longjohnsilver
Well-Known Member
It's another toy to impress visitors to the boat! Can't really see much more use for it on our size of boats.
So is anyone else installing...
- Thread starter Ballistix
- Start date
gjgm
Well-Known Member
yea, presumably AIS was to assist big ships, not little ones.
There could be an occasion it might be of use on a leisure boat, but things cant be going too well, if you are down to relying on your AIS to stop you being hit/hitting something.
There could be an occasion it might be of use on a leisure boat, but things cant be going too well, if you are down to relying on your AIS to stop you being hit/hitting something.
RogerRat
Well-Known Member
The more I read, the less interesting it becomes...
Nobody sems to think it a high priority on here and boating along the south coast with mostly being in or near the Solent seems even less important at the moment.
I'm gonna wait to see how it develops. /forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif
Nobody sems to think it a high priority on here and boating along the south coast with mostly being in or near the Solent seems even less important at the moment.
I'm gonna wait to see how it develops. /forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif
Divemaster1
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Interesting... that you value not getting lost above something that could save your life... a liferaft!.....
[/ QUOTE ]
Thaks for the correction .... and agree that life saving should have first priority and it was a quick list, not a comprehensive one .... if it was I would have mentioned the lot, including fire extinguishers in each cabin, fire blanket +++ and when I said GPS, I meant a pure GPS, not integrated so I could take it with me in the liferaft...together with a handheld VHF..grab bag etc... and on item 1 there was an etc .... which of course includes the basics.. (In Norway it is a legal requirement that all boats carry lifevests etc., for all people onboard ...which I still maintain here in the UK and as such, we carry 14 + 6 for children + 2 for very young ones).... and we also carry a ISO std liferaft for 9 people.
The purpose of my post was to say that an AIS for me have very little value and there are litterally tons of safety equipment I'd choose to buy before I felt that AIS was to be next on my list..... and I see that you agree with me on that one /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Interesting... that you value not getting lost above something that could save your life... a liferaft!.....
[/ QUOTE ]
Thaks for the correction .... and agree that life saving should have first priority and it was a quick list, not a comprehensive one .... if it was I would have mentioned the lot, including fire extinguishers in each cabin, fire blanket +++ and when I said GPS, I meant a pure GPS, not integrated so I could take it with me in the liferaft...together with a handheld VHF..grab bag etc... and on item 1 there was an etc .... which of course includes the basics.. (In Norway it is a legal requirement that all boats carry lifevests etc., for all people onboard ...which I still maintain here in the UK and as such, we carry 14 + 6 for children + 2 for very young ones).... and we also carry a ISO std liferaft for 9 people.
The purpose of my post was to say that an AIS for me have very little value and there are litterally tons of safety equipment I'd choose to buy before I felt that AIS was to be next on my list..... and I see that you agree with me on that one /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
SnaxMuppet
Well-Known Member
Fair enough... these sorts of lists are hardly ever as complete as we would want them to be and as you say, it is really just making the point that there are many other items that we would consider more important than AIS...
For example... I didn't mention charts, dividers, Bretton plotter and VHF DSC... none of which I would want to be at sea without /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Good discussion tho'... gets yer finking doesn't it /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
For example... I didn't mention charts, dividers, Bretton plotter and VHF DSC... none of which I would want to be at sea without /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Good discussion tho'... gets yer finking doesn't it /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
MapisM
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
If anyone's interested, I will write up the full system later, once we have actually got everything working.
[/ QUOTE ]I for one am interested to understand more of that, it's going to be a top system for sure.
And just to throw in my 2c:
1) given the investment and the size of the boat, I'd have considered a second radar scanner;
2) Ethernet cabling of the boat makes a lot of sense, my guess is that rather sooner than later it'll become standard above a certain size, 50' or so. Maybe fiber optic would have been even better than traditional cables, in a marine environment... though probably much more expensive?
3) WiFi on the other hand is something I'd probably remove or at least disable, if I would purchase a boat with that facility already installed.
If anyone's interested, I will write up the full system later, once we have actually got everything working.
[/ QUOTE ]I for one am interested to understand more of that, it's going to be a top system for sure.
And just to throw in my 2c:
1) given the investment and the size of the boat, I'd have considered a second radar scanner;
2) Ethernet cabling of the boat makes a lot of sense, my guess is that rather sooner than later it'll become standard above a certain size, 50' or so. Maybe fiber optic would have been even better than traditional cables, in a marine environment... though probably much more expensive?
3) WiFi on the other hand is something I'd probably remove or at least disable, if I would purchase a boat with that facility already installed.
Hurricane
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
1) given the investment and the size of the boat, I'd have considered a second radar scanner;
2) Ethernet cabling of the boat makes a lot of sense, my guess is that rather sooner than later it'll become standard above a certain size, 50' or so. Maybe fiber optic would have been even better than traditional cables, in a marine environment... though probably much more expensive?
