We are in a never to be repeated golden age of sailing.

[doug748]

Quite so, we seem to be comparing the prices of boats when new with the price of those same boats some 40 years later.

Meanwhile, as reported in another thread, the cost of my boat new has doubled in the ten years since mine left the factory. Sadly the same cannot be said for my take home pay.

The Hurley in 1985 was not a new boat already coming up fifteen years old, it's quite possible to get a much older boat in actually better order. The instrumentation, heads, autopilot, stove are all upgrades on the original and the Volvo 10 twin engine is a quantum better engine than the Petter 9hp.
Sails, running and standing rigging, furnishing etc are all dependent on condition whether 15 or 50 years old.

.

 

[Lucky Duck]

Just looked up how much we paid for our first boat back in the late 1990s is worth today as adjusted for inflation - £68.5k(!)

They are now advertised for sale in the mid-teens but are 30 years old rather than three or four, so how much better value that translates into I guess depends how much store one places on the ‘Trigger’s broom’ affect

 

[Mark-1]

When I first started sailing in the mid/late 80s in my late teens i looked at the westerly centaur as the popular family cruising boat and good ones were about 10k then. Similar for something like a sadler 26. Family boats were smaller then.

According to google, or AI, or something 10k in 1986 equates to around 40k now.

Yet it is possible to buy a very good centaur or westerly griffon for 6 - 7k.

Of course you're comparing a 10yo boat with a 50yo boat. And any item that requires replacement could be half the price of the boat or more.

But yeah, I think your general point holds true.

 

[doris]

So for sailors this is the golden age. I know people say that it is madness paying 5k per year for a berth on a boat not even worth that, but it means that it is possible to get on the water and have fun for less in real terms than I spent on an evening out in Browns in Shoreditch in the 90s.

Wow, someone on this forum who admits to nights out in Browns! I’m impressed at the honesty, but the media police might start knocking on a front door shortly

 

[potentillaCO32]

Wow, someone on this forum who admits to nights out in Browns! I’m impressed at the honesty, but the media police might start knocking on a front door shortly

If you know you know

 

[PeterV]

I agree that boating’s never been cheaper but it seems that isn’t a factor at all. I sail a 1980Laser at our club but the kids wouldn’t be seen dead in it, they all have brand new ones. I cruise and race a Westerly GK 29 that cost me £5000 plus the cost of refurb but is probably almost worthless. And why race a Sonata, which you can buy for about £2000 when you could do just the same in a J70 for £70,000?

 

[Stemar]

And why race a Sonata, which you can buy for about £2000 when you could do just the same in a J70 for £70,000?

Because I haven't got a rich Daddy

 

[Egret]

Different on the East Coast where the biggest fleets now seem to be the Sonatas - SB3's and similar now gone, replaced by Sonatas - with that keel you either want one for the racing, or you don't.

Brilliant thing about the Laser is that with a newish sail the old ones are just as quick as the new ones - people used to buy new boats but end up in the same place in the fleet - hope you are able to show the youngsters the way around -

 

[potentillaCO32]

And i bet you have as much fun in your gk29 as someone who spent 100k plus. Never before have we been able to buy a good cruiser racer and refurb it for less than the cost of a five year old car. Who cares if it isnt worth much at the end.

 

[Dellquay13]

duplicated

 

[Blueboatman]

A lot of people cut their teeth in s/h Corribees, which have always been pretty affordable.

I discovered, much to my surprise, that once you get to Southern Europe and/ or the tropics , a fair wind is a fair wind for all boats going the same way and they all move along pretty well.

And here’s the absolute kicker:
You live in the cockpit/on the beach/exploring and meeting folk once you get to warm sunny climbes!
The cabin is for sleeping in for a few hours and perhaps a discrete wash and brush up and cuppa.

And now, these self same small boats are literally being given away.

When the cynics say “cruising is fixing stuff in exotic places”, chortle chortle , ah well.

Keep it simple, keep it small, don’t be flash, don’t buy endless kit - and GO!

I did .

 

[seeSimon]

"peoples expectations have changed since the 1980s" YES they have, gone down, a postman, milkman or building site labourer could buy their own house, back then, without it being struggle.

From my observations, however, many of those same folk are nevertheless likely driving new (rented) cars or vans, spending £100s monthly on mobile phones and/or "personal grooming"/gym subs.

Had a builder here recently, brand new Transit Custom (crew cab, of course) looking like Beckham clone, finished at 1600 so as to get to the gym. Half day Fridays...self employed!

It's about choices...imho.

Fairly sure he wouldn't be aspiring to a Centaur!

 

[capnsensible]

I reckon that anybody golden age of yachting was whatever they were doing in their 40s and 50s. Whenever that was.

 

[johnalison]

I don't want other people enjoying the thing I enjoy doing is not a great advertisement for the fraternity of sailors.

The fact that more people can enjoy it can be seen as an advantage in some ways, but its very popularity threatens to destroy much of what made sailing attractive, and the OP suggested that we are living in a golden age, when in many respects this isn't the case. There was a time when I fancied visiting places such as Macchu Pichu or Petra, but the pictures of these places packed with tourists shows that any sense of wonder I might experience is highly unlikely be something I can realistically expect. Much of the reward of any adventure is the sense of achievement, and today's large seaworthy yachts complete with creature comforts and GPS, like the holidaymaker's easy flights and transfers to tourist sites suggest that we are now living in an iron age for the many, in contrast to a golden age for the few. It is not a case of one being 'better' than the other, just that change also comes with disadvantages.

