alahol2
Well-known member
For we Southern softies the Needles channel can be a killer in the right (wrong?) conditions.
UK’s top 10 (or 11?) fiercest tidal races (YM)
- Thread starter dunedin
- Start date
Stemar
Well-known member
OK, I've never sailed further north than the Deben, but I get the impression that most races are only dangerous in the wrong conditions, though Portland may well be an exception; as a confirmed coward, the only times I've gone round Portland Bill, I stayed several miles off shore. I went across the Alderney race in a RIB; going, it was a flat calm, coming back, it was a bit of a rollercoaster, but not nasty and the one time I went through the Raz de Sein, it was like a millpond until you looked at the SOG. Again, I've seen pics of it when even golf looks like a very attractive alternative.
Anyway, not a race, but as a place and weather not to be, I would offer Chichester Bar with a spring ebb and a southerly gale.
Anyway, not a race, but as a place and weather not to be, I would offer Chichester Bar with a spring ebb and a southerly gale.
ryanroberts
Well-known member
Hit 11kt SOG delivering the boat from Guernsey, taking the western route around Alderney near Casquettes in a 6-7 also proved to be a little more lumpy than I was accustomed to at the time. Having been able to see the waves from the plane should have given me a clue right.
oldharry
Well-known member
A friend was one time skipper of an RN MInesweeper. They had been on many deployments round the world (it was in the days when the Navy could still afford fuel for the ships to go and wave the flag). He reckoned in 8 years, the Needles was the only place he had had solid green water in the Wheelhouse. A French Corvette was capsized and sunk in the Needles channel towards the end of WW2, with the loss of all hands. So its not so much of a pussycat.
If we are discussing killer tide rips, then add Chichester Bar, which has claimed a number of boats and lives over the years. I knew one victim who was thrown out of his cockpit. We did tell him he shouldnt go, and when he insisted we tried to tell him he should at least clip on.
I would also add Bardsey Sound. I have had 5.5kts on the log and still been going backwards at a brisk 1.5+kts. It has its own whirlpool too on the N side. Local lore says its dangerous even to an AWB in anything over bottom end of F4. I once also had to retrieve an badly secured anchor from half way up the forestay out there in a F3. (It wasnt my boat I hasten to add!)
Martin&Rene
Active member
As others have said, I consider the waves and the turbulence are the problem and not just the speed of the water. I found Ken Endean's book "Coastal Turmoil" (ISBN 978 1 4081 2702 5) an excellent book to help me understand what goes on in races and also to help me predict when and where the problem will be.
Last time we went round the MOK, I was glad were were going to Ballycastle and not up to to Gigha, as even a moderate NW was kicking up some good waves at the stopping line further north up the Sound of Jura.
As I have read the YM, all I will say is that they have some races that have not been mentioned yet. The article was a good read. I have Multimap with their UK charts and Antares charts on my tablet, so it is always interesting to look at the detail.
Last time we went round the MOK, I was glad were were going to Ballycastle and not up to to Gigha, as even a moderate NW was kicking up some good waves at the stopping line further north up the Sound of Jura.
As I have read the YM, all I will say is that they have some races that have not been mentioned yet. The article was a good read. I have Multimap with their UK charts and Antares charts on my tablet, so it is always interesting to look at the detail.
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Guessing this is the No. 11. Actually maxed at 16.9 SOG.
oldmanofthehills
Well-known member
Only time I have had foredeck dip underwater and the cockpit fill up to my armpits. Should have gone via the North Channel but I followed someone in South Channel thinking locals must know best. The joys of delivery runs. Came out well in the end and she sailed reasonably enough with a half ton of water on board if a bit sluggish until we bailed her tediously with saucepans. (lessons learned - check bilge pump, hatch security and cockpit drainage if previous owner just used to fish and potter)
AngusMcDoon
Well-known member
Pentland Firth is so excessive compared to all the others in speed, width, ferocity and openess to ocean swell that numbers 2 and onwards don't matter. The chart warns of tidal streams up to 16 knots in parts.
steppygas
Member
noelex
Well-known member
Pentland Firth gets my vote for number one as well
C08
Well-known member
At the N end of Bardsey Sound I have seen a "step" in the water about 3 ft high. I did not like the look of it at all and turned around and went around the island...where we got a real pasting!
savageseadog
Well-known member
I've done most of the Welsh races and Bardsey is the one that seems less predictable. I've been there it fairly benign weather yet the tripods were gushing breaking pyramids of water.
