Skipper 14 as cruising dinghy.

[jwilson]

I sailed a Skipper just the once many years ago and with the gunter rig. The main impression was that the design of the forward section was awful, particularly the deep uncovered recess forward ahead of the mast; in anything of a chop this would be in obvious danger of filling and unbalancing the boat, which for your proposed cruising idea would be one of the first items I'd revise by the fitting of a shaped lid tensioned by shock cords to keep water out.

'Lakesailor' of these fora has owned and repaired one of these I seem to recall ; a couple of other owners here had a 'rally' last year.

Peter Milne had also designed the Fireball and the Stag28 yacht, also the 'Mailboat', a polystyrene abortion, for the Daily Mail in the 60's which did his reputation no good.
He also worked with Ian Proctor the prolific designer of MerlinRocket,National 12, Wayfarer etc etc.

ianat182

I owned an early Bermudan rigged one for a few years, sailed in quite rough conditions in the Bristol Channel, and towed around the country with camping kit inside. Also car-topped a couple of times. When singlehanded she was faster than an Enterprise or GP14 offwind, slightly slower to windward mainly due to rubbish sails, but not that much slower.

In practice the forward well was never in danger of filling, nothing more than a few splashes, that drained through to the cockpit and were dealt with by the Elvstrom self-bailer that I fitted, along with toestraps. When I bought the boat new I had in mind fitting a cover over the forward well, but in the end never bothered. I did not however sail her with much that weight aboard, so if you add a lot of weight your experience may be different. Mine was very lightly built - I could in those days lift the hull onto a Ford Anglia roof rack on my own.

 

[Lakesailor]

The inspection hatches are useful for ....erm....inspecting, but won't give you access really unless you put them all over.
The complex moulding is I thin, just put into the hull moulding, but for some reason the sole part seems to be nearly bonded to the bilge, but not really. So water seems to get trapped beneath it.
Looking into the voids behind my inspection hatches showed them to have been filled with various bits of foam. These can act like sponges and really add to the boats weight, pluse added to ballast far too high up in the boat. There is not much point in having it as the chambers are supposedly sealed and should a hole in the hull occur then the boat is probably knackered anyway. I never came to a conclusion, but I think the rear seats are sealed chambers within the deck/inner moulding, hence the two drain bungs in the locker.

I have pics of the foam taken through the inspection hatches (and possibly through the hole in the hull) and also the hull repair I carried out.

 

[alant]

The Skipper 14 is no ball of fire. It has a modest sail area - which in the gunter version is very easy to shorten sail.

As for making it into a 14 ketch? why? What harm has it ever done you? A ketch of that length creates far more problems than it would ever solve - far too many bits of string, dodgy supports and every probablity of more weather helm than you can cope with.

This is a heavy somewhat sluggish boat which does not need to be burdened by more 'stuff'.

I've had one planing, so goes quite well IMO.

 

[tolhurstorganic]

The gunter rig is a very serviceable and usefull rig if done properly. It should have reef points and is the fastest mainsail that you will ever find to drop, the weight of the gunter spar (it is not a gaff) brings the lot down very quickly. Everything fits inside the boat so very easy to trail and erect.
You say you are to fit a Mirror main, well you will have to use the gunter spar as well then as to re-cut a mirror to a bermudan would not really be worth it. I personally don't think it is worth fitting a mizzen on such a small boat allthough it will be found to be very useful at times, you will need 4 extra chainplates or a substantial tabernacle if unstayed as well as possibly a bumpkin to take the sheet, unless the mizzen is very tiny. It is quite difficult balancing up a mixed rig on a small hull.
Good luck with what ever you decide to do

 

[jwilson]

I've had one planing, so goes quite well IMO.

Very much planing: mine was sail-on-track bermudan with stays and went very well offwind indeed. It did have a substantially bigger rig than the gunter versions.

And they were not built heavy: as I said earlier I have lifted one onto a car top singlehanded, and even then (early 1970s) I was not that strong. Mine might have been maybe 10 Kg heavier than a Mirror, another boat I used to car-top.

