Sigma 38 as bluewater boat?

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fredrussell

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Firstly, I am neither intending to buy a Sigma38 nor do any bluewater sailing, but I’m just wondering what the panel thinks of such a boat for this job. They have a reputation for toughness, good turn of speed and a bit of room below. Another bonus, at least for this impoverished sailor, is that they’re not overly expensive.

I ask because there’s currently one for sale that has been set up (or at least described) as bluewater ready, for what seems to me a fair price. It’s years before I’ll be doing any ocean sailing, but I do like a nice responsive and nippy boat, and this Sigma caught my attention.

Oh, and I know I’m wasting my time saying this, but if we could avoid the tedious ‘old versus new’ argument that would be wonderful. Just your views on largish eighties era cruiser racers as bluewater boats are sought.
 
fredrussell said:
Firstly, I am neither intending to buy a Sigma38 nor do any bluewater sailing, but I’m just wondering what the panel thinks of such a boat for this job. They have a reputation for toughness, good turn of speed and a bit of room below. Another bonus, at least for this impoverished sailor, is that they’re not overly expensive.

I ask because there’s currently one for sale that has been set up (or at least described) as bluewater ready, for what seems to me a fair price. It’s years before I’ll be doing any ocean sailing, but I do like a nice responsive and nippy boat, and this Sigma caught my attention.

Oh, and I know I’m wasting my time saying this, but if we could avoid the tedious ‘old versus new’ argument that would be wonderful. Just your views on largish eighties era cruiser racers as bluewater boats are sought.
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I know sigma well and consider no problem.

Pros and cons of any moderate fin keel yacht.

Why not?
 
I once booked to sail from the Hamble to Spain on a Sigma 38. I made it as far as Falmouth but, having pulled a muscle in my back, I had to abandon the trip. Reports from the others on the trip after they arrived in Spain was that the boat was very wet and absolutely everything in the cabin was soaked by the time they arrived. I don't know if all Sigma 38s would be that wet but you might want to check others experiences.
 
Fred
I owned and raced a Sigma 33 for many years, and crewed on Sima 38s from time to time. All good, strongly built boats. Two points to consider when cruising:
1. Most of them were raced hard so big stresses on rigging etc, wear and tear on winches, sheaves etc, and maybe keel damage.
2. I found that a boat which was stiff and carried full sail easily when racing became noticeably tender when cruising - maybe 7 crew on the weather rail did have an influence!
Tremendous value for money, lots of super memories and respect for David Thomas designs.
Peter
 
They have a very low boom and cockpit that is set up for a reasonable crew size.

The interior does not have huge amounts of stowage, especially for food in the vicinity of the galley.

None of the double bunks is as spacious as you would find in a modern boat of similar displacement. There is not single "owner's cabin".

In general the layout of the boat is designed around accommodating a reasonable sized crew for shortish periods of time, which is pretty much the inverse of a couple cruising long term. She does at least only have one heads unlike many other boats of similar size.
 
The boom height can be corrected by using a 'cruising' mainsail or applying the flattening reef in the one design sail, the winches are big and powerful but not at all handy for singlehanding unless you have an autopilot, fine for sailing two up. My wife and I cruised ours for 12 years only deciding to downsize when we coulld afford something much newer, the replacement (Finngulf 33)was probably faster but required more input and effort, (the air draft was the same). Not an effective exercise in downsizing but a great boat to sail. We never felt that stability in the Sigma two up was an issue. The keel was half iron with a 'mickey mouses ear' shape and a lead bottom half, not a briliant shape for drying out, you needed to make sure she was secured fore and aft. Someone (Northshore?) proposed changing it, substituting a longer fatter lead bulb which might have reduced draft without affecting stabiity and would have been a better shape to rest on. Not all Sigma 38s were raced to death, ours only did evening points, a few club regattas and WHYW, most of the time we were cruising around Ireland and Scotland, unlike our Sigma 33 we never really had the opportunity to race her one design, the same can be said for most away from the Solent.
16 years later every time I see our Sigma 38 I feel a pang of regret, it would have done us our day but after a time you get this restless feeling, 12 years ownership and I thought she could take us anywhere, I recall one (Paracelsus?) that went round the world and did it fairly quickly.
 
Sir Owen Aisher of yeoman fame and sailing friend of Prince Phillip apparently down sized to a Sigma 38 explaining that replacing it yearly was cheaper than the sails on his previous boat .
 
Aeolus said:
I once booked to sail from the Hamble to Spain on a Sigma 38. I made it as far as Falmouth but, having pulled a muscle in my back, I had to abandon the trip. Reports from the others on the trip after they arrived in Spain was that the boat was very wet and absolutely everything in the cabin was soaked by the time they arrived. I don't know if all Sigma 38s would be that wet but you might want to check others experiences.
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I've sailed two Fastnets on a 362. Both were incredibly wet, with copious beating into F6-7 wind-against tide. The boat was fine inside.

If the cabin was soaked, then I suspect it's a matter of badly leaking fittings and/or poor crew discipline (oilies and wet sails on cushions etc). There's no 35-year-old boat that's immune to either problem; and I would be surprised if a Sigma 38 is particularly prone - subject to reservations about those that were thrashed hard and inadequately maintained.

In short, sounds like a maintenance problem not a boat problem.
 
Fantastic sea boats, we had a very long slog from Lowestoft up to the Humber wind dead on the nose, F6-7. Horrible seas & conditions, boat was fantastic though just ploughed on & looked after the crew.
 
All the boats of that age are likely to need some money spent getting it ready for a long voyage. When you add the cost of the boat and likely spend on wear and tear, but a newer boat would be a wiser choice.

Having sailed all the Sigmas, my favorite was the 36 fractional rig for cruising. A powerful boat, good sea handling, easy to maneuver, decent accommodation. I think the quality dropped between the 36 years onwards, but that maybe unfounded opinion.
 
Quandary said:
The boom height can be corrected by using a 'cruising' mainsail or applying the flattening reef in the one design sail, the winches are big and powerful but not at all handy for singlehanding unless you have an autopilot, fine for sailing two up. My wife and I cruised ours for 12 years only deciding to downsize when we coulld afford something much newer, the replacement (Finngulf 33)was probably faster but required more input and effort, (the air draft was the same). Not an effective exercise in downsizing but a great boat to sail. We never felt that stability in the Sigma two up was an issue. The keel was half iron with a 'mickey mouses ear' shape and a lead bottom half, not a briliant shape for drying out, you needed to make sure she was secured fore and aft. Someone (Northshore?) proposed changing it, substituting a longer fatter lead bulb which might have reduced draft without affecting stabiity and would have been a better shape to rest on. Not all Sigma 38s were raced to death, ours only did evening points, a few club regattas and WHYW, most of the time we were cruising around Ireland and Scotland, unlike our Sigma 33 we never really had the opportunity to race her one design, the same can be said for most away from the Solent.
16 years later every time I see our Sigma 38 I feel a pang of regret, it would have done us our day but after a time you get this restless feeling, 12 years ownership and I thought she could take us anywhere, I recall one (Paracelsus?) that went round the world and did it fairly quickly.
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Aware that this is a very old thread..but interested in your comments re. Drying out. It makes so much more possible. I hadn't done it until we chartered a 41' out of Pwllheli. She was basically one of the Swedish sherry racers but in GRP. The owner was most insistent that we could dry out & so we did! How did you get on with the Sigma?
 
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