25931
Well-known member
The Wyre at Fleetwood might not be very spectacular but I used to find it exciting enough for me in an old, wooden 19 ft centre boarder with a 5hp ob .
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AntarcticPilot
Well-known member
Between Rathlin Island and the mainland is not to be tackled at the wrong state of the tide. Even at the best time, it has strong Eddie's.
oldharry
Well-known member
Yes, the race goes a long way south of the Island on the west side on the ebb. Its a very long detour if you opt out of going through, as you probably found! Like many races, by the time you have got to the entrance, there's no turning back!
LadyInBed
Well-known member
I only know my local S coast and NW France races and always try to transit them on benign days so not encountering their full wrath!
I used to dive over in NI so one that I would put on my list is the entrance to Strangford loch, even on a calm day the overfalls are impressive.
I used to dive over in NI so one that I would put on my list is the entrance to Strangford loch, even on a calm day the overfalls are impressive.
Bobc
Well-known member
I did a race from Cherbourg to Dielette last year, and the post at Cap de la Hague was a course mark where we were all dropping the kites and heading upwind (southerly wind that day). A number of boats didn't keep enough way on going past the post whilst dropping the kite and ended up being swept backwards into the post by the tide. Very funny to watch but glad I wasn't on one of those boats.
dunedin
Well-known member
So the YM list of “Fiercest Tide Races” (in clockwise from The Solent order, rather than strength) is:
1) Portland
2) Lizard
3) Lundy Island
4) Jack & Ramsay Sound
5) Anglesay
6) Rathlin Island
7) Mull of Kintyre
8) Kyle Rhea
9) Pentland Firth
10) Sumburgh Roest
And
11) Alderney Race
Certainly some serious tidal races in there - including some most serious such as Pentland Firth and Sumburgh (Orkneys and Shetlands respectively).
And having seen Portland in a full gale (from ashore) it is certainly up there.
But the “spectacular” omission is Corryvreckan - definitely one of the most spectacular (and extensive) tidal races in the U.K., particularly when meeting the full Atlantic Ocean swell from the west. (Though not a problem if sensible about only going outbound into both moderate winds and swell, done it lots of times safely.)
Yet oddly Kyle Rhea is included - sure it goes pretty fast, but both ends in much more sheltered waters so rarely anything worse than a 5 minute splash, and only when coming southbound into a strong Southerly. This wouldn’t be in my top 5 (10?) even in Scotland, and certainly much less serious than Chichester Harbour on an ebb, for example.
But some great posts on other tidal races around our coasts. Take care exploring them
1) Portland
2) Lizard
3) Lundy Island
4) Jack & Ramsay Sound
5) Anglesay
6) Rathlin Island
7) Mull of Kintyre
8) Kyle Rhea
9) Pentland Firth
10) Sumburgh Roest
And
11) Alderney Race
Certainly some serious tidal races in there - including some most serious such as Pentland Firth and Sumburgh (Orkneys and Shetlands respectively).
And having seen Portland in a full gale (from ashore) it is certainly up there.
But the “spectacular” omission is Corryvreckan - definitely one of the most spectacular (and extensive) tidal races in the U.K., particularly when meeting the full Atlantic Ocean swell from the west. (Though not a problem if sensible about only going outbound into both moderate winds and swell, done it lots of times safely.)
Yet oddly Kyle Rhea is included - sure it goes pretty fast, but both ends in much more sheltered waters so rarely anything worse than a 5 minute splash, and only when coming southbound into a strong Southerly. This wouldn’t be in my top 5 (10?) even in Scotland, and certainly much less serious than Chichester Harbour on an ebb, for example.
But some great posts on other tidal races around our coasts. Take care exploring them
dunedin
Well-known member
Absolutely agree. Can’t think of anywhere else that can be so atrocious that it has overwhelmed even a 80m cargo ship as recently as 2014, sadly with the loss of the entire crew. MV Cemfjord - Wikipedia
Not one to be blasé about.
jimi
Well-known member
I’ve never really thought of the Lizard as a tidal race, I’ve been airborne there once in a F5 but I’ve thought of it more as a wave compression zone! Likewise with Start Point,Bolt Head, Prawle, Dodman etc