Those New Navigation Light Piles Outside Portsmouth.

[Giblets]

Andy, as you obviously have a major issue with the new posts (and they ain't going to be taken away just 'cos Seajet doesn't like them) perhaps you could let us know your prefered method of making them more visible/noticeable bearing in mind that, even if the whole column was painted yellow, in thick fog you still won't see them! Your same argument could surely apply to any navigation mark yet we don't hear of yachts and small boats hitting those on a regular basis in fog do we.

I find you comment regarding correcting paper charts via LNTMs very strange.

Out of interest are you aware that both the Outer Spit Buoy and the Saddle Buoy have been permanently re-positioned in the past few weeks. I doubt if these moves show up on any plotters yet.

 

[Seajet]

Andy, as you obviously have a major issue with the new posts (and they ain't going to be taken away just 'cos Seajet doesn't like them) perhaps you could let us know your prefered method of making them more visible/noticeable bearing in mind that, even if the whole column was painted yellow, in thick fog you still won't see them! Your same argument could surely apply to any navigation mark yet we don't hear of yachts and small boats hitting those on a regular basis in fog do we.

I find you comment regarding correcting paper charts via LNTMs very strange.

Out of interest are you aware that both the Outer Spit Buoy and the Saddle Buoy have been permanently re-positioned in the past few weeks. I doubt if these moves show up on any plotters yet.

Pete,

it's pretty simple;

as these things aren't on a plotter chart yet, and difficult to spot visually, paint the bloody things yellow.

Seems to work warning yots & fishing boats with cardinal marks and at firing ranges like Aberporth & West Freugh...

Cannot reply further as a bit ill...

Andy

 

[wizard]

The new posts are not on any electronic charts I'm aware of - so are instantly a big problem, especially for less experienced boat owners, who may have made the responsible effort to get a plotter.

Some of them are already on iSailor!

 

[prv]

as these things aren't on a plotter chart yet, and difficult to spot visually, paint the bloody things yellow.

For the benefit of non-locals, who haven't seen these things, I re-post the photo from earlier in the thread (click to expand)

View attachment 60117

...and note two points:

1) They are not difficult to spot visually, they are bleedin' massive.

2) The part of them to be found in front of a yacht is already painted yellow.

Pete

 

[Giblets]

Some of them are already on iSailor!

They are indeed but only 'cos I added them to my charts manually. Are you saying they have been added to the actual charts as well?

 

[prv]

They are indeed but only 'cos I added them to my charts manually. Are you saying they have been added to the actual charts as well?

They're on Navionics as "Community Edits". So not on the official charts yet, but available to anyone who has that layer turned on (and has downloaded the updates).

Pete

 

[dom]

They are indeed but only 'cos I added them to my charts manually. Are you saying they have been added to the actual charts as well?

The 3-pole yellow structures have been clearly depicted on the Navionics chart since June. I think however these charts have yet to be updated in relation to the recent moves of the Outer Spit, Horse Sand and Saddle Buoys.

 

[Lucky Duck]

They can be seen from as far a way as Cowes!

 

[Seajet]

They can be seen from as far a way as Cowes!

With what, the Hubble telescope ?

It's rather inventive to say the things are massive and easy to see; in poor vis they are anything but, and the yellow bits are just above sea level - not in sight from a distance or in fog.

Still, some cyclists think black lycra shows up well, so maybe we're back to that argument; if you think having the upper 2/3rd bits grey is a spiffing idea. good luck.

 

[prv]

Pete

 

[Blue Sunray]

With what, the Hubble telescope ?

It's rather inventive to say the things are massive and easy to see; in poor vis they are anything but, and the yellow bits are just above sea level - not in sight from a distance or in fog.

Still, some cyclists think black lycra shows up well, so maybe we're back to that argument; if you think having the upper 2/3rd bits grey is a spiffing idea. good luck.

DIO will get complaints either way - if they'd done them in high viz orange they would have been inundated with emails about the eyesores they had created. Still it makes for something different to talk/read/argue about which is nice as the evenings draw in.

 

[capnsensible]

It's rather inventive to say the things are massive and easy to see; in poor vis they are anything but, and the yellow bits are just above sea level - not in sight from a distance or in fog.

What colour is best in fog?

 

[Lucky Duck]

If these posts are a menace to yachts owing to their near invisibility then best get rid of West Pole, Chi, Bramble Beacons as they must be a similar hazard

 

[Seajet]

What colour is best in fog?

Well, with your steely eyed hunter - killer periscope experience, you should know; I'm guessing if one actually WANTS to be seen it's not grey.

 

[capnsensible]

It was a joke.........

 

[Blue Sunray]

What colour is best in fog?

Something loud?

 

[prv]

If these posts are a menace to yachts owing to their near invisibility then best get rid of West Pole, Chi, Bramble Beacons as they must be a similar hazard

... and all other navigation marks, other yachts, most motorboats - really anything smaller than Spitbank fort or a feeder container ship.

I reckon the optician's appointment is probably simpler, on balance.

Pete

 

[Seajet]

Yeah,

forget ' common ' sense and the fact those posts are a hazard when going for the Dolphin Passage in poor vis - and the other marks mentioned are on paper and electronic charts - just have a go at someone stating the obvious...

I've probably been around the Solent more than most here, I just reckon things should be well marked in the 21st Century - but that's too easy for armchair smartarses.

 

[Lucky Duck]

I seem to recall that you were arguing that the barrier was also inadequately marked both visually and on the charts so why would you be attempting it in poor viz?

 

[Topcat47]

I sail in and out of Portsmouth Harbour " all the time ". The piles are covered by HWS Tides, leaving only the yellow skeleton tops above the water. I "know" where they are. HOWEVER, in daylight and poor vis they do not stand out. I first noticed this on a grey drizzled day. When returning from a long trip, it is quite possible that vis could be very poor by the time I arrive. It wouldn't stop me proceeding into my home harbour, but I don't have either Radar or a cockpit plotter and single handed, I would be piloting myself home, not navigating by chart. Someone visiting Portsmouth as opposed to based here may well not see them or even be aware of them. There's no point in assuming everyone will have a set of up to date charts or saying "serves you right" if someone bumps into one. Comparisons with the submarine barrier or the pile marking the edge of Ryde sands are specious as these "hazards" have been charted for a century or more.

Painting part of the piles that lie above LWS, might be nice but in a short while marine growth would obscure the colour, as it does with piled marks anywhere.