Strobe lights- a mariners request.

[capnsensible]

Simple really, please do not use them!

There seems to be a relatively recent fad to fit and operate flashing lights at night. This is very much contrary to the International Rules for The Prevention of Collision at Sea (IRPCS). Some boat owners appear to be under the somewhat misguided delusion that they are more visible and therefore safer.
Please note that whilst ones eye may be drawn to a flashing light, you are actually in more danger!!
The IRCPS provide a compulsory and unambiguous system of lights to allow the millions of seafarrs to determine another vessels type, aspect and direction of travel. With some training, a modicom of experience and good sense, most people will be able to recognise whether a risk of collision exists and what avoiding action should be taken. This is the whole point of having rules.
Unfortunately, in most circumstances, the strobe light will not allow this decision to be quickly processed and may well increase the risk of collision.
Aware that this may be controversial in these parts, I decided to post this anyway as I feel quite strongly about it as a safety issue. Promted by a recent incident coming up the Western Approaches in a rising gale!!!
Safe sailing all.

 

[Loginname]

What was the incident? We could learn from it.

FWIW I had a strobe on my boat though it has now been replaced by a tricolour which I thought would be more useful.
I may refit it sometime.

I wouldn't use it routinely but I always felt that it would be useful to attract attention if it looked as if somebody hadn't seen me. I never had to use it in that situation.

Beyond that it proved to be very useful when talking to marina staff on the radio ("I'm over here, with the flashing light") and at Regattas when everyone has a silly five minutes when the fireworks are finished!

I also thought it could be useful for helicopter or lifeboats to "get a visual" on me at night. Thankfully, I have never been able to put that to the test.

I think they could also have a use inshore to avoid the problem of confusion against shore lights or stars.

I think they do have a use but you are right; they are not legal.
I think they are legal in the States, presumably on their waterways.

 

[Salty John]

Strobes are only illegal in the sense that they are not navigation lights and shouldn't be used as such.
Having a strobe light at the masthead as a means of signalling in very specific circumstances has always seemed a reasonable idea to me. A bit like flashing your headlights to attract attention, I suppose.
I can think of many instances where such a facility would have quickly cleared up confusion in a potential collision situation. Travelling up Chesapeake Bay at night is a case in point - you are in close company with a lot of commercial traffic; I would always engage the commercial traffic by VHF just to make them aware of my presence and in several cases the big ship captain would ask me to flash a bright light so he could get me visual, or he would pick me out with his searchlight. A quick flash of a masthead strobe would do the job very efficiently, I think.

 

[lenseman]

Strobes at sea is similar to the numpties who use their hazards on the motorway whenever they slow-down. I have noticed that it is only the cars that are travelling at excess speed and have to break violently who use them to indicate that they are slowing down.

The highway code states quite clearly that hazard warning lights are only to be used at the scene or an accident or breakdown.

 

[Loginname]

[ QUOTE ]
A bit like flashing your headlights to attract attention, I suppose.

[/ QUOTE ]

Which is what I was trying to say....but you explained it more effectively. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

[wotayottie]

Are strobes illegal? I would have thought not, unless you were using one instead of nav lights rather than as an addition. Or if they could in any way be confused with buoy lights. Does anyone know?

You see lots of non colreg lights on a boat, from the floods of the fishing boats to the flashing blue lights of sea-dibble.

 

[BrendanS]

colregs define the lights you can use very exactly. Strobes are only allowed for a very few vessels, and that usage is defined. Far easier to understand what is happening at night, if vessels actually use the lights they should.

 

[wotayottie]

so where in colregs do you find the spec for deck lights for example? or porthole light? or sea-dibbles blues and two?

you dont cos colregs specifies only nav lights. my idea is that allows you to use whatever lights you want in addition. or does it?

 

[capnsensible]

OK, I recognise that for the vast majority of leisure sailors, a deep knowledge of the rules is not strictly necessary. I hope forums like this, bringing such concerns to skippers attention as a group will be helpful.
For those with an enquiring nature, try Rule 36, Signals to attract attention.
The last sentence reads 'For the purpose of this Rule the use of high intensity intermittent or revolving lights, such as strobe lights, shall be avoided.

Is easy to google this one!!

My own view remains that they are a complete pain in the @rse and are of absolutely no benefit to mankind at all!!

 

[capnsensible]

Rule 20 (b)

 

[BrendanS]

Have you actually read colregs, as it seems you perhaps haven't?

 

[Loginname]

Good point.

I had to look this rule up! Rule 20b says :
"The Rules concerning lights shall be complied with from sunset to sunrise, and during such times no other lights shall be exhibited, except such lights which cannot be mistaken for the lights specified in these Rules or do not impair their visibility or distinctive character, or interfere with the keeping of a proper look-out."

I imagine that the stumbling block is that a strobe could be mistaken for something else and, in that sense, is therefore illegal.

As far as I'm concerned it's not appropriate to use a strobe as a "routine" light, whether with conventional Navigation lights or not. I do, however, think that they can have a use in certain circumstances but the user needs to make sure it doesn't cause confusion.

 

[wotayottie]

go on - save me the effort of looking it up. what does 20b say?

Bl h*ll ! In the time it takes me to type a short reply someone has already posted the answer. Is this pre-cognition?

Yes I have read the colregs and many times, but sadly my memory has disappeared along with my hair and waistline.

So how do the marine police get away with flashing blue strobe lights?

 

[Captain Coochie]

[ QUOTE ]
So how do the marine police get away with flashing blue strobe lights?


[/ QUOTE ]

Cause they have a siren that goes " nee naw nee naw " to go with it /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[wotayottie]

To be semi serious for a moment, would you bother what colregs said if doing something different, like using a strobe, would make you safer? Seems to me that that is the real question - does a strobe help or not?

Personally, I think it would if used at the right height and along with the correct nav lights. The distance you can see a xenon strobe has to be far greater than the usual incandescent bulb in a tricolour.

 

[Loginname]

Being seen is only part of the equation. If they don't know what you are then it causes confusion.
Personally, I don't think that a strobe should be used in the way you are suggesting.

Going back to rule 20b and your comments about deck lights.
I have seen many commercial boats not complying with this rule. The deck lights frequently outshine the navigation lights to the extent that you just can't see the things.

 

[BrendanS]

If cruising transatlantic, and if a large vessel does not appear to have seen you, I might have one wired up to backup powerful handlamp and flares. If in or around UK or other congested coastlines, no, I'd rather they can see my navigation lamps, and make an accurate guesstimate of my speed and heading, and I'd use handlamp or white flares to make my presence known.

Would never use strobe as a standard practice.

 

[Loginname]

[ QUOTE ]
So how do the marine police get away with flashing blue strobe lights?

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe they operate a local rule under Rule 1 of Col Regs....if not it would be fun to tell a Chief Constable that his officers are operating illegally!

 

[BrendanS]

in the UK, local bye laws usually cover such usage. Tho not always.

 

[capnsensible]

Quote:
Seems to me that that is the real question - does a strobe help or not?

No it absolutely does not and that is the point of my post in the first place!!!!!!!
From the vantage point of having spent many thousands of hours looking at the lights on vessels of all sorts. Hope this helps to cllear that up.