What Knot (Bend) is this? Should I use a Shackle?

[nigelmercier]

Following on from this ...

I am considering replacing my 12mm [single line] reefing lines with 10mm, but have been advised by Selden that I need to upgrade the specification of the 10mm...

I've replaced all the SLR lines with 10mm with a Dyneema core. Now comes fitting to the reefing rings in the luff; the Selden manual has this image showing the recommended bend, onto a shackle:

I'm tempted to dispense with the shackle, and bend the lines directly onto the rings. I guess it depends how hard this bend is to untie; I could look it up, but I don't know what it is called.

Thoughts?

 

[xeitosaphil]

Looks like a Halyard Hitch Nigel, but with the end/tail going up inside the turns.

http://www.animatedknots.com/halyard/index.php?LogoImage=LogoGrog.jpg&Website=www.animatedknots.com

 

[ghostlymoron]

I think it's a halyard knot. Similar to a fisherman's bend but bigger.

 

[VicS]

Following on from this ...


I've replaced all the SLR lines with 10mm with a Dyneema core. Now comes fitting to the reefing rings in the luff; the Selden manual has this image showing the recommended bend, onto a shackle:

I'm tempted to dispense with the shackle, and bend the lines directly onto the rings. I guess it depends how hard this bend is to untie; I could look it up, but I don't know what it is called.

Thoughts?

Looks like a Halyard Hitch Nigel, but with the end/tail going up inside the turns.

http://www.animatedknots.com/halyard/index.php?LogoImage=LogoGrog.jpg&Website=www.animatedknots.com

I think it's a halyard knot. Similar to a fisherman's bend but bigger.

It is indeed what Selden call a halyard knot. From their Hints and Advice pdf

 

[michael_w]

Those halyard hitches can prove troublesome to untie. I'd put eye splices in the reefing pennants and cow hitch them to the shackles. Splicing dyneema is easy peasy; google 'mobius brummel splice'.

Alternatively, eye splice and use soft shackles.

 

[johnalison]

A halyard knot is a slip knot and continues to tighten. There is nothing wrong with this in the right application. My reefing pennants are tied this way to shackles and this makes taking the sail off easier than if I tied them directly. The halyard knot is also very compact. A cw hitch would mean unreeling the whole line to take the sail off

 

[Halo]

Suggest you follow the recommended knot and be prepared to cut it off when you need to.
If you dont want to loose a few inches then use a bowline but be sure to tape the tail tight with self amalgamating tape so it cannot shake loose.

 

[prv]

I guess it depends how hard this bend is to untie

It can sometimes be undone with the aid of a marline spike, but is best regarded as permanent. Either tie it onto a shackle, as recommended, or use something else onto the ring.

Pete

 

[wizard]

Those halyard hitches can prove troublesome to untie. I'd put eye splices in the reefing pennants and cow hitch them to the shackles. Splicing dyneema is easy peasy; google 'mobius brummel splice'.

Alternatively, eye splice and use soft shackles.

I cut mine every year and redo the knots to move the wear points along the halyards.

 

[fredrussell]

I'm going to show my inexperience here and ask why you can't use the humble bowline. That's what I used - shouldn't I have?

 

[Tranona]

I'm going to show my inexperience here and ask why you can't use the humble bowline. That's what I used - shouldn't I have?

Fine as a knot, but the halyard knot has the advantage of being much more compact and tightens itself under load, so as already suggested should be treated as semi permanent.

 

[Daydream believer]

shackle on a pulley & return the end of the line back to the boom to give you a 2:1 purchase

 

[fredrussell]

Fine as a knot, but the halyard knot has the advantage of being much more compact and tightens itself under load, so as already suggested should be treated as semi permanent.

Ah I see - if any of the bowlines on my reefing setup fail I'll use that knot. I know only the eight knots listed by St Cunliffe in the RYA Yachtmaster book; thus far they have been enough but learning a few more can only be a good thing.

 

[Hydrozoan]

I cut mine every year and redo the knots to move the wear points along the halyards.

Yes, that's an advantage and it's such a compact knot that it is IMO barely less neat than an eye.

 

[Bav32]

I too use bowlines, having found the aforementioned knot a real pain to undo; screwdrivers , marlin spikes and pliers , if I recall.
I've also done away with the shackles on the basis that it's something else to go wrong; and since I can now undo the bowlines easily !!!!

 

[nigelmercier]

It can sometimes be undone with the aid of a marline spike, but is best regarded as permanent. Either tie it onto a shackle, as recommended, or use something else onto the ring.

I've now tried to undo the original, impossible.

I quite like the idea of a bowline, as the halyard knot binds onto the shackle and won't rotate as needed.

What is the best way to stop a bowline from shaking loose, I've noted the SA tape from Halo.

 

[johnphilip]

shackle on a pulley & return the end of the line back to the boom to give you a 2:1 purchase

Assuming as the OP implies this is a Selden SLR boom set up that would mean that when you shake out the reef you would only be able to pull the luff of the sail part way up the mast.
The luff pennant runs from the luff to a slider in the boom where it is fixed as a single line. A 2:1 purchase is provided by the main reef line going around a sheeve on the slider. Look it up on Seldens page.
The boom length restricts the depth of reef available for the second reef.https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=s...yQ20QDroM:&usg=__CtXFFgr1Z8GeH7wb9-tw3CnlWIY=

 

[colind3782]

What is the best way to stop a bowline from shaking loose, I've noted the SA tape from Halo.

I cable tie the loose end to the loop.

 

[nuvaslacker]

Isn't the problem with a bowline that, as the loop is loose, it tends to chafe as it works on a hard ring or shackle? The tight loop of the halyard knot prevents this.

 

[Daydream believer]

deleted.