 

[RupertW]

Wow, someone on this forum who admits to nights out in Browns! I’m impressed at the honesty, but the media police might start knocking on a front door shortly

I worked for 5 years in offices above Browns (Printing House Yard), and admit I went once but it was very dismal, especially with the surviving real pubs nearby then, like the Flying Scud with it’s extensive menu of pasty and chips or pie and chips.

 

[Sailing steve]

I am reminded of the adage.. "some get a boat because they have money.. others don't have money because they have a boat." I know which camp i am in

Man on quayside: "What a lovely boat, you must be a very wealthy man to be able to afford that"

Man on boat: "I was before I bought the bloody thing"

 

[flaming]

I may have posted something like this before.

When I first started sailing in the mid/late 80s in my late teens i looked at the westerly centaur as the popular family cruising boat and good ones were about 10k then. Similar for something like a sadler 26. Family boats were smaller then.

According to google, or AI, or something 10k in 1986 equates to around 40k now.

Yet it is possible to buy a very good centaur or westerly griffon for 6 - 7k. I saw one advertised for sale today with a 2004 engine and clearly well looked after for 7k. With the current market you could probably offer 5k and the seller would bite your arm off.

This is pretty recent, a sort of very gradual decline in prices from 2010 until covid which triggered a boom when you could ask silly money for anything, followed by a baloon pop of real vengence. To the extent that boatyards are scrapping biats at a rate of knots that they have never done before.

So for sailors this is the golden age. I know people say that it is madness paying 5k per year for a berth on a boat not even worth that, but it means that it is possible to get on the water and have fun for less in real terms than I spent on an evening out in Browns in Shoreditch in the 90s.

It is possible to get a seaworthy, comfortable boat, that has been looked after that is capable of crossing the channel for next to nothing.

I see this as a golden age of sailing. Far more accessible than it has ever been before. I don't think people see it, in the same way that most people never see the bottom of a market as a buying opportunity.

If boatyards keep scrapping boats at the rate they are doing then in a few years there will be more of the decent ones left and the supply/demand balance will start to return to normal.

My message is to those looking to buy, buy now and enjoy the value. It won't last.

I think the issue with the cheap boats now is that if you buy a boat for sub £10k, then you have to assume that in 5-10 years time when you want to sell it you won't be able to and you'll end up scrapping it. You'd be very. very unwise to assume that you'll get any money back when you sell it. You might get lucky, but if you're in budgeting mode you have to have that assumption now I think.

So yes you can buy a 40 year old boat now for not much money. But your running costs will be no lower than a brand new boat of the same size - probably slightly higher as you will inevitably need to replace things - but your depreciation is likely to be 100% of your ownership period.

 

[potentillaCO32]

I think the issue with the cheap boats now is that if you buy a boat for sub £10k, then you have to assume that in 5-10 years time when you want to sell it you won't be able to and you'll end up scrapping it. You'd be very. very unwise to assume that you'll get any money back when you sell it. You might get lucky, but if you're in budgeting mode you have to have that assumption now I think.

So yes you can buy a 40 year old boat now for not much money. But your running costs will be no lower than a brand new boat of the same size - probably slightly higher as you will inevitably need to replace things - but your depreciation is likely to be 100% of your ownership period.

I think a tad pessimistic. If you bought a well looked after 10k rival 32 or nic 32 now and carried on looking after it then i cant believe it wouldnt be worth much different to what you paid for it in ten years.
I think once a boat gets to 15 years old maintenance gets to the same. Rigging, sails, engines all consumables.
Running costs of a brand new boat are enormous if you factor in depreciation. If you stick with 32 foot, a new one fully equiped is going to be close to 200k. If you sold after 10 years how much would you lose?

 

[Chiara’s slave]

I think a tad pessimistic. If you bought a well looked after 10k rival 32 or nic 32 now and carried on looking after it then i cant believe it wouldnt be worth much different to what you paid for it in ten years.
I think once a boat gets to 15 years old maintenance gets to the same. Rigging, sails, engines all consumables.
Running costs of a brand new boat are enormous if you factor in depreciation. If you stick with 32 foot, a new one fully equiped is going to be close to 200k. If you sold after 10 years how much would you lose?

Depreciation is certainly a thing on new boats. But I don’t think anyone wants old Nic 32s or similar. There are plenty for sale at low prices, and the ones I know of have been on the market for a long time. You need to know you want to get anywhere via the slow lane, it’s a minority interest. You can buy a pretty sprightly Hanse for only a couple of grand more.For 99% of cruisers, it’s a better boat.

 

[Chiara’s slave]

Wise people know the truth of the old adage. It’s not the initial outlay, it’s the upkeep. A manky old boat, or a slightly less manky one, similar outgoings. One still has a shine to it’s gel coat and an appearance of being from the 21st century. If you keep a boat 10 years, that’s £200 a year for the better buy.