Trader fuel efficiency?

[Orange]

It's mostly to do with how the space is used. The Elling has much of its living space below. The pilot house is really quite small - fine at sea but not large enough for much socialising. Also take a look at how the beam is used. I am not sure of the differences but you may well find that Traders carry their beam further forward, creating more volume. Trader aft decks are also more useable than Ellings as they are covered providing protection from the elements, either rain or shine! Some Ellings may have aft deck biminis to provide a degree of protection.

Thanks, I do like the Trader aft decks. Just about every Elling will have the bimini as it's included in the "Ultimate" extras package which is on every Elling I've seen advertised bar one.

We very much appreciate everyone's thoughts & advice with this.

 

[MapisM]

I do like the Trader aft decks.

It's impossible not to. :encouragement:
That alone, together with the aft cabin, made their 575 a good enough boat for us to actually decide to buy one.
Eventually, the deal didn't materialize, for several reasons (long story).
And in hindsight, I don't regret that - for other equally good reasons.
But I must give to Caesar what is Caesar's: for living aboard spaces, Traders are hard to beat!

 

[paul salliss]

It's impossible not to. :encouragement:
That alone, together with the aft cabin, made their 575 a good enough boat for us to actually decide to buy one.
Eventually, the deal didn't materialize, for several reasons (long story).
And in hindsight, I don't regret that - for other equally good reasons.
But I must give to Caesar what is Caesar's: for living aboard spaces, Traders are hard to beat!

Plus must 2nd one point. A decent aft cabin is a lovely thing. Gonna miss my one

 

[Nigelpickin]

It's impossible not to. :encouragement:
That alone, together with the aft cabin, made their 575 a good enough boat for us to actually decide to buy one.
Eventually, the deal didn't materialize, for several reasons (long story).
And in hindsight, I don't regret that - for other equally good reasons.
But I must give to Caesar what is Caesar's: for living aboard spaces, Traders are hard to beat!

+ 1 and of course plenty of room to house and throw around full size domestic appliances.

 

[MapisM]

+ 1 and of course plenty of room to house and throw around full size domestic appliances.

ROTFL!

 

[Orange]

+ 1 and of course plenty of room to house and throw around full size domestic appliances.

You're perfectly correct about the plenty of room, but to be fair, an Elling has a fridge/freezer, microwave, dishwasher, oven, ceramic hob & washer/drier. All full size.

 

[Nigelpickin]

You're perfectly correct about the plenty of room, but to be fair, an Elling has a fridge/freezer, microwave, dishwasher, oven, ceramic hob & washer/drier. All full size.

I'd buy the E4 over the 42 or 525 every time - I might have gone for one with our next change but my wife was not so keen. I really like the Elling.

The athwartships layout of the master cabin makes a great space even better imo and of course you can find far newer examples for sale than you can Traders. Finding a stabilised model might prove difficult but they do exist and I think is very much a high priority as far as I understand.

The biggest pay off is as Richard points out, ythat ou lose that amazing sun lounge on which I spent many very pleasant evenings last season.

But there's something about an E4......

 

[IDAMAY]

Each to his own Nigel and I also think the Ellings have a lot going for them, amongst which is a super high quality build and a tardis like interior. BUT, and it would be a no, no for us, the saloon down, is very gloomy AND you don't get the sun lounge. Your point about the availability of more recent Ellings is potentially very relevant dependent upon the OPs budget.

I wouldn't consider any of the possible candidates without stabilisers as that would likely result in spending more time at higher speeds with consequent negative effect on fuel consumption. IMHO in that case a planing boat would be a better bet.

 

[Orange]

Budget would be about £250k.

I've not seen any Ellings advertised with stabilisers though.

 

[stillwaters]

I'd buy the E4 over the 42 or 525 every time - I might have gone for one with our next change but my wife was not so keen. I really like the Elling.

The athwartships layout of the master cabin makes a great space even better imo and of course you can find far newer examples for sale than you can Traders. Finding a stabilised model might prove difficult but they do exist and I think is very much a high priority as far as I understand.

The biggest pay off is as Richard points out, ythat ou lose that amazing sun lounge on which I spent many very pleasant evenings last season.

But there's something about an E4......

