What's the next family cruiser for us?

[Jodles123]

Hi all,

Sorry I haven't posted in here in a while, but thanks to the amazing advice I received on here a few months back about where to take the kids on the Solent, we've spent most of our time out on our boat!!!

So here's my situation, and I would REALLY appreciate some advice as hubby and I don't agree.....

We were brand new to boating last Autumn and bought a 21 ft San Boat, with a small but comfortable cuddy, nothing in it but a bed and a loo under the bed, so we could do the odd overnighter if we wanted to. We have two small kids (5 and 6) so weren't sure how they would take to it (or me for that matter). Let's just say we got the bug BIG time and are now out nearly every weekend!

But having just got back from the long weekend on the Isle of Wight, we've realised that it's not so easy doing more than 1 night onboard, with 4 people living out of carrier bags, all sharing one bed and not having a separate loo!
So although we adore our first boat and will be gutted to see her go, we are starting to look around...

The next step up would be something like a Maxum 2400 - basically what we have, but with the additional aft berth, and separate heads.

Then yesterday we popped over to a local boatyard to have get a feel for this kind of thing, and ended up viewing two much bigger boats - a Sea Ray 290 and a Bayliner 2855. Both, of course, are absolutely fantastic....much bigger (6 berth), do absolutely everything we need, and I doubt we'd ever need to upgrade again (famous last words, I know). Having seen these, I'm just concerned that we'd very quickly outgrow something like a 24 ft Maxum and end up changing again very soon.

Hubby is adamant we DON'T need anything this big, and we wouldn't be able to cope anyway. Obviously there is more money involved in terms of petrol, berthing, etc. - and we'd lose the fantastic berth we waited 6 months for, whereas we could fit a 24 footer on it and have no need to change. He's also concerned about whether we can cope physically - the kids are far too young to get involved in ropes, etc. and at the moment I spend a lot of time pulling the boat alongside manually. Not sure I could do that with one of these big girls.

Any thoughts? Am I getting ahead of myself and this is something we should be looking at in a few years? Or is it better to bite the bullet now, and get some fantastic holidays out of a fantastic boat while the kids are still little? The boats we've been looking at are both 20 years old but very well maintained, so they've done the majority of their depreciation and money wise there's a difference of about 6-7K.

I would HUGELY appreciate some advice - especially from those who've cruised with small children!!

Jodles x

 

[annageek]

I know in the thread title you talk about a cruiser, but I'd imagine your current boat also has some 'Sports Boat' pedigree to it too. To that end, do you currently do (or could you see yourself / family doing in the future) any towed watersports?

If yes, then a the Maxum 2400 would be really well set-up for it ans would serve this purpose well... anything bigger may be a bit to cumbersome.

If no, then you're in a similar position to us. Although it's only the two of us who ever overnight on our 19' Fletcher, it's a tight squeeze, and very cramped (but incredibly fun nonetheless). For us, keeping costs down is key, so the Fletcher works... but we are looking to upgrade, and when we do, the most obvious choice seems to be something like a Sealine S23. It seems to tick all your boxes... cruiser boat, midships crawlspace berth as well as the forward berth, enclosed heads, bench seat type 4-seater table space, and at 25' LOA may still fit on your mooring? Furthermore, they're fitted with the Volvo KAD32 engine which is well regarded as being solid, and also frugal!

Edit: And from what I've seen, with a Sealine, you do get proper 'Sealine' fit and finish, which is arguably a good notch up on the Bayliner / Sea Ray. Also, we've seen S23's about on the internet listed as low as about £28k (although haven't looked at any, so they may be listed cheaper as they are in need of work to be done to them). Depending on how desperate someone is to get rid, you may find a decent one for sub £25k with a cheeky offer. There is always the slightly older S240 which crops up cheaper, but there are quite a few with petrol engines. AFAIK, they are the same as the S23 (and more recent S25) just with a slightly different moulded superstructure to the boat.

Good luck in your hunt!

 

[Jodles123]

Thank you annageek! That's really helpful advice, will have a google at the Sealine S23. We're still such novices when it comes to makes of boats and what's out there, so should probably spend a LOT more time looking first.
We wouldn't be doing any towed watersports (but yes, you're right that our current boat does have a sporty element) - so that's not an issue.
Cheers again, really appreciate the help.

