Series (jordan) drogues?

[VO5]

On a cat definitely due to the bridle

on a mono it will stop the stern swinging around the keel, so yes

on a mono with a swing keel (raised) main directional impetus will be from the wind and wave train. The drogue should keep you pointing in the right direction.


However. There is going to be an enormous load on the bridle and particularly on the cleat that is securing the bridle. This point will need to be considered as in reality you need a new securing point with significant strengthening and load distribution, plus it is essential that any possible chafe point is eradicated.

In the three examples you list, I completely disagree, sorry.

The effect of trailing such a contraption would be to slow down a boat, that's all.

It would not provide the directional stability required by a vessel to keep her stern firmly squared to a following sea. The risk of being rolled over as a result of not being directionally stabilised would not be insignificant.

 

[Seagreen]

I've no experience with swing keels, but surely raising the swing keel would result in reduced capsize stability and less directional stability. In a big sea, wouldn't this result in greater yawing, chafe, and strain on the bridles?

 

[beneteau_305_553]

In the three examples you list, I completely disagree, sorry.

The effect of trailing such a contraption would be to slow down a boat, that's all.

It would not provide the directional stability required by a vessel to keep her stern firmly squared to a following sea. The risk of being rolled over as a result of not being directionally stabilised would not be insignificant.

Dragging a drogue containing one ton of water does keep the stern square. Well it did when I tried it.

 

[VO5]

Dragging a drogue containing one ton of water does keep the stern square. Well it did when I tried it.

Of course.
You want to keep the stern square to a following wind and sea.
You don't want to be pulling a long snake that doesn't.

 

[Talbot]

Of course.
You want to keep the stern square to a following wind and sea.
You don't want to be pulling a long snake that doesn't.

If you want to prefer a second hand B&Q bag over a purpose designed piece of equipment that has been tested and approved by USCG, and extensively tank tested, thats your privilege.

 

[Kelpie]

I've no experience with swing keels, but surely raising the swing keel would result in reduced capsize stability and less directional stability. In a big sea, wouldn't this result in greater yawing, chafe, and strain on the bridles?

If, as in my Wayfarer, the centreboard does not have any ballast effect, then the boat can be more stable with the board up. With nothing to grip the water, the boat can be pushed around sideways on top of the water, rather than digging in and heeling. I have it on good authority that lifting the board can prevent capsizes, counter-intuitive though that may seem!
Directional stability goes out the window, so yawing and chafing will indeed becomes problems.
Obviously a weighted board or swing keel will provide some stability when lowered.

 

[VO5]

If you want to prefer a second hand B&Q bag over a purpose designed piece of equipment that has been tested and approved by USCG, and extensively tank tested, thats your privilege.

It is just a gimmick snake, not a proper directionally stabilising bit of kit, never mind what the US Coastguard approves or whatnot. A snake just slows the boat down, that's all. Then along comes a rogue wave and rolls the boat over with you in it.

 

[saltwater_gypsy]

Is the Jordan drogue something to do with Katie Price? She seems to be involved in everything these days.

 

[Ludd]

Is the Jordan drogue something to do with Katie Price? She seems to be involved in everything these days.

SOMEBODY had to say it-----mind you her over the shoulder boulder holders shoul be strong enough for the job!

 

[Talbot]

It is just a gimmick snake, not a proper directionally stabilising bit of kit, never mind what the US Coastguard approves or whatnot. A snake just slows the boat down, that's all. Then along comes a rogue wave and rolls the boat over with you in it.

My final word on this subject

You obviously have no idea of mechanics, no idea of research, no ability to read, and little interest in your own safety - forgive me for not wanting to sail with you.

I hope you will understand one day before you are put in a position that kills you due to your ignorance.

 

[VO5]

My final word on this subject

You obviously have no idea of mechanics, no idea of research, no ability to read, and little interest in your own safety - forgive me for not wanting to sail with you.

I hope you will understand one day before you are put in a position that kills you due to your ignorance.

Yes, good, very good, excellent.

Here is a parting lesson for you:~

Ignorance is a condition due to lack of the correct information, which I have, that because of your rudeness now I am not willing to share with you.

Stupidity is lack of ability to enter into intelligent discussion owing to lack of brain power (which is called intelligence) which you suffer from.

To the first there is a remedy. To the second, sadly none.

I have better things to engage my intellect than to have to struggle with your condition endlessly, because in my experience it is a pointless and futile excercise to try to persist with individuals like you.

My statements in previous posts stand.

 

[Seagreen]

Is the Jordan drogue something to do with Katie Price? She seems to be involved in everything these days.

Now there's a thought. Much as I'd like to drag Jordan behind me on a long stretchy rope, I think she's a bit too pneumatic and would float on the surface creating a big splash, being a bit of a drag, but nothing you could hold on to. I'd have to slow down only because the remnants of the Royal Navy would be racing up astern in the fond hope that her bra may fall off.

 

[silver-fox]

My final word on this subject

You obviously have no idea of mechanics, no idea of research, no ability to read, and little interest in your own safety - forgive me for not wanting to sail with you.

I hope you will understand one day before you are put in a position that kills you due to your ignorance.

I am with you completely Talbot - although you were showing understandable signs of exasperation.