3) WiFi on the other hand is something I'd probably remove or at least disable, if I would purchase a boat with that facility already installed
[/ QUOTE ]
1
Second Radar - although she's a big boat, I'm not sure there's room for one. However, I remember jfm saying that he would fit a backup GPS mushroom. Although it isnt a backup, we are installing a second one to feed the AIS - it might be possible to use this as a backup - perhaps.
2
Ethernet cabling - well cat 6 actually. I'll have to explain a bit here. There are loads of electronic attachments coming onto the market (system extenders etc) that use the cat 6 cabling to extend services. This doesnt mean that they are Ethernet - they just use the cables to transmit signals round the boat. The downfall here is that you cant run several different services across the same cable like you can in a fully digital network/LAN. The plus, however is that they can easily be pulled through the tight cable ducts in the boat. So we have decided to install three different cat 6 systems - VGA/PC signals, Audio/Video Signals and also a conventional Ethernet LAN mainly for future use.
3
Like you, I dont see a very long future for WiFi but at the moment it does give a good broad band alternative. Rickp put me onto some equipment that, on the face of it, works well a few miles offshore as well as in the marina. The system also incorporates a small router/hub that contains a lower power WiFi system for internal use in the boat. I can see IP telephones and laptops etc using this internal service.
Still - its all theory at the moment - we'll have to see what happens in a few weeks. I plan to document the system fully anyway so I'll post the design with some comments in a few months time.
1) given the investment and the size of the boat, I'd have considered a second radar scanner;
2) Ethernet cabling of the boat makes a lot of sense, my guess is that rather sooner than later it'll become standard above a certain size, 50' or so. Maybe fiber optic would have been even better than traditional cables, in a marine environment... though probably much more expensive?
3) WiFi on the other hand is something I'd probably remove or at least disable, if I would purchase a boat with that facility already installed
[/ QUOTE ]
1
Second Radar - although she's a big boat, I'm not sure there's room for one. However, I remember jfm saying that he would fit a backup GPS mushroom. Although it isnt a backup, we are installing a second one to feed the AIS - it might be possible to use this as a backup - perhaps.
2
Ethernet cabling - well cat 6 actually. I'll have to explain a bit here. There are loads of electronic attachments coming onto the market (system extenders etc) that use the cat 6 cabling to extend services. This doesnt mean that they are Ethernet - they just use the cables to transmit signals round the boat. The downfall here is that you cant run several different services across the same cable like you can in a fully digital network/LAN. The plus, however is that they can easily be pulled through the tight cable ducts in the boat. So we have decided to install three different cat 6 systems - VGA/PC signals, Audio/Video Signals and also a conventional Ethernet LAN mainly for future use.
3
Like you, I dont see a very long future for WiFi but at the moment it does give a good broad band alternative. Rickp put me onto some equipment that, on the face of it, works well a few miles offshore as well as in the marina. The system also incorporates a small router/hub that contains a lower power WiFi system for internal use in the boat. I can see IP telephones and laptops etc using this internal service.
Still - its all theory at the moment - we'll have to see what happens in a few weeks. I plan to document the system fully anyway so I'll post the design with some comments in a few months time.
Ballistix
Well-Known Member
Well at least it stimulated views. I for one, want it all, so I installed it. But that's just me. It's true that the Class B's only come with a small antenna so I'll only transmit 2 miles, but that's the whole point isn't it.
Anywa, I've got it now, and I'll be watching over the next few years to see if any others pop up. I think they might, some European countries are even thinking about extending this protocol as a matter of law.
There are a few other "uninteresting" side effects like my friend is going to install one, so give or take, I'll be able to find him if he's 2-3 miles from me and even better, in the summer I'll be able to get to him when studland bay is packed! Now that in itself is enough for me. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Keep it coming. You are all wrong of course.
T
Anywa, I've got it now, and I'll be watching over the next few years to see if any others pop up. I think they might, some European countries are even thinking about extending this protocol as a matter of law.
There are a few other "uninteresting" side effects like my friend is going to install one, so give or take, I'll be able to find him if he's 2-3 miles from me and even better, in the summer I'll be able to get to him when studland bay is packed! Now that in itself is enough for me. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Keep it coming. You are all wrong of course.
T
rickp
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
There are a few other "uninteresting" side effects like my friend is going to install one, so give or take, I'll be able to find him if he's 2-3 miles from me and even better, in the summer I'll be able to get to him when studland bay is packed! Now that in itself is enough for me. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
You could have done that with the right DSC VHF sets and plotters by issuing a position request...
Rick
There are a few other "uninteresting" side effects like my friend is going to install one, so give or take, I'll be able to find him if he's 2-3 miles from me and even better, in the summer I'll be able to get to him when studland bay is packed! Now that in itself is enough for me. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
You could have done that with the right DSC VHF sets and plotters by issuing a position request...
