Madryn
New member
Thanks for that. It looks like a well laid out form.
Useful passage plan format and check sheets
- Thread starter oldfatgit
- Start date
Madryn
New member
I know (see the second paragraph of my original post). Thanks for putting a number to it though. ?
Madryn
New member
Either that or he's still filling out his passage plan from 12 years earlier?
Apparently by the time he was (only) 24 pages from the end some of the MCA rules had changed and he had to start again.
On his 15th attempt now and almost there but had some bad news that his boat has now sunk due to lack of maintenance.
Madryn
New member
Yes. I used to use the Reeds one but the one stu linked to looks much better.
Madryn
New member
I agree absolutely about the pointlessness of passage planning for an afternoon's boating around familiar waters, in a world of common sense.
Let's hope the option to employ common sense like that always remains.
The dilemma is that the less effort we (the boating community) put into guarding against things going wrong the more they consequently will do over enough time (law of averages) and the more likely it is that eventually someone will remove our right to common sense, and it will be self inflicted, even worse!
A few years ago there was NO REQUIREMENT to have to do a plan at all. But so many people choose not to bother that now it IS a requirement (even if not a written one.... yet. Logically that will be next if the "refusers" continue).
If something goes wrong one day in which loss of someone's life results (yes, that even happens in familiar waters in the afternoons too) and the authorities want you to prove it wasn't your negligence, what do you do?
If you didn't write down something to show that you know what you're doing for to you clear any accusations against you, all the blustering in the world won't help you.
Even if the plan is no more then checking the tide times and making sure you have enough fuel in the boat to get back with. That constitutes a passage plan where appropriate.
But if you didn't write it down properly and there's an enquiry that you (perhaps wrongly) get dragged into. What will you tell them?
SERIOUSLY, what would YOU actually tell them?
You already did the right thing for your afternoon afloat but for the sake of 2 minutes writing, you can't prove it.
Then next year the MCA reviews all the previous years incidents and says "to many accidents (in their view) time to make EVERYONE'S lives more miserable by enforcing a whole new load of stuff".
Then we all lose.
In all likelihood the only reason passage plans (written or not) are now a legal requirement when they weren't just a few years ago is because of enough scenarios like the one above, over a long enough time.
If you've already done the work in your head, write it down and get the benefit of it when you need it. Otherwise you've done 90% of the work for only 50% of the (potential) gain. And if something goes wrong often enough we all lose.
Anyway. There it is. I realise there will always be people who won't see it that way and I'm sure I'll be hearing from them shortly. But the point remains those same people have so far been one of the reasons the rest of us are having to work harder and harder every year just to enjoy our hobby.
I may have to leave the forum as an outcast after writing all this of course but I'm really just trying to head off yet more future government interference for all of us.
Surely that's a good thing?
LadyInBed
Well-known member
This is my 'Day Sail' log but I use it for longer trips as well these days.
This is the one I used to use (Filofax size):
This is the one I used to use (Filofax size):
Daydream believer
Well-known member
I am not sure that is the case - indirectly
It has always been the case that the skipper of a vessel is required to act ina responsible manner with respect to- The vessel. Other vessels, his crew & the crew of other vessels
Am I correct in that assumption? If I am not then read no further.
If, however, I am, then a passage plan , or a programme appropriate to the trip that the vessel is about to make, was just as important then than it is now. In fact without the aids from modern navigation & communication equipment, along with forcasting etc. currently available, it was probably much more important. A change in conditions would mean that changes to original trips would be harder to make. I am sure that in the event of an enquiry questions would have been asked.
I would , therefore, suggest that it has always been a requirement to have a passage plan in some form.
The difference now is that with leisure sailing becoming so much more available to the community, it has become obvious that to some, this prior preparation has been ignored. Possibly because the age of electronics has given the skipper a false sense of security. It seems to me quite justifiable that the authorities have to do something to bring to the attention the need to take care. Requiring a plan appropriate to the trip proposed is not unreasonable. What is the problem with clarifying the legal situation?
