There goes next season?

[Lucky Duck]

Not wising to rain on your tirade parade, but this quasi-legal analysis is disingenuous and ill-informed. First, Premier Marinas have not banned people from visiting their vessels, they are simply trying to apply new laws as they appear.

As for vague legal notions of judges, enforceability, and contract law, wrapped up in a "they can't tell me what to do attitude" .......this is plain silly, the country is in the middle of a viral sh*t storm, people are dying, businesses are wobbling, the little critter is mutating, and the drug companies are working every hour god sent.

If the OP wants to do something on his boat, he just needs to call Premier, agree a lawful visit, and if not possible ask them to help which they will. Then mail them a Christmas Card with a nice bottle of wine and save the lawyers fees

Why would he want to talk to Premier when he doesn't keep his boat in one of thier marinas?

The new regulations dont require marinas to close so thier application in this case is mistaken.

 

[dom]

That is not the case, some government advice suggests that is so but it is not supported by the actual regulations.

Provided the test of a "reasonable excuse" is met there is no restrictions on travel.

Some people seemed keen to invent similar restrictions back in November

Whatever his marina, my advice would be to forget the legal eagling, talk to them and negotiate a solution agreeable to all.

 

[Daedelus]

Premier offered a reduction in marina fees for the last spring lockdown (admittedly for the following year which is not a lot of help - I couldn't go there then and who knows what will happen next year).

 

[38mess]

Whatever his marina, my advice would be to forget the legal eagling, talk to them and negotiate a solution agreeable to all.

That's the way to go about it. How would the op react if his contract wasn't renewed and he was required to find moorings more suitable to his needs?

 

[Frogmogman]

Still, plenty of folk would swap their COVID problems for my insignificant ones..

Thank you for saying this Wully. I’m sure I’m not alone in this forum in having seen my business (a pub in France) decimated by Covid. My business has so far made a loss of about €100 000 this year. I have maybe enough cash to keep things going until after the summer.

The inconveniences being moaned about seem trivial in the extreme, compared to those who are losing their jobs or their business.

As to the boatyards, well, if a boat is there, surely the rent is due, just as it is for a business that has been obliged to close, unless the landlord chooses to forego the rent out of goodwill.

 

[Lucky Duck]

That's the way to go about it. How would the op react if his contract wasn't renewed and he was required to find moorings more suitable to his needs?

If the OP chooses to find a new marina I am sure members of this forum will be happy to 'introduce' him to take advantage of the benefits of the relevant scheme. For 'boat folk' that is currently £500 each.

As noted in other threads, the Competition and Markets authority has ruled that refunds are due.

 

[dom]

Thank you for saying this Wully. I’m sure I’m not alone in this forum in having seen my business (a pub in France) decimated by Covid. My business has so far made a loss of about €100 000 this year. I have maybe enough cash to keep things going until after the summer.

Hopefully Easter will see some return to normality. BTW are there not some quite generous French Government schemes to help keep small businesses afloat?

Either way, you might want to put the name of your pub up here if close to saily land and us lot could stop-off for a non-virtual pint plus create some possibly helpful marketing buzz? ??

 

[SaltIre]

I downsized a few years ago, so don't have any storage costs. Boat got relocated from the bedroom to the garage, which is only fair! Enjoyed some racing at a local marina in August & September, in groups of up to five and have been match-racing since. The marina is pretty empty of boats, most ashore now, and when I raced on Monday the pontoons were deserted - so social distancing is easier than before. It is surprisingly good fun. Most of us have grey hair!

 

[Frogmogman]

are there not some quite generous French Government schemes to help keep small businesses afloat?

They have certainly
done a very good job of spinning how much help they are dishing out.

the furlough scheme has covered most, though not all, of the wage bill (though not a penny for me, as I have self employed status). I have to cash flow the wages, as I generally get reimbursed about 6 weeks after I’ve paid the staff.

The business received nothing else until October, when I got €1500 in aid against a loss of turnover for the month of approx €40 000. We have been locked down again since 30th October; we were entitled to € 10 000 against a loss of turnover of € 84 000, but were paid out another €1500; I’m now fighting them for the other €8500. For December we’re entitled to 20% of lost turnover, so about €18 000 (which is more like it, but I’ll believe it when I see it).

i have applied for a business loan of 125 000 which is interest free for two years and is guaranteed by the state. These loans, however, are subject to the usual credit criteria of any other business loan. Were my business a young one, already carrying a high level of debt, the dossier would be unlikely to be accepted.

so in answer to your question, I don’t find it particularly generous. Between me and my pub, we generally collect or contribute about €350 000 to the French state every year. We’ve been going since 1997. The quid pro quo seems quite thin.

 

[SaltIre]

Between me and my pub, we generally collect or contribute about €350 000 to the French state every year. We’ve been going since 1997. The quid pro quo seems quite thin.

Do you run a pub or just drink a lot in one?

 

[Frogmogman]

Do you run a pub or just drink a lot in one?

? Reminds me of when one of my kids was small, and was asked by her teacher what I did. She replied that I spend all of my time up the pub.