 

[Lakesailor]

My bermudan rigged Mk 1 was a massive weight. As mentioned earlier I put this down to all the foam bits someone had stuffed into the voids which had absorbed water.I couldn't lift the bow up without a great effort which puts it as similar to my 13ft clinker dinghy and that weighed 160Kgs.

 

[jwilson]

My bermudan rigged Mk 1 was a massive weight. As mentioned earlier I put this down to all the foam bits someone had stuffed into the voids which had absorbed water.I couldn't lift the bow up without a great effort which puts it as similar to my 13ft clinker dinghy and that weighed 160Kgs.

They certainly were not built that weight - I bought mine new, with a trailer, though they were designed to be car-toppable, and I did move mine on car-top a few times to avoid higher ferry charges for a trailer.

 

[RydalWater]

Would someone please pick up on request for dimensions of original Skipper Gunter Spars, Thanks in advance.

 

[Lakesailor]

Call Steve. He may help you

 

[SimonA]

I'm having great fun with my Skipper 12.

The gunter rig comes down very quickly when required and seems suited to the boat. There is a video on Youtube of some Scottish blokes sailing up on Loch Lomond in dreadful conditions with a Skipper 14, they broke the rudder and had problems with the mast but the dinghy never capsized which says much about how stable they are.

 

[SimonA]

They certainly were not built that weight - I bought mine new, with a trailer, though they were designed to be car-toppable, and I did move mine on car-top a few times to avoid higher ferry charges for a trailer.

I wouldn't want to lift my 12 onto a car roof, it takes 2 to lift it off the trailer and then you wouldn't want to walk to far with it.

 

[RydalWater]

Hi to all, you have no idea how jealous I feel at the moment reading how all of you are having great fun sailing your Skippers.

Having begun serious work on my own I have decided not to proceed with my proposed yawl modification sanity having finally prevailed.

On the other hand despite having a complete Mirror rig available I would on reflection prefer to use the original Skipper 14 rig not least due to the pristine condition of the mainsail and excellent jib, BTW I also have a spinnaker for her which was not I believe a standard fitting but is again in good order.

In restoring damage to the mast step, (Blocked by rotting timber) I have had to severely reduce the depth of the fitting and am in total ignorance of the correct original dimensions.

As near as I have been able to estimate from measuring the actual sails the required dimensions appear to be something like:

Mainsail: Foot 9'-2" ( I have actually got the original boom so am safe on that one)
" Sleeve 10'-6" (Estimated o/all yard length therefore somewhere around 13'-9")

Spar diameter max: 65mm. Fitting @ foot - known only to God. Other fittings ditto.

Mast hight from and above deck around 9'-4" dia GOK (If I'm right re the hight the Mirror mast would probably do incidentally.

Please one of you measure your spars and let me know the results so as to help restore one more Skipper to the fleet.

BTW for Lakesailor: You are quite correct in your earlier mention of the small gap between the inner and outer hull mouldings at base level. Is there any valid reason that you know of why the two should not be bonded together via the cockpit locker aft and an additional hatch forward? It seems an obvious safety modification to me.

An added incidental I can't really carry on calling the boat an it and am considering various names for her ranging from "Wreck" to "Untippable". The former is presently not totally wrong but the whole reason for taking her on is to grant both of us an added lease of life. The latter seems a tad overconfident and riding for a fall although I like the sound very much, vaguely WW1 battlecruiser in fact.

Any suggestions please!

 

[Lakesailor]

"What Now" (Skipper)

Did you not call Steve as I suggested in my earlier post? The boat is no longer advertised so perhaps he has sold it.

If you look here and scroll down BeardedOne has a gunter-rigged Skipper 14 and gives his phone number.

 

[RydalWater]

Steve was unavailable & as far as I can presently ascertain "beardedone" is a lady with a most attractive (Recorded) telephone voice. I am therefore presently dependent on the good offices of those visiting this thread.

 

[Lakesailor]

A bearded lady?
Can you get her to send some pics

 

[RydalWater]

Leave off Lakey, my leg already hurts from my arthritis and won't stand much stretching.