The sheets shown above may, to those presenting them, seem excellent. I would suggest that for 95% of trips they are unnecessarily detailed & time consuming.
In most cases a notebook with a few points to aim for, some tidal info & the relevant chart with the course pencilled in & a bearing jotted down is more than enough. I often write notes on my charts. The courses stay on the chart for future use, so saves time.
I make a table of tide directions & times with departure & arrival times,( the same set of sheets lasts years) then I do a list of turning points, distance & bearing. I make mental adjustment for tidal offset as I sail.
A passage plan really is no big deal & doing one is actually part of the fun of making a trip.I certainly do not look on it as an imposition.
DFL1010
Active member
As with most things in life, there's an M Notice for that:
MGN 599 (M) Pleasure vessels - Regulations and exemptions - Guidance and best practice advice
From para 2,
"The following requirements apply to all vessels, irrespective of size. If a vessel owner or operator is involved in a boating accident and it is subsequently established that the basic principles outlined in this document have not been applied, they may be breaking the law and could ultimately face prosecution. "
The best way to show that the basic principles have been applied? A decent, written passage plan.
And for an example of what a decent written passage plan doesn't look like, see para 1.8.3 here:
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5b30ee7d40f0b67f8511a514/2018_-_12_-_CV24.pdf
Of course, that was a commercial vessel that was also racing, but you get the general gist I'm sure.
MGN 599 (M) Pleasure vessels - Regulations and exemptions - Guidance and best practice advice
From para 2,
"The following requirements apply to all vessels, irrespective of size. If a vessel owner or operator is involved in a boating accident and it is subsequently established that the basic principles outlined in this document have not been applied, they may be breaking the law and could ultimately face prosecution. "
The best way to show that the basic principles have been applied? A decent, written passage plan.
And for an example of what a decent written passage plan doesn't look like, see para 1.8.3 here:
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5b30ee7d40f0b67f8511a514/2018_-_12_-_CV24.pdf
Of course, that was a commercial vessel that was also racing, but you get the general gist I'm sure.
WLane
New member
I like a passage plan for something out of the ordinary. It helps me think it through and can be handy for reference.
As far as the legalities, it's exactly the same as writing a workplace risk assessment. You can have the best plan in your head, but if the poo hits the fan, all the HSE (insert MCA or your other chosen acronym) will want to see is your paperwork as they seek to apportion culpability.
Doesn't mean I often bother with a risk assessment for everything, but I know at the back of my mind I probably should.
As far as the legalities, it's exactly the same as writing a workplace risk assessment. You can have the best plan in your head, but if the poo hits the fan, all the HSE (insert MCA or your other chosen acronym) will want to see is your paperwork as they seek to apportion culpability.
Doesn't mean I often bother with a risk assessment for everything, but I know at the back of my mind I probably should.
Madryn
New member
I agree with you entirely. "Passage Plan" has probably just had it's definition changed in the heads of officials more recently. It is at least certainly now more of a formalised (and explicit) legal requirement shall we say?
And your point is also well made that mostly all that's necessary is a simple record of your intentions and awareness.
Not "bothering" to make some effort to *show* you've at least thought about it is not helpful however, and is all the excuse the authorities need to restrict us more and more each year as a result.
My initial interest in the OPs offer of a more complex form was simply that I am considering a significantly complex trip later this year so I have been interested in exploring the relative efficiency of more complex "aid memoires" for preparation, having the sort of brain that seems to work better if "channelled" in a more structured way.
barkwright99
New member
I like to plan my sails regardless of any legal obligations, looking at the distance, tides, weather etc...
My preferred template is the one from Ardent Training (its the one I used when learning to sail, not that you ever stop learning). I don't always fill in every single box, but I have a few in a folder. They have a few useful printouts like this:
Sailing Advice, News, and Lessons by Ardent Training
My preferred template is the one from Ardent Training (its the one I used when learning to sail, not that you ever stop learning). I don't always fill in every single box, but I have a few in a folder. They have a few useful printouts like this:
Sailing Advice, News, and Lessons by Ardent Training
