25931
Well-Known Member
Don't most wives articulate ?
Should everyone speak English?
- Thread starter Nostrodamus
- Start date
Don't most wives articulate ?
A1Sailor
...
I remember spending a week once, doing English-English translation!
Scenario was torpedo trials on the Firth of Clyde courtesy of Her Majesty, and the OOW had to get the ship to a precise location at a precise time. The problem was that "Queen's English" and "Campbeltown Range Control English" were totally different variants of the same language. The same is true about other variants, like "Brum-English" which can be incomprehensible at times.
My point is that even if a foreigner did learn English, there is no guarantee that they'd be able to understand Nostrodamus-English. He could always SHOUT though, which some seem to think helps!
I even did French-me-Japanese translation once! On a sightseeing tour in Japan, with a tour guide who spoke reasonable English - better than my Japanese but I had a phrase book. There was a French couple who spoke little English, and when the tour which had left by bus swapped to a bullet train back to Tokyo they were literally lost - arriving somewhere different from the departure point. We somehow managed to communicate...
Scenario was torpedo trials on the Firth of Clyde courtesy of Her Majesty, and the OOW had to get the ship to a precise location at a precise time. The problem was that "Queen's English" and "Campbeltown Range Control English" were totally different variants of the same language. The same is true about other variants, like "Brum-English" which can be incomprehensible at times.
My point is that even if a foreigner did learn English, there is no guarantee that they'd be able to understand Nostrodamus-English. He could always SHOUT though, which some seem to think helps!
I even did French-me-Japanese translation once! On a sightseeing tour in Japan, with a tour guide who spoke reasonable English - better than my Japanese but I had a phrase book. There was a French couple who spoke little English, and when the tour which had left by bus swapped to a bullet train back to Tokyo they were literally lost - arriving somewhere different from the departure point. We somehow managed to communicate...
Robin
Well-Known Member
My French dates back only to 'O' Level GCSE in the '60s, but in the days when the qualifications were not manipulated to flatter government targets. I have found it easy enough and very rewarding to use my basic French and actually get slightly irritated if when I speak in French the reply is in English and doubly so if given an 'English' menu which has items missing or wrongly translated, as in the baked fisherman dish (monkfish) offered in one restaurant.
SWMBO's French is very basic (the USA is farther away from France and Spanish is more their second language bag) but again has had no problem communicating, least of all if it meant spending money. Between us we met and socialised with lots of very nice French folk over the years when visiting as we frequently did by boat or in winter to play golf. On our last golfing trip to Brittany we not only played with a French couple but were later invited back to their home for dinner, yet they spoke no better English than we did French so a little effort gives great rewards. We still get Christmas cards from French yotties we have met over the years.
A little effort is all it takes.
SWMBO's French is very basic (the USA is farther away from France and Spanish is more their second language bag) but again has had no problem communicating, least of all if it meant spending money. Between us we met and socialised with lots of very nice French folk over the years when visiting as we frequently did by boat or in winter to play golf. On our last golfing trip to Brittany we not only played with a French couple but were later invited back to their home for dinner, yet they spoke no better English than we did French so a little effort gives great rewards. We still get Christmas cards from French yotties we have met over the years.
A little effort is all it takes.
Mrs Springy
Well-Known Member
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
More than they understand?
RobbieW
Well-Known Member
They started it! 1066 springs immediately to mind
I used occasionally to explain to 'murkins that current British/French relations are an aberration in the context of the last 1000 years
prr
Well-Known Member
useless as a chastity belt for Katie Price.
I think its about time people took Katie Price a bit more seriously. A highly versatile British actress of substantial quality...... Sure she's always going to have her knockers... But come on...
I think its about time people took Katie Price a bit more seriously. A highly versatile British actress of substantial quality...... Sure she's always going to have her knockers... But come on...
A1Sailor
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They started it! 1066 springs immediately to mind
I used occasionally to explain to 'murkins that current British/French relations are an aberration in the context of the last 1000 years
Those who know about history know, of course, that the British weren't around in 1066!
The Kingdom of Britain arrived in 1707. 1066 was a square go between the Norman-French and the English!
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Sybarite
Well-Known Member
They started it! 1066 springs immediately to mind
I used occasionally to explain to 'murkins that current British/French relations are an aberration in the context of the last 1000 years
18 English queens were in fact French. Many English kings were French. eg Richard the Lionheart spent less than one year of his reign in England. French remained the language of the English court well into the 14th century, and the language of diplomacy up until modern times.
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reginaldon
Well-Known Member
In Belgium I've communicated in my School Cert French from early 40s, they always replied in English - the Flemish seem to have a similar relationship with the French to ours!
Down here on the Channel coast, in the bank, I've been left endeavouring to communicate with French in my School Cert French, learned in the NW, whilst the locals with the same academic background as I, looked on grinning, their antipathy to the French was considerable. On one occasion I was left trying to explain that the (then) Exchange Control regulations precluded her from selling Rhodesia- Katanga shares on the London Stock Exchange, stretched my 'M Duval est le pere' vocab. to its limits.
Down here on the Channel coast, in the bank, I've been left endeavouring to communicate with French in my School Cert French, learned in the NW, whilst the locals with the same academic background as I, looked on grinning, their antipathy to the French was considerable. On one occasion I was left trying to explain that the (then) Exchange Control regulations precluded her from selling Rhodesia- Katanga shares on the London Stock Exchange, stretched my 'M Duval est le pere' vocab. to its limits.
