Tensioning removable stays

[rwoofer]

I'm currently having a detachable inner forestay fitted so that I can use a staysail and stormjib. The rigger says that I have two options for tensioning

1) Highfield lever type thingy. Apparently you need to be v. strong to actually do this up to a decent tension, so the rigger thinks only blokes will be able to do it. It also has an advantage that you can set it up so that it won't overtension in the stored position (which is only a simple padeye) Price about £200!

2) Twist adjustor. This can be done up by anyone, but has the danger you can overtension in the storage position and pull the eye out of the deck. Price about £500!!

Now both options seem expensive, but £500 is way to much so I feel I'm forced down the lever route.

Does anyone else use a highfield lever and is it really that difficult to tension properly?

Alternatively are there other reasonably priced options available?

 

[salamicollie]

Use a highfield lever on current and previous boat. You can get some serious tension on them - the secret is keeping your fingers out the way as you close /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif - I have started pulling up the deck eye with one.

i've found that generally sufficent tension for a storm sail can be had with a force on the lever that most adults should manage.

 

[FullCircle]

Discussing this with Crusader Sails the other day.
We came to the conclusion that you can fit 1 24:1 boom kicker setup (from something like a 35 footer) on the end of the forestay, then hook it to a pad eye with a Gibb shackle to the deck, lead the line aft through a deck jammer, and winch it home. Should be able to get plenty of tension on that, as the loads on main kickers gets very high.
I am going this route for my new boat, and will trial it. Cost should be less than 100 quid even if you use Dyneema. The other thing I thought of was to have a stainless wire safety strap between forestay and deck, in case the kicker setup slips, then you wont lose it.
We shall see.


Jim

 

[pappaecho]

On old Thames barges and similar, they used a simple block and tackle arrangement to provide the tension for a storm jib. The forestay proper should hold up the mast. the secondary forestay is to provide a "runner" for the staysail or storm jib, and a 6:1 arrangement should be fine. If you use a Highfield lever, I would expect the tension to cause bending of the mast as both the top and bottom of the mast are fixed, so you will get a longbow effect.
My Evasion has a baby stay, and so presumably the designer of the rig, expected the baby stay to provide some bending moment in the foward direction.
In summary if the boat was not designed to have a baby stay, then I would have thought that a block and tackle arrangement would provide quite enough tension ... again on Barges, the storm jib has plough wire sewn in, so the jib was already attached to the secondary forestay

 

[Talbot]

Wichard make a number of different solutions (all of them good) see here

 

[Phoenix of Hamble]

At 24:1 I'd be amazed if you need to winch it....

I occasionally sail a performance dinghy called a 49'er. On this, with an 8:1 we bend the top section of the mast forward by a good 3 feet, and its a fairly meaty mast with caps and lowers....

bearing in mind that the inner forestay is in addition to the normal forestay, and all you are trying to do is get enough tension in the inner forestay that the storm sail luff sets properly, a 24:1 would probably be tensionable by hand..... or in the worst case, put a small loop in the tail, and stick your foot in it and push down.....

 

[Shantyman]

I would be seriously worried if I thought the pad eye would move at all, let alone part company with the deck.

Don't think about purchasing a purchase until you have got the structural bits sorted.

I have used Highfield levers and at least with them you can get a much better idea as to how much weight you are putting on.

Regards,

Shantyman.

 

[rwoofer]

Only the storage padeye risks being pulled out as it simply has a backing plate to it. The main padeye will be braced against the bulkhead at the back of the anchor locker.

I think the issue is more to do with the size of my boat (44ft and 11 tonnes) and simply the fact that the adjustors needed to generate enough tension are not cheap. I might take a look at the prices of the Wichard tensioners (although in my experience Wichard stuff is v. expensive, albeit top-notch quality)

Has anyone used a highfield lever for a boat > 10 tonnes

 

[ShipsWoofy]

To those with highfield levers,

how often do you trap lines or stub toes on them. This is a serious question, it seems quite an easy contraption to aid limping back to the cockpit, is it?