Rick
MJT
Well-Known Member
Agree in principle but in an either radar or liferaft situation radar used properly by someone who uses it regularly might, in fog or bad visibility, stop you hitting another boat or ship -- or the land, when you would then, perhaps, find a liferaft handy?
Martin T.
Martin T.
Ballistix
Well-Known Member
Yeah Rick, but I prefer it this way, don't need to worry about all that.
T
T
SnaxMuppet
Well-Known Member
True... but a radar won't stop you hitting that submerged object and holing your boat... then you'd wish you had the liferaft instead of the radar. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif
In all cases a liferaft is going to help... I'd have that over radar every time without a doubt.
In all cases a liferaft is going to help... I'd have that over radar every time without a doubt.
Divemaster1
Well-Known Member
We all make desicions based upon our own personal choice, circumstances, the kind of vessel and experience we have. In over 30 years of boating in various areas, I have been very fortiunate, not needing a liferaft ...... but by god, I've used that radar when being caught out ... and also when not.... and if you are into make up scenarios, you could argue that the radar have as a resut prevented loads of potentially dangerous situations.... saving the need for a liferaft.
Of course, we also carry a 10 ft dingy in davits, have cutters strapped to them, so we can launch that in seconds at any time...... all this is really immaterial, as it was a quickly compiled list... I have a liferaft + most of the other stuff, including DSC, Double Offshore Flare Packs (in date), serviced fire extinguishers, bilge pumps galore, fuel cut-offs, air cut-offs, radar reflector, lifejackets, grab bag ... etc., etc ....
Of course, we also carry a 10 ft dingy in davits, have cutters strapped to them, so we can launch that in seconds at any time...... all this is really immaterial, as it was a quickly compiled list... I have a liferaft + most of the other stuff, including DSC, Double Offshore Flare Packs (in date), serviced fire extinguishers, bilge pumps galore, fuel cut-offs, air cut-offs, radar reflector, lifejackets, grab bag ... etc., etc ....
MapisM
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I plan to document the system fully anyway so I'll post the design with some comments in a few months time.
[/ QUOTE ]Please, do. That'll be an interesting reading for sure.
With my best wishes, btw - It won't be a trivial job I guess.
Re.the second radome, actually what I had in mind were two different systems, a powerful one and another aimed at shorter distances/accuracy. Which of course could also work as acceptable backups each other, but the main usage would normally be different. Maybe the latest digital systems will make this principle obsolete somehow, but it's a bit early to tell, and personally I wouldn't fancy the idea of being the guinea pig on essential systems.
The 2nd GPS, as long as it's not just an antenna but can instead generate a NMEA signal, can surely work as a backup. But I wouldn't bother a lot, these days probably yourself and each of your crew members have a gps in your mobile phones, or even in your wrist watches...
Re.the use of cat6 cables as carriers, I see your point, but wouldn't a fiber optic backbone have been even better in this respect (aside from being less vulnerable to corrosion)?
One gigabit bandwith is not that much nowadays, for A/V signals for example I don't think that cat6 cables can carry full HD streams. Not a lossless signal, at least.
I plan to document the system fully anyway so I'll post the design with some comments in a few months time.
[/ QUOTE ]Please, do. That'll be an interesting reading for sure.
With my best wishes, btw - It won't be a trivial job I guess.
Re.the second radome, actually what I had in mind were two different systems, a powerful one and another aimed at shorter distances/accuracy. Which of course could also work as acceptable backups each other, but the main usage would normally be different. Maybe the latest digital systems will make this principle obsolete somehow, but it's a bit early to tell, and personally I wouldn't fancy the idea of being the guinea pig on essential systems.
The 2nd GPS, as long as it's not just an antenna but can instead generate a NMEA signal, can surely work as a backup. But I wouldn't bother a lot, these days probably yourself and each of your crew members have a gps in your mobile phones, or even in your wrist watches...
Re.the use of cat6 cables as carriers, I see your point, but wouldn't a fiber optic backbone have been even better in this respect (aside from being less vulnerable to corrosion)?
One gigabit bandwith is not that much nowadays, for A/V signals for example I don't think that cat6 cables can carry full HD streams. Not a lossless signal, at least.
Trundlebug
Well-Known Member
IMO Monster twin air horns are just as effective as all those other fancy electronic gismos for ensuring other craft know of your presence, regardless of the other vessel's size.
If the whole boat shudders when you sound them, you know they're big enough. Job done.
After all, isn't it mainly in fog or poor visibility that you would use all those gadgets?
If the whole boat shudders when you sound them, you know they're big enough. Job done.
After all, isn't it mainly in fog or poor visibility that you would use all those gadgets?
SnaxMuppet
Well-Known Member
/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
True enough!
True enough!