 

[annageek]

One thing I should mention is that I believe there are many (some people on here included) who have upgraded after a year or so from their first boat to an S23 or similar, realised that they now have the potential to invite extended family/friends on board due to the bigger size, then realise that actually, its still not big enough from a practical point of view, and end up taking the next step to the 28-30' (often twin engined) affairs (Sticking with the Sealines, this would be an S28 / S29 / SC29).

If you could see this happening to you, then it probably would be more cost effective from an overall point of view to take the leap from the off, but where's the fun in that!

 

[Otter]

I can't offer any advice on specific models but our little ones are 8 and 4 and both had their first weekend afloat within weeks of being born. An overnight boat is very different to a week afloat boat. You need so much more space for it to work. Separate sleeping areas for parents and children is an absolute must, and really separate cabins rather than converting a dinning area. This means something from 27 rather than 24 foot.

But the rewards are huge. Imagine a week exploring Studland and Poole harbour, the kids will love it. Or East Head and Chichester harbour. Being able to comfortably spend a week afloat changes everything and is great for family bonding as well. But doing it on a boat that's cramped means you will all start to resent it. As for boat handing, you and hubby are both right, yes it will be different but yes you can manage it. But confidence is everything so once you've chosen a bigger boat, invest in a day's tuition on it, we had tuition when we bought the Kipper and we learned so much about her.

 

[Whitelighter]

If you want to stick around 24ft Id go for a diesel Sealibe S23/25. Don't know your budget but you can pick these up for 30k and they are proper little weekenders with clever touches.

If you do decide to go bigger than the Bayliner 285(5) is an excellent boat. I had one and bought it because I lijed the fact you didn't have to sleep in your dining table every night.

 

[EugeneR]

For us, keeping costs down is key, so the Fletcher works... but we are looking to upgrade, and when we do, the most obvious choice seems to be something like a Sealine S23.

Edit: And from what I've seen, with a Sealine, you do get proper 'Sealine' fit and finish, which is arguably a good notch up on the Bayliner / Sea Ray.

I would recommend a Bayliner 285, and and here is why:

- For the same price i.e. £25k-£30ish, you can get a 10 year newer boat - possibly a 2006 model. Apart from being more modern, it should be more reliable. Look for a clean, well maintained engine bay with good service history.
- The 285 used to be unique in the amount of space it offers i.e. 6 berths including a proper door to the mid cabin - which even has standing room, not just "crawl-in". It means you do not have to fold up your bed, before being able to sit down for breakfast. Do a search on this forum, you will get plenty of good feedback. Of course, running hot water, shower, sea toilet and everything else you want. It is big enough to give people some space, each in their own area if they so desire. Also, the door to the mid cabin means you have some privacy when you have friends over - or just away from the kids...
- Bayliners etc do not have the wood and lacquered finishes of the Sealine etc; instead, it's mostly vinyl and plastic. This is perfect when you have a young family because you can clean and/or repair everything easily. The kids can catch fish / crabs / etc without staining teak, for example. The "monkey fur" inside can be replaced cheaply (<£100 per panel) and easily, unlike more expensive finishes. It does not grow as much "green" over winter either, so maintenance costs are lower.

To be clear, the Bayliner's fittings are not the same standard as the British brands... but it allows you to get a lot more boat and enjoyment for your money. It gets to the same places just as safely, and the views and G&T are the same...

 

[rafiki_]

Models, you are going through the growing pains that many of us do with our boating. Cuddies really are for small couples to overnight. We had ours for about 4 months before we bought our 25 ft Sunbird, and there are 3 of us, not 4. This allowed more extended stays, although still required the dinette to be made up every night. In terms of handling, you will find it not much different from your Cuddy. Our previous boat was 33 ft, and I moored and did warps myself. Our current 40 footer requires lady wife to get the first warp on from the bathing platform, then I complete the ropes. You will have no problem handling the Bayliner, although she will be more impacted by breeze, so you have to be a bit more thoughtful when mooring.

