What EPIRB?

[davethedog]

Morning all,

Looking to improve our safety stores onboard, as were looking to cross Channel soon and also sail to the Med in a few years, and wonder what EPIRB and PLBs people recommend?

Thanks

 

[john_morris_uk]

We bought one of these last year. http://www.youboatmarine.com/ocean-signal-epirb1-cat-2---epirb-1558-p.asp

It was cheaper than many of the others and I couldn't see where any compromises had been made. (We didn't buy it from that website and I've no connections so no recommendation implied)

I can't comment on its efficiency as we've never used it. (And I hope I never have to!)

You don't have to have an EPIRB for channel sailing. I think you'll be heard on the VHF by someone no matter where you are.

 

[pcatterall]

Morning all,

Looking to improve our safety stores onboard, as were looking to cross Channel soon and also sail to the Med in a few years, and wonder what EPIRB and PLBs people recommend?

Thanks

We are in the same boat ( pun intended!) but now sailing in the med. We like our SPOT tracker as it can be used daily to let friends/relatives know we are ok and where we are. The emergency function has good reports. Confidence is high simply because we use it daily and KNOW it will work ( rather than it just sitting there and hopefully ready to work!)

However we would like to improve things especially for when we make longer and overnight passages.
What about individual man overboard scenarios do we need an alarm sent to the boat and some tracking system so that we can locate the casualty?
Do we rely on a PLB that just contacts the rescue services?
In the event of being mown down by a ship with no warning at all should we have an epirb that will automatically deploy?
There are many scenarios and I confess to being confused by just what does what and in what event. There are lots of detailed discussions about individual devices but it would be good to see
a paper covering these scenarios and the sort of devices suitable before digging down into comparing similar devices.

I assume the OP has AIS, good weather info, flares, safety lines, jack lines, policies etc which might prevent the need for deploying such devices.

 

[Tranona]

There are essentially 2 types of EPIRBs differentiated by the length of time the operate for determined by battery life. Clearly the longer life is perhaps more suitable if you plan ocean passages and are correspondingly more expensive.

There are only 3 major suppliers, McMurdo, ACR and Ocean Signal and they all offer similar products to the same standards although details may vary, for example some are deployed manually and some automatic. Many now have owner replaceable batteries which is a big plus as factory replacements were very expensive. A bit of googling will get you all the information on the different features of different models.

In my view EPIRBs are of limited use in European coastal waters (based on the extremely small number of recorded emergency activations from small boats), but are now relatively cheap. Remember in much of our coastal waters you are in VHF and or phone range, although this is less so once you get to the Med.

I have a basic ACR. Not sure about having a PLB in addition to an EPIRB, and many people have the latter only for each crew member on the basis that it is the crew that need identifying rather than the boat. Again my view is that the chances of ever needing it are so low, yachts are very difficult to sink, and survival times in the water so short that external rescue triggered by a beacon is unlikely, so only one source of signal is needed.

You will, of course get a range of views on both the need for such devices and choice of type/brand. So do your own research and make up your own mind what is suitable for you.

 

[Stotty]

We are in the same boat ( pun intended!) but now sailing in the med. We like our SPOT tracker as it can be used daily to let friends/relatives know we are ok and where we are. The emergency function has good reports. Confidence is high simply because we use it daily and KNOW it will work ( rather than it just sitting there and hopefully ready to work!)

However we would like to improve things especially for when we make longer and overnight passages.
What about individual man overboard scenarios do we need an alarm sent to the boat and some tracking system so that we can locate the casualty?
Do we rely on a PLB that just contacts the rescue services?
In the event of being mown down by a ship with no warning at all should we have an epirb that will automatically deploy?
There are many scenarios and I confess to being confused by just what does what and in what event. There are lots of detailed discussions about individual devices but it would be good to see
a paper covering these scenarios and the sort of devices suitable before digging down into comparing similar devices.

I assume the OP has AIS, good weather info, flares, safety lines, jack lines, policies etc which might prevent the need for deploying such devices.

We carry 'rescume' MOB transponders and PLB's for off shore.

