its own GPS dongle and charts.
It's constantly kept fully charged while cruising, therefore even in the event of a catastrophic failure of the whole onboard electric system, I still could:
a) steer manually and fully control the engines, 'cause on my boat neither need electricity to work;
b) use the laptop for navigation, at least for 8 hours or so, which gives me plenty of time for a port of call. And even in the middle of a passage requiring more than 8 hours to reach the land, I could still use compass navigation (since I have both an electronic and a magnetic compass), hibernate the notebook, and turn it on just every X hours for the odd check.
Not to mention that nowadays chances are that all people onboard have a GPS in their mobiles.

And complicated as it might seem, it actually takes me just a couple of minutes to setup the notebook - surely much less than plotting anything on paper (hence the life's too short comment).
Anyway, in practice, I never had to rely on that backup, but I accept that it might happen...
...though I actually think that you have higher chances of seeing your paper chart blown overboard by a wind gust.
And if THAT happens, have you considered what YOU would do?

 

[macnorton]

Paper first plotter second-or plotter not at all (always afraid the thing will throw the towel in)

Ditto, I have known the GPS to be wrong and had I not ignored it I would have run aground, the boat following me also had the same problem with a different GPS system but he (as a novice) followed me and was ok, if a bit confused.
But this was in the Wash where being 20ft out really matters!

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

What works beautifully for my way of navigating is a Yeoman, which uses an NMEA feed from the GPS to let me instantly plot my position on the chart, or display range and bearing to any feature I put the puck over.

Blimey, I didn't think those were still around. Excellent piece of kit but I assumed they'd all been replaced by electronic plotters these days

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

steer manually and fully control the engines, 'cause on my boat neither need electricity to work;

I used to think that until one day a few years ago, one of my engines stopped. I found out later that the alternator was malfunctioning and was discharging the batteries connected to it. On many engines, the stop solenoid is positively energised to stay in the open position (in fact I think it may even be required by regulation) so no electricity causes the stop solenoid to close which means no fuel and no engine.

...though I actually think that you have higher chances of seeing your paper chart blown overboard by a wind gust.
And if THAT happens, have you considered what YOU would do?

:
Silly question. Send the SWMBO into the water to fetch it, of course

 

[prv]

Blimey, I didn't think those were still around. Excellent piece of kit but I assumed they'd all been replaced by electronic plotters these days

Nope - still available to buy new, and a lot floating around secondhand as they don't really go out of date. Last time this subject came up over on the saily forum, a lot of happy users piped up. I guess they might be less common on motorboats.

The design has barely changed since the 80s original, so the display etc feels a little bit clunky by modern standards although still just as usable once you understand it. They also use battery-backed memory rather than flash so if the coin battery inside dies they lose all the pre-configured chart data. Not the end of the world as you can enter it back in as user charts, but annoying, especially if (like me) you deliberately removed the battery to reset a second-hand one to factory defaults without realising this would also lose the charts.

I'd love it if they designed an updated one that worked the same way but had a friendlier menu system and no battery, but given the sales volumes involved I guess they don't think it's worth it.

Pete

 

[MapisM]

Send the SWMBO into the water to fetch it, of course

Now, that's what I call a sound emergency plan!

Re. engines, mine actually work the other way round: it takes current to close the stop solenoid, once open.
In fact, the only problem I would have is that I should go to the e/r to stop the engines manually, after arrival...
TBH, there are also electrical valves on the fuel lines, but those can be opened also manually.

 

[benjenbav]

Silly question. Send the SWMBO into the water to fetch it, of course

You don't really need a chart or a plotter with a swmbo on board because they always know the answer.

Actually, on Sunday, on a 900m passage sur les autoroutes francais I put this to the test on the Lyons peripherique: my plotter/satnav vs her intuition.

Oh lordy, you should have heard the curses hurled at me. I didn't know that gels' finishing schools taught such words.

And when I turned out to be right...I was simply insufferable for the next 100 miles or so.

 

[henryf]

I think the answer largely depends on the quality of your plotter. I used to use charts then transfer to a plotter, using the Raymarine 120W for the first time these past few days I now reverse the operation so easy is course plotting. Put in a rough route then fine tune it by moving, removing or adding points.

Around the Solent everything is visual so not much to do, the passage back from Weymouth and a live range was a perfect time to plot a route and also see the effect altering the route to avoid potential rough water had on overall times and distances. A 30 second operation to try then revert back if necessary.

Henry

 

[PaulGooch]

The current boat only has one plotter, but the next will have two. For now, it depends where i'm going. I might just aim for the next buoy, i might click on a spot on the plotter and "go to", or i might plan a route on the PC and send that to the plotter.

If the plotter failed than i'd use the laptop that has it's own software and charts and gets its GPS data from a hand held Garmin GPS.

If the laptop failed, i could just use the hand held GPS. Or, i could use the hand held GPS with paper charts.

Last resort would be to use the paper charts with hand held compass etc.

The very last ditch backup is to take the hand held GPS and VHF in the grab bag, to the life raft.

If that all fails, the Gods truly are against me and i may as well tie myself to the boat as it sinks

 

[Talulah]

The current boat only has one plotter, but the next will have two. For now, it depends where i'm going. I might just aim for the next buoy, i might click on a spot on the plotter and "go to", or i might plan a route on the PC and send that to the plotter.

If the plotter failed than i'd use the laptop that has it's own software and charts and gets its GPS data from a hand held Garmin GPS.

If the laptop failed, i could just use the hand held GPS. Or, i could use the hand held GPS with paper charts.

Last resort would be to use the paper charts with hand held compass etc.

The very last ditch backup is to take the hand held GPS and VHF in the grab bag, to the life raft.

If that all fails, the Gods truly are against me and i may as well tie myself to the boat as it sinks

I'm sure someone will belong shortly to remind you of the versatility of carrying a sextant.

 

[PaulGooch]

I'm sure someone will belong shortly to remind you of the versatility of carrying a sextant.

No doubt, i wouldn't know how to use one though

 

[lufc71]

...In any meaningful passage, I always keep a notebook running in parallel ....with its own GPS dongle and charts....all people onboard have a GPS in their mobiles...

GPS has been down in the past, and it could happen again. Likewise, mobiles.

...though I actually think that you have higher chances of seeing your paper chart blown overboard by a wind gust.
And if THAT happens, have you considered what YOU would do?

lol - very good point.

I never take it upstairs, just in case.