 

[William_H]

A highfield lever requires strength to operate it to tighten the stay in proportion to the length of the handle and to the distance the load point on the lever is away from the pivot. So if you had a handle 30cms long (from the pivot) and the load point was 30 mm away from the pivot then you get a 10 to one advantage at the least advantagious part of the motion. As it approaches home position the advantage becomes many more times. So theoretically like any lever and load can be tightened if the lever is long enough and the position of the load on the lever is small enough. Note the position of the load determines the amount of travel (shortening of the stay) which is twice the distance the load is from the pivot. (so the example above will mean the stay is 60 mm longer when you attach the stay to the deck than when it is tightened home.
For your purposes the highfield lever would be good however the length of the stay ( the end tension) can not be adjusted so it would be very critical to get the stay length right or better fit a turnscrew (twist adjuster) as well. Perhaps using a 6 purchase rope tackle would be easier and certainly you could have plenty of slack when attaching however for real strength (I mean in a storm not in applying static tension) the turnscrew and or highfield lever would be more robust. I wouldn't recommend the turnscrew alone as they take a long time to tighten and unscrew. I use a highfield lever on my forestay on trailer sailer with very effective quick attachment detachment. Highfield levers are easy to make or have made at an engineering shop. The trick is to make a cardboard replica so you can get the dimensions right. PM me if you want more details.. I wonder if Ships Woofy is refering to a lever mounted on the deck The type I refer to stand up in line with the stay and a piece of poly pipe could be dropped over if you worry about sails catching. regards will

 

[Thistle]

I've used Highfield levers on dinghies. They are great for putting on a repeatable amount of tension so that you can set up the rig the same way time after time. I find the worst thing about them is trying to get some control as they are released: any ideas?

 

[Guest]

My system is to use a Highfield lever, but to use the forestay only as an aid to hoisting the sail (for which purpose it is indispensable). I have fitted a dedicated Spectra halyard, and all the tension is provided by this and the wire luff of the sail - neither stretch, and once hoisted the forestay is largely redundant. It is easy in this way to get a really crispy straight luff even in really strong winds.

There are two practical considerations to bear in mind. If you are going to be fitting a forestay on a pitching foredeck in a rising gale, then it is impossible to close the Highfield lever if it adjusted to be tight when closed- this is because when the forestay is pitching back and forward the forestay's weight has loads of momentum - try it and you'll see what I mean. What was easy to close in harbour becomes pretty much impossible at sea.

The other thing is that, even given plenty of slack, fitting the blasted thing is still a very challenging operation in itself in a bumpy sea, let alone hanking on the storm jib, sheets etc. The thought of also having to tension a forestay doesn't bear thinking about. If you have a Spectra halyard run back to the cockpit to a decent winch as on my boat's system, then the tensioning can be done easily from the cockpit.

 

[Shantyman]

Further to my previous posting:

I worked with Highfield levers on a 45 ft cutter rigged edwardian yacht with narrow side decks and we didnt fall over them all the time (The levers, that is). They were used for the running backstays.

I sailed with the same chap on a 45ft ocean racer and we used to tension the runners from the cockpit using a self-tailing winch and a patent stopper. The rope was marked with tape so you could tell how much tension you had on it.

I think this could work well for rb_stretch on his baby-stay. All you would need to buy would be a patent stopper and perhaps a couple of stout blocks. You could lead it to an existing suitable winch.

Of course you would have to be absolutely certain that the stopper was secured to an adequately strong part of the ship.

A cost-effective solution?

Cheers.

Shantyman.

 

[Graham_Wright]

The one by Seasure looks ok but is priced around £170 which seems a lot for what it is. I bought a much superior one at Bealieu for £20. Can you wait? You could also consider a pelican hook which are much cheaper.