MOB transponder automatically triggers when the life jacket inflates, so if you get hit by the boom and knocked out as you go over, it will still trigger and set an alarm off in the boat, notifying them of your position.

PLB's are a bit 'overboard' even for things like thee Fastnet, but we will do some proper long distance stuff over the next few years, so worth the long-term investment.

Might be worth you doing the RYA 'sea survival' course... would give you all the information you need for both personal and boat safety equipment, as well as covering MOB & life raft drills. Not expensive - c.£120 for the day

 

[davethedog]

We do have lifelines, AIS, decent lifejackets, raft, flares etc but just looking to improve on this.

 

[Tranona]

We do have lifelines, AIS, decent lifejackets, raft, flares etc but just looking to improve on this.

"Improve" is not quite the right word. it is all about risk assessment and then ways of minimising the consequences. All the things you mention have different purposes. Some are preventative and others (like a liferaft) are curative.

So, assess what the risks are and the probability of them occurring and then look at how you would deal with them. Beacons sole purpose is to alert the rescue services that your boat is in trouble, but so will your DSC, flares and mobile. However, the last three have limited range, so the question is will the risk still exist when you are out of range. If so then a beacon is a solution (along with satellite communication, for example). Arguably the risk is lower in the Med. away from the coast it is a big empty place, and generally conditions are benign, but a beacon is the only realistic way of communicating your position.

Therefore clarify in your own mind what you are trying to achieve and make your own decision based on your individual situation.

 

[davethedog]

Ok, thanks and will have a think then, as we also have a SH HX870E that has DSV and GPS etc so we be fine for the next few years then. I think I will re-attack this when we decide we are setting off for good and will be crossing large oceans etc

 

[coveman]

Don't underestimate the value of a PLB in coastal waters. They can be bought now for around £180 and would make a good backup to a DSC radio. It gives the Coastguard your exact position which can be relayed to the rescue service of choice.
Batteries do not last as long as an EPIRB, typically 24 hrs as opposed to 48hrs but that should be plenty for coastal/offshore sailing.
PLB's as the name suggests can be kept on your person - some models in your lifejacket.
They have their uses as can be seen in the following RNLI report. A crew member said they would not have found this yachtsman if it hadn't been for his device. I imagine his radio was not working. £180 is good insurance in my view.
http://www.weymouthlifeboat.org.uk/alb_launch.php?s=alb-launches-to-a-plb-activation-se-of-weymouth>-the-cg-rescue-helicopter-locating-a-sick-lone-yachtsman-alb-recovers-the-winchman-casualty-to-the-lifeboat-to-be-winched-to-the-helicopter

 

[Tranona]

Don't underestimate the value of a PLB in coastal waters. They can be bought now for around £180 and would make a good backup to a DSC radio. It gives the Coastguard your exact position which can be relayed to the rescue service of choice.
Batteries do not last as long as an EPIRB, typically 24 hrs as opposed to 48hrs but that should be plenty for coastal/offshore sailing.
PLB's as the name suggests can be kept on your person - some models in your lifejacket.
They have their uses as can be seen in the following RNLI report. A crew member said they would not have found this yachtsman if it hadn't been for his device. I imagine his radio was not working. £180 is good insurance in my view.
http://www.weymouthlifeboat.org.uk/alb_launch.php?s=alb-launches-to-a-plb-activation-se-of-weymouth>-the-cg-rescue-helicopter-locating-a-sick-lone-yachtsman-alb-recovers-the-winchman-casualty-to-the-lifeboat-to-be-winched-to-the-helicopter

The OP already has an AIS (with transponder presumably) and his DSC will give the the boat's position as well. The only real advantage of a PLB in coastal waters is it can identify the position of an individual in the water if s/he is wearing it. On the boat it is a lower spec substitute for an EPIRB.

 

[coveman]

The OP already has an AIS (with transponder presumably) and his DSC will give the the boat's position as well. The only real advantage of a PLB in coastal waters is it can identify the position of an individual in the water if s/he is wearing it. On the boat it is a lower spec substitute for an EPIRB.

