Sort out those Marina prices in Spain..

Plomong said:
then tell them to get stuffed.
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And the very best of luck to him.

Presumably he will be exercising this argument in our Queens English where he will be met by lots of shrugging of shoulders, answering phones, and simple walking away.

Pretty soon he will encounter the scam of putting his boat on a 20m berth (as the 14m berths are full) - and being charged for 20m.

Try arguing your way out of that one.

He should also be aware that, as in Palma, there is a Guardia Civil office on the marina. Whose side do you think they will take?
 
Nostrodamus said:
It was a good night the other night watching the footy with you and Captain Sensible.
There were also some exciting stories about the swell in marina bay and lines breaking. I am told that Queensway is worse.
We did get a price for Marina bay and it was slightly more expensive.
There was alsoa boat anchored outside the inner harbour in La Linea that dragged and ended up on the rocks.

I was aware of all the charges but it would be so much easier if there was just an upfront price you had to pay rather than quoting a price, adding IVA, adding T5 charges, taking away a discount, adding water and electric standing charges and taking them away for the period you are not on the boat.
Apparently the T5 charge is a national charge but many of the marinas just include it in the bill.
All I wanted was some plain English... well Spanish.
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You would have fun in the Far East where many hotels etc quote all prices as + + + to cover various local taxes, and as you passed through France did not some places add a per head local tax to your bill according to the size of the boats crew.
 
Plomong said:
They can only take the side of the law, if they don't want to get bitten from above. No GC wants to have a stand-up interview without tea and biscuits with his boss, so will be very careful before siding with any marina or port.

Plomong
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:D:D:D What has Law got to do with it!

Are you seriously suggesting that the GC is going to side with a non-Spanish speaking yachtsman who is going to claim that the marina agreed he could use a 20m berth for his 14m boat and only pay 14m prices when the marina say that they told him he would have to pay the correct fee for the berth???
 
And your argument to paying a navigation tax and light dues is exactly what?

You've never used any of the harbour lights, light houses, navigation bouys etc when cruising around Spain? Do you stick you head in the sand like 90% of UK yachtsmen and think it's somebody else's job to pay for them? Sorry it about time us Brits woke to to the fact that other countries expect every vessel to pay for what they use and it's upkeep.

As others have said nothing is hidden, it's all on their various websites (often in English as well), it's on the paper work (possibly in Spanish, but then you are in Spain!), nothing hidden just a bit of ignorance on the OPs side.
 
Plomong said:
Nostrodamus,
It is my understanding that the T5 tax only applies to motor boats 9m and above, and sailing boats 12m and above. But I may be wrong, as Andalucía is a world apart.

If what I say is correct, the marina is applying it to your sailing boat because it has a motor, and that is not correct, as your motor is not the primary means of propulsion but rather an auxiliary motor. Check if what I said above is true, then tell them to get stuffed.

Plomong
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I believe the above is the T2 tax and not the T5. T2 refers to the lights.
Before coming to La Linea I e mailed them for a price and was given one. I then e mailed back and asked if taxes had been added. She said no and gave me another price. Finally I asked for a price with everything included + the discount.
I was not being ignorant when we came here and knew the exact price we would be paying.
What I am saying is that a clear pricing policy would be far fairer and easier to follow. As I said.. basic price (depending on time of year as winter rates do not start until 1st November here) + IVA + T5 + water and electricity standing charges - discount !!!!!!!
Apparently T5 is charged everywhere and should be shown separate on any bill. This bit seems to have been misinterpreted so most marinas will include it in the bill but not refer to it.
I don't believe the T2 tax is applicable to us because of our size but that can be quiet expensive.
 
Ariadne said:
And your argument to paying a navigation tax and light dues is exactly what?

Sorry it about time us Brits woke to to the fact that other countries expect every vessel to pay for what they use and it's upkeep.

.
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UK Yachtsman have so far been fortunate, I think three or four times now we have been through the loop of trinity house (AKA the treasury) looking at getting leisure boats to contribute to the costs of navigation marks and each time the RYA have persuaded them that it would cost more to collect than the revenue derived. Its only a question of time though......
 
Been having a brief look at this years mooring fees.

Alcaidesa is the only one that itemises the T5 tax. 76 cents/day.

All prices for a 36ft yacht, Spain marinas.

Average on Costa Del Sol, 25 euro summer, 19 winter. Sotogrande bit more at 36.

Beyond Estepona, wifi is not free and between 3.50 and 7 euros a day (costs in Alcaidesa too).

Interestingly, most expensive this year was Cartagena, 47 euros and most expensive wifi at 7.