Bosun Higgs
N/A
Bosun Higgs
N/A
Whilst some people are moaning about the French I have to admit that both in business and in sailing I have found them to be very pleasant to deal with and very friendly. We once picked up a spare mooring for the night only to find the owner's boat returning when we were mid dinner. No problem , he said. " I'll pick up the next mooring and move my boat when you leave in the morning".
Can you imagine a Brit taking that approach ? I can't.
Can you imagine a Brit taking that approach ? I can't.
DaveS
Well-Known Member
A few years ago at Brussels airport I asked for a train ticket to Brussels Midi in carefully put together schoolboy French. The furious response, in English, was "Why are you speaking to me in French?" My rather flustered explanation that I was just trying to be polite didn't really help...
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haydude
Well-Known Member
I confirm that you are arrogant and you should learn the language if that matters to you, or at least you should not even ask the question as a matter of courtesy and keep a low profile.
Boomshanka
Well-Known Member
A few years ago at Brussels airport I asked for a train ticket to Brussels Midi in carefully put together schoolboy French. The furious response, in English, was "Why are you speaking to me in French?" My rather flustered explanation that I was just trying to be polite didn't really help...
Have a read up on Belgian history! Chances are you spoke to a Flemish person. Whilst in theory Brussels is a predominantly French speaking enclave surrounded by Flemish... if in doubt, and you can't speak Flemish, use English outside of Wallonia.
Nostrodamus
Well-Known Member
I suppose arrogance is not reading an entire thread (even when it is written in English) and then deriding others, or is that ignorant. Will you be keeping a low profile or not replying any further as a matter of courtesy?
I will accept being called anything as it is the nearest I am liable to get to being titled.
ukmctc
Well-Known Member
We are the worst country for thinking everyone should speak English, nearly every other nation in the world speaks it as a second language, we should be able to speak French and Spanish. If you're heading for foreign parts you should at least learn the basics.
I have worked in Spain, France and Germany and can tell you that even if you only speak the basics life is so much nicer, friendlier and comfortable with the locals. I got so much better treatment for trying than other Brits.
BrianH
Well-Known Member
I steeled myself not to respond to this obviously provocative wind-up thread (well done, Nostrodamus, you'll pass your final troll exam with flying colours), but dammit, here I am.
Oh, I dunno. An American once asked me, "define monoglot" and before I could reply he said "the answer's 'an American'" Which, with so much immigration from Spanish-speaking countries, I now wonder if that stereotype is really true.
But they do have an excuse, the USA is vast and most inhabitants never move far and need another language (unless they live in California, Florida or Texas). In comparison, the UK is cheek by jowl with the tower of babel and yet very few try to really learn one of their neighbours' languages - even when they move into one of the Costa ghettos.
This was brought home to me when I read a Grauniad article about an Englishman charged with murder in France - this was what jumped out at me:
But we are spoiled, wherever we go, someone speaks English. And worse, they want to practice it. Unless sometimes when they are Swiss or German, they are complexed because, even when their English is perfect - as it usually is - they "do not want to make a mistake in front of an Englishman" as once, many years ago, a young German engineer said to me after working with me for two weeks in my then very shaky German before revealing that he spoke excellent English.
So there's the rub, the world aspires to speak our language (perhaps excepting France) and it makes us lazy because we can coast along without all the hard work of learning another language - because it is damned hard work for those of us - and I am one - who are not talented in that direction.
Amen.
Oh, I dunno. An American once asked me, "define monoglot" and before I could reply he said "the answer's 'an American'" Which, with so much immigration from Spanish-speaking countries, I now wonder if that stereotype is really true.
But they do have an excuse, the USA is vast and most inhabitants never move far and need another language (unless they live in California, Florida or Texas). In comparison, the UK is cheek by jowl with the tower of babel and yet very few try to really learn one of their neighbours' languages - even when they move into one of the Costa ghettos.
This was brought home to me when I read a Grauniad article about an Englishman charged with murder in France - this was what jumped out at me:
"The village mayor, Pierre Sourdain, a farmer, says he liked Robert and Joanne Hall very much. All the villagers say the same: they were impressive, charming, self-possessed. (Saying that, the people in the village speak no English and Robert Hall – despite living here for 10 years – never learned French.)"
This totally staggered me, but when I think back and the more I research, the more evident it became. And I should have been more aware having been a British expatriate now for most of my adult life, even to picking up a couple of foreign nationalities and more than a couple of languages on the way.But we are spoiled, wherever we go, someone speaks English. And worse, they want to practice it. Unless sometimes when they are Swiss or German, they are complexed because, even when their English is perfect - as it usually is - they "do not want to make a mistake in front of an Englishman" as once, many years ago, a young German engineer said to me after working with me for two weeks in my then very shaky German before revealing that he spoke excellent English.
So there's the rub, the world aspires to speak our language (perhaps excepting France) and it makes us lazy because we can coast along without all the hard work of learning another language - because it is damned hard work for those of us - and I am one - who are not talented in that direction.
Amen.
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
An American general was once asked which foreign languages he spoke.
He replied, "Just English. If it was good enough for our Lord, it's good enough for me."
A1Sailor
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...but what language did our Lord speak? Was the Bible written in English - or was it maybe written in French, Spanish, Hebrew, whatever, then translated much later into English?
To assume that the Holy Bible was written in English is surely a typically arrogant assumption?