I probably should have been clearer - in my estimation a PLB would be useful providing you are not crossing oceans, but limit your sailing to channel crossing etc. Both EPIRB'S and PLB's have the advantage that they do not rely on the boats electrical supply, and are totally independent. Hence, if for some reason there is failure of the boats electrics or catastrophic mast failure (hence no radio reception), you still have some form of alerting the authorities.

 

[davethedog]

Thanks once more and glad this did not descend into an argument! LOL

I am considering purchasing an EPIRB for the boat and 2 x PLBs for the wife and I (as we sail short handed most of the time anyway) and as I have learnt many times in the past "it is better to have it and not need it, then need it and not have it!".

 

[Bradders]

Hi
I too wanted to upgrade my emergency beacons on my boat so I went for EPIRB Ocean signal Model Safe Sea E100G then 2 x PLB's FastFind 220 and for a back up to the ships VHF DSC I went for a Standard Horizon Model HX870E. Hope that helps

 

[davethedog]

Hi
I too wanted to upgrade my emergency beacons on my boat so I went for EPIRB Ocean signal Model Safe Sea E100G then 2 x PLB's FastFind 220 and for a back up to the ships VHF DSC I went for a Standard Horizon Model HX870E. Hope that helps

Thats where I reckon we will end up, along with the AIS transponder and fixed DSC radio.

 

[ashtead]

Had thought of adding a PLB so is the Fastfind the preferred version among forumites? How easy cheap is battery renewal on plb?

 

[prv]

How easy cheap is battery renewal on plb?

There is at least one PLB now with ten year battery life. Seven seems common. Given the reducing prices and improving technology (especially size and battery), while the cost of the work to dismantle, replace battery, re-seal and test remains the same, I assume that buying a new beacon will be the sensible choice when 2024 or 2027 rolls round.

Pete

 

[ashtead]

Thanks Pete will remember to look for a 10 year one then which as you say might be somewhat ancient technology at renewal. That said I have recently replaced the battery to newer version on the self draining icom handheld vhf
which otherwise seems to keep going.

 

[TwoHooter]

Hope nobody minds me reviving the thread instead of starting a new one.

I am buying our first EPIRB and it has been a nightmare comparing different models. The descriptions in the online shops are useless, they "feature" things like dual transmission on both 406.037 MHz and 121.5 MHz, buoyancy, strobe light etc. when all these things are basic requirements to meet the standards for all EPIRBs.

I ended up focussing on:

1. Output on the 406 band - this varies from 12W (Ocean Signal RescueMe) to 6.3W (ACR GlobalFix) and 5W for everyone else. Higher output = better chance of success? They all seem to be 50mW on the aircraft band.
2. Transmission time (claimed) - varies from 96hrs @ 5W for Ocean Signal SafeSea E100 and E100G to 65hrs @ 6.3 W or 5W (the ACR documentation is confusing me) for ACR GlobalFix Pro (all 3 variants) to 48 hours @ 5W for everything else. But how important is this? 48 hours is the basic requirement of the standard and surely it's long enough - if your signal hasn't been picked up by then will it ever?
3. Battery life - 10 years on Ocean Signal RescueMe, McMurdo Smartfind G8 (but that's £745!), and ACR GlobalFix V4. But Force4 just told me that the 6 year life for the ACR Globalfix Pro is wrong and that's 10 years too... they say the Americans make them put a lower battery life on the website. Huh?
4. GPS receiver - I reckon that's worth having. It should mean that SAR have a really good fix on the position. That's available on the Ocean Signal RescueMe (66 channels) & SafeSea 100G (50 channels); the McMurdo SmartFind Plus G5 (only 12 channels - seems inadequate to me); and the ACR GlobalFix pro and V4 (66 channels).
5. AIS - only available on the McMurdo SmartFind G8 - £745! I'll manage without that.
6. Replacement batteries - very hard to dig into this online. Lots of misinformation around concerning the costs of battery replacement.

I'm not sure what my priorities should be. At the moment the longest passage we've done is to cross St. George's Channel but at some point in the life of this thing the boat will go much further off shore than that.