Marinas Junta Andalucia, no wifi, 22 euros for 45 foot, summer, 36 foot, 14 winter.

Melilla outrageous at 6 whole euros!!!

Hope this helps.

CS
 
Nostrodamus said:
La Linea at the moment which is the first time we have come across the T5 tax.
We were told that it is something the government make all marinas pay on top of the IVA.. This makes it approx 28% on the basic price plus water and electricity and wi fi!
Anyone know anything about this T5 tax?
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This is a "tasa" on the use of pleasure port facilities. Calculated by a formula using a base cost per sq m and day of occupancy, multiplied by a coefficient or two based on the type of berth (harbour wall, swing mooring, mud mooring, pontoon with or without finger, etc) and available services (water, electricity). Then there are variations for ports that are not concessions and those that are, berths that are hired and those that are leased, etc. All quite complex, but not too difficult to interpret for a specific case and autonomous region. To put it all up here would require translating over a dozen different regulations all of which seem to have the above calculation as their basic philosophy, but with differences in the minor details, coefficients applied,, base or general tariffs, etc.

As for "tasa" T2, that is for "passengers", and defined for ferries and commercial vessels, not for crew on pleasure boats. So don't pay T2 for anyone aboard your boat as they are not fare-paying passengers. Be careful with this one when filling out any forms in a marina -- everyone aboard is crew (tripulación) not passengers (pasajeros, or collectively: pasaje).

Plomong
 
jimbaerselman said:
Nostrodamus,

Your comments about marina prices bring to mind Ryan Air and Easyjet pricing policies. And, for that matter, UK power supplier tarifs. Oh yes, and Mobile phone tarifs . . . and . . .

It's called "hide your high prices by spreading confusion":confused:
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Ah! Easyjet and Ryanair have been forced to curb their most excessive hidden charges - but they're still more expensive on a like-for-like basis with BA.

LHR-ATH-LHR for £132 all in, and if I'd booked slightly earlier it would have been £108!!

I'm afraid boaters in Spain are going to find an increasing # of extra charges for various local taxes as the provincia attempt to claw back their deficits.

So it's not only a Greek trait, lack of forethought...
 
maxi77 said:
You would have fun in the Far East where many hotels etc quote all prices as + + + to cover various local taxes, and as you passed through France did not some places add a per head local tax to your bill according to the size of the boats crew.
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All departments have a local tourist tax, sometimes ignored in marinas but always levied in hotels and apartments. It varies between €0.23 and €0.81.head/day from my experience and has been in operation for at least a quarter-century.
 
charles_reed said:
All departments have a local tourist tax, sometimes ignored in marinas but always levied in hotels and apartments. It varies between €0.23 and €0.81.head/day from my experience and has been in operation for at least a quarter-century.
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Which was why I was surprised the OP had not complained about that one too, perhaps he is a closet francophile. I am sure I should remeber the froggies introducing the tax, perhaps to much vin rouge
 
maxi77 said:
Which was why I was surprised the OP had not complained about that one too, perhaps he is a closet francophile. I am sure I should remeber the froggies introducing the tax, perhaps to much vin rouge
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The thing is with France that the price quoted did include tax and you always knew each port would ask for the one or two euros on top for the people on board tax (well, some asked for it and some didn't).

The Spanish just add the tax on after they have given you the price and it is the first time we have come across T5.
Wouldn't it be nice in an ideal world to see a price and know that is what you will be paying. However as we all know the world is not ideal.
 
Nostrodamus said:
The thing is with France that the price quoted did include tax and you always knew each port would ask for the one or two euros on top for the people on board tax (well, some asked for it and some didn't).

The Spanish just add the tax on after they have given you the price and it is the first time we have come across T5.
Wouldn't it be nice in an ideal world to see a price and know that is what you will be paying. However as we all know the world is not ideal.
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The reality though is every one is different, that is what makes the world an 'interesting ' place. If everywhere was like the UK wouldn't the world be a boring place. Only a few weeks ago you were complaining about the Algarve being to much like the UK now Spain is not like the UK, difficult for us normal mortals to keep up
 
maxi77 said:
The reality though is every one is different, that is what makes the world an 'interesting ' place. If everywhere was like the UK wouldn't the world be a boring place. Only a few weeks ago you were complaining about the Algarve being to much like the UK now Spain is not like the UK, difficult for us normal mortals to keep up
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I don't believe I compared Spanish marinas to English ones... All I want is for a price quote to include everything in clear language.

It is normal mortals like you that I one day aspire to... :D:D
 
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