David of Essex
Well-Known Member
Volvo fuel filter part no 861014 10 micron from volspec. Sorry can't be more help only ordered from them last year.
David
David
Which Racor Prefilters to buy
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volvopaul
Well-Known Member
Yes they are that type which would have been ff105c but IMHO not big enough for the burn rate and flow of my 62a engines 340hp,so at sometime they have been changed for 1242s.
Id like to have racor 2040 housings or separ 2000/10 flat panel type filters.
Anyway think shes going on the market now in favour of hard top s cruiser.
Latestarter1
Well-Known Member
Well according to Volvo part # 861014 you have a Volvo badged Racor 500MA which is shown in the attachment, my post on this thread #10.
Genuine Racor replacement cartridge is part # 2010TM and Fleetguard equivalent is FS20102. Fleetguard ususally manufacture filters for Volvo aftermarket. Baldwin also do a replacement # 598-10 which has a metal galvanised case with little wire handle, just like Fleetguard FS20102 used to be.
Do not know how much you paid for Volvo part # 861014, but last time I purchased box of 12 Baldwin part #59810-10 they came out around £7 each.
As you have decent pre-filter, adding a rock stopper in front of it, not as quite large as Rob's Nanni 315, life would be good.
David of Essex
Well-Known Member
Latestarter. Thanks for the time and trouble you have given. The price from volspec for filter 861014 last year was £21.96 inc vat. I take it you are saying, a rock stopper would be advisable in front of my pre filter. If so what size and is the make coalescing.?
This is the pre filter as fitted to D4 260hp engine
This is the pre filter as fitted to D4 260hp engine
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aquapower
Well-Known Member
I would favour the Racor, those Separ are more awkward to change with those four bolts to remove the tops and the elements are nearly half the price aswell.
Have removed a few of the ff105 fleetguards and replaced with Racor as they just not really suited to this kind of use.
Latestarter1
Well-Known Member
David, you just said Volvo 260, not what flavour of Green motor, the rules have changed. As I have said before I am no Green motor man, however I do speak Bosch CP3 common rail! Let me look at this all over again. Your on engine filter is very demanding as to its appetite. Pre common rail engines 'last chance' or on engine filter was 5 Microns, common rail is 2 Microns with zero tolerance to water.
Lets bank your likely 50% filter element price saving in your Volvo badged Racor by going for a Fleetguard FS20102 instead of the Volvo own brand replacement which is 90% likely to be the FS20102 anyway n a Volvo box. And base multi stage system around what you already have. No need for a primer gear pump on the CP3 sucks for England! Now do you have your WIF sensor on Racor or the 'last chance' filter, this is important? This is where my Green engine knowledge is wanting.
Coalesing is Fleetguard speak for good water absorbing. We can use your existing Racor.
Latestarter1
Well-Known Member
I am absolutely astounded, have you ever read a technical data sheet!
However admitting to ripping out FS 10c in favour of Racor 500 MA is plain crazy.FS105c has greater Beta flow rating than the Racor 500MA. I admit builders spec the FS105c on a knife edge, but when boat already has a 1-14 filter head you could have upgraded to the Fleetguard FS1242B/Racor S2301 with the clear plastic bowl/drain at the bottom together with further upgrade to the FS1015B, probably just over £25.
How much did you 'take' the poor bloody owner for, certainly more than £25, to give them somthing light years inferior in terms of Beta flow, boat owner left hanging out to dry just because you cannot be bothered to read, let alone understood a bloomin spec sheet.
David of Essex
Well-Known Member
Latestarter you certainly have a wealth of knowledge of the fuel systems. The main fuel filter fitted to the port side of the D4 has an electrical connection fitted to the base of the filter. I take this to be the WIF sensor you are referring too. No electrical connection to the pre filter.
I would think this is a learning curve to every one that's reading these posts. I didn't realise the complexions to fuel filters.
David
I would think this is a learning curve to every one that's reading these posts. I didn't realise the complexions to fuel filters.
David
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aquapower
Well-Known Member
Before you doubt my inteligence yes I have read spec sheet and yes I do know about flow rates but the purpous of these swaps was for ease of changing where inexperienced owners can change a filter white at sea on a leisure boat with minimum stress, that is why these filters were requested it had noting to do with not understanding and ripping off people. And if you read correctly I said FF105 and NOT FS105c
ms1
Well-Known Member
500 MA for each engine
aquapower
Well-Known Member
You are correct, the volvo filter has a wif sensor fitted however if you have adequate fre filtration you should never get any water this far down the line, this is another reason for fittin a Racor 500 ma as its easy to drain off water. You can as an option fit a wif sensor in pre filter aswell, also vacuum guages are available to indicate when a filter is about to become blocked.