It always grieves me to see years of methodical carefully documented research and the practical experience of many sailors just dismissed with a flat contradiction unsupported by either facts or reasoned argument.

I can only offer you this advice featured on another post "Don't argue with idiots, they just drag you down to their level and beat you up with their superior experience!"

 

[VO5]

I am with you completely Talbot - although you were showing understandable signs of exasperation.

It always grieves me to see years of methodical carefully documented research and the practical experience of many sailors just dismissed with a flat contradiction unsupported by either facts or reasoned argument.

I can only offer you this advice featured on another post "Don't argue with idiots, they just drag you down to their level and beat you up with their superior experience!"

You are just as dull as your friend.

You know why ?

You don't ask, therefore you don't learn.

 

[Saguday]

It is just a gimmick snake, not a proper directionally stabilising bit of kit, never mind what the US Coastguard approves or whatnot. A snake just slows the boat down, that's all. Then along comes a rogue wave and rolls the boat over with you in it.

What a load of b0ll0cks, imho one of the biggest load of such I've read on here for some time.

Don Jordan was a very fine engineer and mariner who amongst other achievements developed this excellent and proven piece of equipment. It was done methodically and in a thoroughly technical and professional manner over 10 years and is as far removed from a piece of gimmickry as I can imagine.

I emailed him to ask him questions about the series drogue for use on our boat when I lived in the US and he responded promptly, courteously and informatively on every occasion - I was very saddened to learn he died last year.

A fine bloke and a fine, well thought out piece of safety equipment.

 

[VO5]

What a load of b0ll0cks, imho one of the biggest load of such I've read on here for some time.

Don Jordan was a very fine engineer and mariner who amongst other achievements developed this excellent and proven piece of equipment. It was done methodically and in a thoroughly technical and professional manner over 10 years and is as far removed from a piece of gimmickry as I can imagine.

I emailed him to ask him questions about the series drogue for use on our boat when I lived in the US and he responded promptly, courteously and informatively on every occasion - I was very saddened to learn he died last year.

A fine bloke and a fine, well thought out piece of safety equipment.

No, its not a load of *******s. But then on the other hand I am not going to expand on my statement so that you and your rude friend can benefit.

I am prepared to expand however, but not to you.

I am quite happy to expand to the starter of this thread who made the original enquiry, and then by email or PM, or even by handwritten letter, and then, no one gets to learn anything as a result of your individual and joint moronery.

 

[Squeaky]

Good evening:

Is there any facility on this forum to have people banned or prevented from posting?

If so, I would like to suggest that VO5 be banned or otherwise prevented from replying with his rude and aggressive posts.

I don't know where he came from recently or possibly it is only because his series of replies on another subject that I have begin to notice him.

I was reading this series of comments without paying any attention as to who was posting the comment when I noticed an aggressive post and immediately thought to myself that the post was similar to others I had read and was not surprised when I checked and discovered it had been made by VO5.

His post completely ruined the serious nature of the series of posts on this subject.

I say "get rid of him now".

Cheers and Happy New Year to all.

Squeaky

 

[VO5]

Good evening:

Is there any facility on this forum to have people banned or prevented from posting?

If so, I would like to suggest that VO5 be banned or otherwise prevented from replying with his rude and aggressive posts.

I don't know where he came from recently or possibly it is only because his series of replies on another subject that I have begin to notice him.

I was reading this series of comments without paying any attention as to who was posting the comment when I noticed an aggressive post and immediately thought to myself that the post was similar to others I had read and was not surprised when I checked and discovered it had been made by VO5.

His post completely ruined the serious nature of the series of posts on this subject.

I say "get rid of him now".

Cheers and Happy New Year to all.

Squeaky

You expect me to be gutless and docile, is that it ?

Read properly what prompts these replies, then you will understand better....Squeaky.

 

[webcraft]

Just to set the record straight

.
I am frankly astounded by VO5's postings on this subject and am at a loss as to what his motivation for these posts might be.

Although we have never had to deploy it we made one for our Atlantic cruise in 2006-2007 and it remains on board as our ultimate solution. Our own extensive research convinced us it was easily the simplest safest solution for a small lightly crewed yacht. The only caveat is that you need some searoom to run downwind.

All accounts I have read of people using a series drogue state that it not only slows the boat substantially but also keeps the stern square-on to the seas. That is the whole purpose of the device, and it is hard to see how it could do one without the other. It has been extensively tested by the US Coastguard and used in anger by several far more experienced sailors than VO5'

As for agressive posters - like road rage, this seems to be a phenomenon that is on the increase. They only do it to get a response so the best thing to do is ignore them, though it can be difficult. I have been known to retaliate myself, but it is usually pointless. Just let them rant on and ignore them.

- W

 

[VO5]

Does anyone have any experience of Series (or Jordan) type drogues?

Reading about the Jordan Series drogue, and compared with the SeaBrake, I was wondering (in my obsessed techie way) about the difficulties and time consuming effort needed to retrieve the Series drogue, and I wondered if attaching a shot line to the outward end would assist in its retrieval?

I was looking into making one for myself - not technicaly difficult but immensely time consuming (hence the retail price), but the retrieval time makes it impractical for use in breaking seas in estuaries. Unless it could be hauled in "back end" first.

See your PM inbox.