I think this shows that it surely comes down to which aspects of a particular boat grab you, and I've no doubt that each of these have advantages and disadvantages over the other. And although I too find much to like about Ellings, I'm not sure that a Trader 42 should so easily be overlooked as a comparison to them. And the T42 is surely far closer than the even bigger but older Trader models to either the E3 or E4, both in terms of internal volume and weight of construction, in that it exceeds both of these Elling models, certainly in weight but possibly also in overall volume.
Sure, the unusual double saloon layout of the Ellings will possibly be seen as more practical to some, however, having spent some time on 3 different Ellings and spoken to a number of other owners, most say that they hardly use the lower saloon as it is too isolated, and wish the upper one was larger. Of course, this is just their opinion and the OP and others may actually prefer this arrangement.
I also struggle to see quite what advantage the E3/4 master cabin has over that of the T42, which if anything is surely larger and more practical than that of the Elling.
I personally think that stabilisation would be useful on either make, however, because of the lack of space to fit any extras like this on an Elling, bearing in mind that they don't have an engine room as such, with the single engine being mounted under a galley worktop, I'm not sure how possible this would be. I do know, however, that with the sizeable walk-in engine room of the T42 - which is amazingly practical, it is possible to fit either fin or gyro stabs, and Sleipner fins are now actually being offered with new builds. And there again, the T42, introduced in 2007 is also still being built, and typically costing less than the initially more expensive Dutch build - and you even get 2 engines.

 

[Nigelpickin]

Agree with all of that, all things that Ann pointed out to me every time I suggested that we buy one!

 

[Orange]

Very useful thoughts from everyone, thank you.

It's wifey who loves the Elling, I'm trying to be practical & getting her to consider a Trader because of the space. We both do like the Elling's looks & safety aspects. The Elling fuel efficiency is attractive to us. I like the Trader's engine room, the space & the fact that there are many for sale offering a good price.

 

[stillwaters]

Budget would be about £250k.

I've not seen any Ellings advertised with stabilisers though.

That budget would suggest either E3s from around '05-06, or maybe an '07-08 T42. I think the E4 was introduced around '08 and likely to cost somewhat more. I dare say you already know where to search for any of these, but just in case you haven't found this source of Dutch boats, here's the link -
www.botentekoop.nl
De Haer Nautique have also been one of the specialist Elling brokers for some time.

 

[Orange]

That budget would suggest either E3s from around '05-06, or maybe an '07-08 T42. I think the E4 was introduced around '08 and likely to cost somewhat more. I dare say you already know where to search for any of these, but just in case you haven't found this source of Dutch boats, here's the link -
www.botentekoop.nl
De Haer Nautique have also been one of the specialist Elling brokers for some time.

Thank you, I had not heard of Botentekoop I will check in with them. I have been in touch with De Haer Nautique who seemed a little "short" in their response - which could be down to language. I've also been in touch with Elling brokerage themselves who have been very helpful. There's an E4 from 2004 in budget & an E4 from 2005 over budget, the rest on our list are E3s. I'm not sure about the Trader 42, a Trader 445 may be better as I would want a dry helm. The T42 only has a flybridge I think?

 

[Bloater]

I've not seen any Ellings advertised with stabilisers though.

Here's an Elling E4 fitted with a stabiliser. I think it's the only one so far. I don't think they can be retrofitted as they have to move stuff around to accommodate it under the bed. It's also expensive though - this Gyro Seakeeper 5 was around a £50k option I believe.

 

[Nigelpickin]

http://seatrials.seakeeper.com/trials/view.php?id=78&iframe=true

Oh sorry bloater, posts crossed!

 

[Orange]

£50k, yikes!

The new E6 has a gyro fitted as standard, but it's well out of our league!

 

[stillwaters]

Thank you, I had not heard of Botentekoop I will check in with them. I have been in touch with De Haer Nautique who seemed a little "short" in their response - which could be down to language. I've also been in touch with Elling brokerage themselves who have been very helpful. There's an E4 from 2004 in budget & an E4 from 2005 over budget, the rest on our list are E3s. I'm not sure about the Trader 42, a Trader 445 may be better as I would want a dry helm. The T42 only has a flybridge I think?

Although most Dutch speak very good English, quite often they find it more difficult to write it, so phone calls tend to work better for them.
The T42 has been produced in 3 guises, the majority as command bridges and only 2 so far with flybridges. The Trader website shows more info, including the 2 or 3 cabin layouts which are optional. www.tradermotoryachts.com
I'm not certain you'll find a semi displacement boat that will remain dry in all conditions, for semi-d read WET - however, they do tend to make up for it with their greater versatility - but if you do find one, be sure to let the rest of us in on it.
Btw, I'm not sure I would get too hung up over stabilisers either - great if you can get them, but loads of us have managed quite well without them for years, some of us even without the slightest sign of sea sickness.
Having said that, as I don't always practice what I preach, I'm currently planning to switch from my own T42 to something bigger - and with stabilisers - if I can find anything that is - and if the silly buggers would stop screwing with the pound!

 

[stillwaters]

Here's an Elling E4 fitted with a stabiliser. I think it's the only one so far. I don't think they can be retrofitted as they have to move stuff around to accommodate it under the bed. It's also expensive though - this Gyro Seakeeper 5 was around a £50k option I believe.

I've actually recently been quoted £50k to retro fit one under a bed on my T42, however I think it might have been possible to knock maybe £10k off this elsewhere, mainly by reducing the installation cost.

 

[acheter]

Thanks for the pic. I think I've seen the same image. Nice figures!