Latestarter1
Well-Known Member
David,
Spent some time over night drawing up option #1 for you, now you know why I never sleep! There may likey be a second but lets work the issues on #1
Nominally your Racor 500MA is lacking in capacity, many commercial naval architects will not allow 500MA to be used above 75Hp, the unit alone is probably ok for twice that provided it is on an engine with a rotary fuel pump. Anything over 150Hp it needs a helping hand. You are common rail, it needs a big hand.
Why am cautious of the 500MA? Many filter, engine, and hydraulic equipment companies do not recognise micron ratings alone as significant and specifically recommend the use of "Beta ratio" in selecting a filter to meet system requirements. Beta ratio (multi-pass test method) ANSI/B93.31-1973, ISO 4572-1981; this is the only test accepted by ANSI, ISO and NFPA. It is the industry standard for measurement of efficiency.
The Beta ratio is determined by counting the number of particles over a given size upstream of the filter and dividing that number by the number of particles over the given size downstream of the filter. Simply put, a nominal 2 micron filter may only capture 94% of 2 micron particles, 98% of particles 10 microns, and close to 100% of particles above 10 microns.
Step one of a multi stage process. Use your existing 500MA with a 30 micon filter element, this will increase the filters Beta ratio. We now have the Racor as your first line of defence, however as this is your gatekeeper it MUST have a restriction gauge. I have had poor experience of quality of Racor's own gauges, particularly the look down one. I use gauges by Designated Engineer in the U.S. Great quality (Made in Switzerland) and cheaper than Racors own.
Step two the critical part of the two stage process. Insert a 1-14 filter head between your Racor and your 'last chance' filter. Now fit Fleetguard FS19732 or equivalent which comes complete with a WIF sensor and also has a drain tap at the bottom. This will give us 10 micron first pass and 5 micron second pass giving the on engine filter an easy life
Now the clever bit, where I would hope to get assistance from the Green engine guys here. I would hope Volvo provide optional extension harness pigtail for the WIF sensor fitted to on engine filter. Remove plug from on WIF sensor on 'last chance' filter, plug in the extension harness and now plug into the WIF sensor on the FS19732. If Volvo do not do extension harness, optional one from a Cummins QSB would likely fit.
We have now transferred your vital safety net to your second stage filter. Why have we done this? The on engine filter is critical to the health of the fuel system, any trace of water in the Bosch CP3 fuel system will damage the pump and if it gets to the injectors they can 'hose' i.e. stick open. Fuel washes lube off cylinder bores, piston picks up and tears before bed time.
Last time I looked Volvo had not incorporated an unintended fuelling algorithim to prevent this happening into D4/6 calibration as Cummins QSB has. Perhaps Volvo guys will again correct me here if I am wrong. Either way IF you ever trigger WIF alarm in your on engine filter you are on a knife edge, boating should never be on the edge.
Cost, upgrade parts I am suggesting should probably be no more than fitting Racor 900MA and give you total protection which a Racor alone cannot provide. On going maintainence cost probaly an additional £30 annually.
Why do boat builders do the job properly? Simply $$$ and the fact that they do not have to live with their creations.
Observaions re option #1 welcome.
Spent some time over night drawing up option #1 for you, now you know why I never sleep! There may likey be a second but lets work the issues on #1
Nominally your Racor 500MA is lacking in capacity, many commercial naval architects will not allow 500MA to be used above 75Hp, the unit alone is probably ok for twice that provided it is on an engine with a rotary fuel pump. Anything over 150Hp it needs a helping hand. You are common rail, it needs a big hand.
Why am cautious of the 500MA? Many filter, engine, and hydraulic equipment companies do not recognise micron ratings alone as significant and specifically recommend the use of "Beta ratio" in selecting a filter to meet system requirements. Beta ratio (multi-pass test method) ANSI/B93.31-1973, ISO 4572-1981; this is the only test accepted by ANSI, ISO and NFPA. It is the industry standard for measurement of efficiency.
