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Congrats. Not my thing, but mine is no doubt not yours. If we all liked the same thing the world would be a very dulll place...
The sublime and the ridiculous - boatshow
- Thread starter Birdseye
- Start date
mattnj
Well-Known Member
Interesting..... thought it may have been a bigger DF..... Enjoy
lustyd
Well-Known Member
95% of the people in this country leave behind a tin of chickpeas they bought in 1974 and a duvet, slighty stained. The threshold is very low compared to the cost of normal assets - average house price only appears low due to the sheer number of crap houses being built with no land. Unfortunately the truly wealthy are trained from very young on how to maintain wealth and avoid taxes. The rest of us have to learn the hard way since for some reason the tax return isn't on the national curriculum. Instead, the poor are told repeatedly they should save money in accounts returning well below inflation!
[2574]
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Duplicate. Deleted.
Frogmogman
Well-Known Member
Italy also had something similar. It was a good way to finance a boat, as the VAT reduction pretty much covered the interest payments.
Unfortunately that scheme has been closed by an EU ruling. It worked on the idea that a boat equipped for offshore use could be considered to be offshore half of the time, so half price vat could be levied. The EU’s response (eventually) was to suggest pulling the other one, as it had bells on it.
The other reason it was attractive to French buyers, was that under the old wealth tax (ISF), a lease was seen as a liability, whereas a classically owned boat was perceived a capital asset to be included in the wealth sums.
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
People often comment how good my Hanse looks actually. Quite "classic" for an AWB
Although at 18 years it is becoming classic in its own right I am sorry to say.
But apart from that, I still think that the example shown is rather poor, regardless of what my own boat looks like.
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Tranona
Well-Known Member
Yes, even in earlier times they did not show much of them simply because the market in the UK is small.
westernman
Well-Known Member
Beneteau have taken over the Slovenian company Seascape and continue to make those boats there but now sell them as Beneteau Firsts.
E.g. this fast 24 footer:-
First 24 SE - Sailing yachts For Sale | BENETEAU
flaming
Well-Known Member
Ah, but you see the problem there is that the experts on this forum have spoken, and boats like that are entirely unsuitable as cruising boats. They have open sterns, and might plane...
New Benjenbav - spot the difference
Poignard
Well-Known Member
Better not let my wife see that. It is not always easy maintaining the fiction that a Twister represents the ne plus ultra of boating comfort and convenience.
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Bouba
Well-Known Member
I’m glad of that, because when I see yachts people huddled around a cramped table outdoors in the cold and dark and insects, while I’m watching tv in the salon on my electric recliner sofa, they don’t look happy....?
geem
Well-Known Member
How the life time on the sofa been for you?I’m glad of that, because when I see yachts people huddled around a cramped table outdoors in the cold and dark and insects, while I’m watching tv in the salon on my electric recliner sofa, they don’t look happy....?
Lightwave395
Well-Known Member
People often comment how good my Hanse looks actually. Quite "classic" for an AWB
Although at 18 years it is becoming classic in its own right I am sorry to say.
But apart from that, I still think that the example shown is rather poor, regardless of what my own boat looks like.
I was a bit disappointed in Hanse back in 2014, I delivered a brand new Hanse 505 from the factory back to UK, it was incredible value for a 50 footer and while it sailed nicely the freeboard took some getting used to, particularly the leap of faith down to the water level pontoon in the lock at Kiel and the climb back on board. Many bits flew off it in the choppy Baltic seas, the owner is a friend of mine and over the years since it's been sorted into a nice boat, still seemingly worth around what he paid for it, although you do get what you paid for, not a round edge in sight on any woodwork, I described it as an IKEA boat but amazing value.
Elemental
Well-Known Member
That doesn't seem too bad to me - How much do you expect to pay for a 31ft yacht? My 34 ft 1993 Beneteau Oceanis 351 cost £66204 inc VAT when new in September 1993. According to the Hargreaves Lansdowne Inflation Calculator that equates to £144,939 in today's money.
dom
Well-Known Member
Gary Fox
N/A
My 34' LOD gaff cutter cost me £27k, and is considerably faster and better behaved. (I have delivered an Oceanis 361 up to Sweden).
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
I agree, The push for low cost & trying to make the design more "modern" has not - in my view- worked well. I do not think that the build quality is as good as those built in the 2003-2006 era either. At least it was not for a period. That may have now changed & I understand that Hanse may have got a grip again.
However, a friend of mine has a 445 & loves it. But my son has sailed on it & whilst he says it is great on deck working the many sails the owner has bought, going down below with nothing to hold on to is a difficult. He further commented when returning from the Royal Temple YC they were caught in heavy rain. The owner took off his soaking wet shirt, & with nowhere to put it, ended up laying across the saloon table
As for cockpit tables- We have had lots of fun events around the outside table with its inbuilt drinks fridge, when on club cruises & would never knock that part of the design. There is always the cockpit canopies if required.
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
If you do not know how to sail it properly then it always will go slow.Obviously the motion will be different.
It has already been proven earlier in this thread how much slower gaffers are than modern boats .
But to each his own & if one enjoys sailing their gaff rigged boats then great. Just be carefull with the exagerations.
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
That is a grand statement. Can you enlarge on it please, Like what bits & how many?
( ignore the glass of scotch, although of major importance, not what i am looking for
)Tranona
Well-Known Member
But today's equivalent, the just announced Bene 34.1 has a base price of around £180k. Its Hanse equivalent the 348 at the show with a reasonable spec was £185k.
See post#42. Up to 3 years or so ago we had a long period of stable prices in real terms, from the late 90s (with the odd lumps mainly from currency fluctuations) the result of massive increases in volume and investment in better and lower cost production methods. Now volumes have fallen (particularly in smaller sizes), material costs have gone up and prices have risen by roughly 35% since 2015 and likely to rise at least 10% in the coming year. The Bene 30.1 is a very simple boat built in Poland. 5 years ago similar boats were under £80k - the sailaway price of the new boat is £109k. The show boat was loaded with extras like expensive sails hence the high price.