 

[RydalWater]

Things progress, a bit anyway, close examination of the old mainsail that seems to have been the original bears the number 2813 below the "S" mark.

That's 28 to mark the last birthday I actually counted and 13 to mark some of the luck the boat and I have had prior to meeting.

Judging purely from this Skipper 14's must have been a bit more popular than I'd imagined & makes me wonder what went wrong to kill production.

I have now almost finished making a yard & have only the final dressing to complete on that but where I had hoped to be able to use my existing Mirror mast this won't in fact be long enough thanks to the oddities of the yard & mainsail.

As a result next week I am going to make a new mast long enough to suit the Skipper rig and with extra furniture to enable the Mirror yard & mainsail to be set if required.

That should enable me to set an appropriate set of canvas for all conditions bearing in mind that the Skipper suit includes the biggest genoa, (Almost a ghoster in fact) for the size of boat that I've seen in a lot of years of sailing.

With that set & poled out plus a spinnaker which again seems of a fair size, perhaps half again that of the Mirror, she would seem to have the potential to go a bit, if that is I can keep her up.

With the standard Mirror set hoisted on the other hand she should be a pretty fair imitation of a poodle and as safe as houses in any weather in which anyone with a shred of sanity should be at sea.

As regards work on the hull the deck mouldings have been scrubbed and no longer bear the imprint of what must have been fully half the slugs and snails in Nottinghamshire resulting from being stored in the open and upside down.

This weekend will see the start of work on the bottom which is initially anyway going to be a bit more involved. She needs a good scrub again with BKF to be followed by gel coating the repairs present where at one time she had a mild argument with a trailer and a final paint. If and its a big if we get reasonable weather this could be finished some time over next weekend.

Hopefully a couple more weeks of reasonable weather will see her finished, gleaming and ready for sea, well the Trent anyway.

As to the name "Kugel" is currently number one, it is German for Slug which in general seems suitable and is commendably short.

 

[Firsthome]

Skipper

The Minisail mast (2 piece, 19ft long) plops into the mast step, it's the same diameter as a Skipper. The Minisail boom is identical (both boats were produced by Richmond Marine). A Minisail hull and spars went for £37 on Ebay this week. For some unknown reason I have two Skipper 12s. Both have the original unstayed gunter rig but I usually sail UNA rigged, one using a Minisprint rig with a tracked boom and racing sail and the other with a Minisail loose footed sail. A Mirror yard needs the jaws widened but the mast step is a very simple arrangement at thwart height. I did modify one boat to accomodate the Mirror rig but I found it quite uninspiring. That said I do have a tracked Skipper Bermudan mast which I used with a Miracle sail and I may have an extra gunter Skipper mast somewhere amongst the brambles which have grown in my garden while I've been mucking about with my boats.
Regards
Steve

 

[simon5350]

Hello
I am new to the forum, have acquired a Skipper 14 gunter rigged. I have had to make a miansail out of an old sail, the original too rotten to use.
Do you still want spar dimensions? I hope to be sailing tomorrow (Saturday) but could do spar (and sail) dimensions on Sunday if reqd.
My impressions are that with standard main and jib the boat is a little unbalanced - maybe the main was a little too full and you don't have the controls to flatten it much - so if there is wind and my other half ( doesnt really like sail power) permits I am going to try with a Mirror jib.
My feeling is that with crew willing to sit well out and an even bigger jib - genoa really, the boat will go quite well and without too much weather helm.
Gunter rig means you can drop the sail easily and roller reefing should be possible using the kicker attached to a strop rolled up in the sail - or fit reefing eyelets.
Simon

 

[dbagers]

Your Help/Advice is Needed

Hi all, This is my first time posting on the site. I am in Melbourne Australia and have a Skipper 14. To cut a long story short, I have lost the hatch, and am getting ridiculous quotes from marine repairers to replace. Does anyone know of availability of moulds or parts for sale etc. If anyone can provide me an easy (preferably cheap) solution I would be very appreciative. Thanks