 

[dom]

They have certainly
done a very good job of spinning how much help they are dishing out.

the furlough scheme has covered most, though not all, of the wage bill (though not a penny for me, as I have self employed status). I have to cash flow the wages, as I generally get reimbursed about 6 weeks after I’ve paid the staff.

The business received nothing else until October, when I got €1500 in aid against a loss of turnover for the month of approx €40 000. We have been locked down again since 30th October; we were entitled to € 10 000 against a loss of turnover of € 84 000, but were paid out another €1500; I’m now fighting them for the other €8500. For December we’re entitled to 20% of lost turnover, so about €18 000 (which is more like it, but I’ll believe it when I see it).

i have applied for a business loan of 125 000 which is interest free for two years and is guaranteed by the state. These loans, however, are subject to the usual credit criteria of any other business loan. Were my business a young one, already carrying a high level of debt, the dossier would be unlikely to be accepted.

so in answer to your question, I don’t find it particularly generous. Between me and my pub, we generally collect or contribute about €350 000 to the French state every year. We’ve been going since 1997. The quid pro quo seems quite thin.

Wow, stories from the front-line are always so different to the State PR Machine

Hopefully 2021 will be super-prosperous for the business and you can start repairing the storm damage
?

 

[sgr143]

OK - please refer to my original post where I was just lamenting not being able to ge to my boat. If you want to debate the rules and regs please start another thread. Good wishes and hopefully happy sailing sometime next year

Just so. For most of us on here, what we are talking about is a hobby, and one that we've decided we can afford. If we can't get sailing as much as we'd like, either in 2020 or in 2021, due to circumstances beyond our control, then we just have to live with it. There are worse things by far happening at the moment. If we do want to go sailing next year and beyond, we'll need (most of us anyway) the shore-side facilities, both physical and staffing, to make that possible or at least easier. I don't imagine that running a boatyard or marina or other leisure marine-based business is exactly a quick way to get rich; margins must be quite thin even in normal times. So when I have to cough up my mooring fee, I'll do my best to do so with good grace and a smile. I'll get to the boat when I can, sail when I can, (I hope) be grateful that I'm still around and in reasonable health to do so; and look forward to visiting my usual haunts and maybe some new ones, with the moorings, pubs, staff, fuel berths, chandleries and so on still there.

Oh, I am being the cheerful fairy today, aren't I?

Steve

 

[SaltIre]

? Reminds me of when one of my kids was small, and was asked by her teacher what I did. She replied that I spend all of my time up the pub.

My son's class in P1 were threatened with:

If the behaviour in this class doesn't improve I'll be writing to some of your parents asking them to come and see the Headmaster.

Well don't bother writing to my parents - my Dad's a Doctor and he won't be able to come...

 

[Sandy]

So far they reckon 500,000 people have

received their first of two doses.

 

[Never Grumble]

received their first of two doses.

Yes if read my post fully you will see I am aware of that as I mentioned my wife has had the first jab and is due to go back for the second booster in mid-January.

 

[stuartwineberg]

#

If the OP chooses to find a new marina I am sure members of this forum will be happy to 'introduce' him to take advantage of the benefits of the relevant scheme. For 'boat folk' that is currently £500 each.

As noted in other threads, the Competition and Markets authority has ruled that refunds are due.

thats news to me. Can you point me at the relevant threads

 

[RupertW]

This year we started with a lovely 10 day cruise over New Year (getting to Lanzarote wasn’t a problem then), but were able to grab the window between waves and get out for 7 weeks in July and August for a truly wonderful cruise around the other Canary Islands.
No idea when we can get out again but not soon so very grateful for just two visits but great sailing.

 

[RJJ]

Not wising to rain on your tirade parade, but this quasi-legal analysis is disingenuous and ill-informed. First, Premier Marinas have not banned people from visiting their vessels, they are simply trying to apply new laws as they appear.

As for vague legal notions of judges, enforceability, and contract law, wrapped up in a "they can't tell me what to do attitude" .......this is plain silly, the country is in the middle of a viral sh*t storm, people are dying, businesses are wobbling, the little critter is mutating, and the drug companies are working every hour god sent.

If the OP wants to do something on his boat, he just needs to call Premier, agree a lawful visit, and if not possible ask them to help which they will. Then mail them a Christmas Card with a nice bottle of wine and save the lawyers fees

I quite agree that any amicable resolution is preferable. Wine, Christmas cards if you like, why not.

But you're wrong. Per post #13, clarence is said to be imposing its own private lockdown measures. There is no law for them to apply and even if there was, there is no requirement for the yard to enforce it. There is I believe no need to telephone the yard ahead of a visit.

Please do show me which law you think the yard is bound to apply here, since this may affect me in due course.

It's also got nothing to do with how and where people are dying, whether a vaccine is on the way or not, or whether your mum's dog's vet has Coronavirus. If the OP, or any of us, figures it's within their legal rights to go to their boat then it's a matter for them. If "caught" then it might be a matter for the police and a court of law. But it's nothing to do with the yard, whose obligation remains to support social distancing and hygiene measures.

 

[Adios]

But it's nothing to do with the yard, whose obligation remains to support social distancing.

I can't think of anything more supportive of social distancing than allowing people to sail their boats. Though I did see a lady solo sailing a dinghy wearing a face mask a while back so not everyone agrees its distanced enough.