 

[Jodles123]

Thank you - all so helpful! I am running out the door now but when I get home tonight am going to run all these ideas past hubby. In the meantime, please keep 'em coming!!!

 

[Whitelighter]

Just to clear something up: the Sealine s23 and S25 are the same boat but completely different from the previous S24/240. Different hull, different deck etc. They are similar in the fact they are 4 berth weekenders but they are not as suggested earlier the same boat with a name change

 

[stuartwineberg]

Just to add that you do not need to worry about handling a bigger boat. The children grow up very quickly and will soon be able to help but the point is that anything up to about 4 tons (and even more) is pretty easy to manhandle (?personhandle) with the right techniques - usual stuff like never just holding onto a mooring warp but always snubbing it round a cleat on the dock. Our boat is a very heavily built 25 footer that weighs in around the 4 ton mark. It is a wheelhouse so I can't quickly jump out to help and my 60+ year old SWMBO walks off easily with the stern line, cleats it and then picks up the loop of bow line which is set near the mid point of the boat - all nice and easy. I absolutely endorse the value of a day of on your boat tuition from an expert.

Also remember that the running costs of a boat are size related, not related to the amount you paid for it and you are getting to the point where looking a diesels with their simplicity and cheaper fuel costs could well be worth while.

 

[Medskipper]

Hi Jodie,
my wife and I started our boating life with a 25' boat when our kids were that age and I can tell you we needed the space!
imagine you moved to a bigger house, now imagine how quickly you grow into it? Well it's exactly the same with a bigger boat!
Over the years our kids have all grown up but only just last year I changed our boat from a 37' to a 44' boat, I figure that as you get older you also seem to get a bit bigger so more space and comfort is required!
I can also tell you that I have found the larger your boat the easier it is to handle strangely though it sounds.
My advice is the same as for buying a house, buy the largest one you can afford! But don't forget to build in the running costs as well and don't worry about it being twenty years or so old, most owners really love their boats and look after them well.
My boating bug bit thirty years or more ago and I cannot imagine being without one!
Good luck

 

[longjohnsilver]

If you want to stick around 24ft Id go for a diesel Sealibe S23/25. Don't know your budget but you can pick these up for 30k and they are proper little weekenders with clever touches.

If you do decide to go bigger than the Bayliner 285(5) is an excellent boat. I had one and bought it because I lijed the fact you didn't have to sleep in your dining table every night.

I'd second the comments on the Bayliner. A good friend of mine has one for almost 20 years before he sold it to my son and upgraded to a 32' Bayliner. As already said, not the same standard as a similar sized UK boat but at about half the price they really can't be beaten for value.

And yes, the 2 of you will handle it easily. Most people on here with bigger boats up to 70 odd feet will do exactly the same, husband and wife only.

 

[ontheplane]

Whilst I get the votes for the Bayliner, I would also vote for the S23/24/25's

One issue normally with boats is every time you increase size, you lose a lot of money on the deal, however that doesn't seem to apply to the S24/25 Sealines. They seem to all be about the same price, and have been at the £25 - £35k mark for years now. The main factor is condition, and petrol or diesel engine.

But they are "Proper" cruisers, plenty of room for the family you describe, but small enough to fit on your mooring. I would give them serious consideration - go see one, then if you buy it at the right price, you will be able to sell on in a couple of years for pretty much what you paid for it as long as it's the diesel model.

 

[Jodles123]

Wow, so much brilliant information here - thank you!!!
And lots to think about too...
I think we need to make a list of our priorities.
Thanks again,
Jo

 

[Jamesuk]

The maxu 2400 looks loke a great boat. Go for big turbo diesel if you can, the other boat is a Sealine S25 whixh you might find going to France is just 3 hours away. Think half terms and Easter holidays teaching kids about being Pro EU and picking up French Nd later Dutch and much much later Croatian ;-) after a road trip.

Ps find a boat that has been for sale for years and offer 50% less now. Next summer the owner might finally say yes then spend the difference doing it up and offering him use of it for a few weeks per year...?

 

[Cashbuyer]

Seriously consider buying with or fitting a bow thruster on the larger Bayliner. Makes berthing in a wind sooo much easier and reduces the shouting and swearing...