The Beta ratio is determined by counting the number of particles over a given size upstream of the filter and dividing that number by the number of particles over the given size downstream of the filter. Simply put, a nominal 2 micron filter may only capture 94% of 2 micron particles, 98% of particles 10 microns, and close to 100% of particles above 10 microns.
Step one of a multi stage process. Use your existing 500MA with a 30 micon filter element, this will increase the filters Beta ratio. We now have the Racor as your first line of defence, however as this is your gatekeeper it MUST have a restriction gauge. I have had poor experience of quality of Racor's own gauges, particularly the look down one. I use gauges by Designated Engineer in the U.S. Great quality (Made in Switzerland) and cheaper than Racors own.
Step two the critical part of the two stage process. Insert a 1-14 filter head between your Racor and your 'last chance' filter. Now fit Fleetguard FS19732 or equivalent which comes complete with a WIF sensor and also has a drain tap at the bottom. This will give us 10 micron first pass and 5 micron second pass giving the on engine filter an easy life
Now the clever bit, where I would hope to get assistance from the Green engine guys here. I would hope Volvo provide optional extension harness pigtail for the WIF sensor fitted to on engine filter. Remove plug from on WIF sensor on 'last chance' filter, plug in the extension harness and now plug into the WIF sensor on the FS19732. If Volvo do not do extension harness, optional one from a Cummins QSB would likely fit.
We have now transferred your vital safety net to your second stage filter. Why have we done this? The on engine filter is critical to the health of the fuel system, any trace of water in the Bosch CP3 fuel system will damage the pump and if it gets to the injectors they can 'hose' i.e. stick open. Fuel washes lube off cylinder bores, piston picks up and tears before bed time.
Last time I looked Volvo had not incorporated an unintended fuelling algorithim to prevent this happening into D4/6 calibration as Cummins QSB has. Perhaps Volvo guys will again correct me here if I am wrong. Either way IF you ever trigger WIF alarm in your on engine filter you are on a knife edge, boating should never be on the edge.
Cost, upgrade parts I am suggesting should probably be no more than fitting Racor 900MA and give you total protection which a Racor alone cannot provide. On going maintainence cost probaly an additional £30 annually.
Why do boat builders do the job properly? Simply $$$ and the fact that they do not have to live with their creations.
Observaions re option #1 welcome.
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Latestarter1
Well-Known Member
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David of Essex
Well-Known Member
Latestarter that a lot of info. I was going to ask how the restriction gauge works, also 1-14 filter head what does this mean ?. Hope you are not getting feed up with all the questions. If you are in the market for designing and supplying an additional filtering system for us leisure boaters there could be a market.
David
ps dont' retire
David
ps dont' retire
Canopy Locked
Well-Known Member
Just to throw my tuppence into the ring...... Having taken Latestarters advice and fitted a multistage unit, I changed my fleetguard filters today... the pressure gauge was showing a drop of 8.5 (not quite sure of the unit) but it was almost at the bottom of the green which I (in my simple way) assumes that the engine is having to "suck" a bit harder than before.
The crud that came of of the rockstopper (1st stage) was pretty impressive. I also changed the 2nd stage (for the sake of being thorough) - there was no visible crud in this one.
The engine has run 17 hrs since being fitted and has not missed a beat; previously my Racor 500 managed 9 hrs before then engine began to cough under load.
I'm pretty confident that the fuel in my tank is being polished and the evidence will be if I get to 17 hrs run time and the pressure gauge is still above 8.5.
As for cost? £10.48 and £10.64 + vat for each filter (Baldwin equivilents) - I'm not unhappy with that at all... by next year I would expect a filter to last 50 hrs which is when I normally change filters.. (old habit from a/c maintenance and the 50 hr inspection!)
Rob
The crud that came of of the rockstopper (1st stage) was pretty impressive. I also changed the 2nd stage (for the sake of being thorough) - there was no visible crud in this one.
The engine has run 17 hrs since being fitted and has not missed a beat; previously my Racor 500 managed 9 hrs before then engine began to cough under load.
I'm pretty confident that the fuel in my tank is being polished and the evidence will be if I get to 17 hrs run time and the pressure gauge is still above 8.5.
As for cost? £10.48 and £10.64 + vat for each filter (Baldwin equivilents) - I'm not unhappy with that at all... by next year I would expect a filter to last 50 hrs which is when I normally change filters.. (old habit from a/c maintenance and the 50 hr inspection!)
Rob