Selling using ESCROW Account ?

[bbg]

Really !!!!! A limited company that does not quote their Company No. or registered address on their website as they are required to do by law......

I have no interest in this, but the information is on the contact page. Took me about 30 seconds to find it.
http://www.escrowcustodianservices.co.uk/contact/

 

[pvb]

What is a Bank Guarantee ?

It's a guarantee from the supplier's bank that they'll refund your money if the supplier fails to deliver or goes out of business. It usually costs a small fee, but is a useful reassurance. In the context of boat-buying, the type of bank guarantee might be called a performance bond. If the supplier's bank won't give a guarantee, it's an indication that you shouldn't trust your money to the supplier. Suggest you Google.

 

[STATUE]

Thanks pvb for explaining, you've given me my answer.

 

[blan321]

Can I throw in my limited experience that might help others? I bought my yacht 3 yrs ago through a UK broker. I repeatedly asked if he had a client account, he assured me he did. When i specified exactly what I meant, he became vague and eventually admitted it was not that required by YBDSA or was it ABYA, I cannot recall, but assured me he had been in the brokerage business for 16+ years.
I checked. His trading company had been newly registered at companies house less than a year ago.
I also contacted the association CEO who merely said he hadn't delivered what they required.
As a result, having previously paid 10% deposit to the brokers "client" account, I stated I would complete purchase by direct funds transfer by me to the vendors account and would otherwise withdraw etc. The broker and vendor accepted this and deal completed. Total price less than £20k, so in the context of what yachts can cost, limited potential risk perhaps, but I learnt some lessons!

 

[grumpy_o_g]

Yacht Brokers aren't usually even acting as brokers, they're acting as agents of the seller and are trying to sell the yacht, not to broker a deal. There is absolutely no reason any money directly related to the asset to go to the broker, other than that the broker wants it. Not saying Yacht Brokers don't provide a useful service nor that they shouldn't be suitably reimbursed by the person that they are working for but why on earth would you deliberately transfer money to someone that you know doesn't own or have title to the boat and that isn't even working for or contracted to you?

Given that a boat is much harder to whisk away than funds I'd suggest that the important thing is to make sure that the yacht is available to you once funds are transferred and then simply transfer funds by an agreed mechanism. As long as you have a contract stating that the yacht title and ownership has been transferred upon receipt of an agreed sum of money by whatever method to whatever recipient and you can show that this has taken place the law in most countries will simply let you take the boat away.

 

[Genoa]

Yacht Brokers aren't usually even acting as brokers, they're acting as agents of the seller and are trying to sell the yacht, not to broker a deal. There is absolutely no reason any money directly related to the asset to go to the broker, other than that the broker wants it. Not saying Yacht Brokers don't provide a useful service nor that they shouldn't be suitably reimbursed by the person that they are working for but why on earth would you deliberately transfer money to someone that you know doesn't own or have title to the boat and that isn't even working for or contracted to you?

Given that a boat is much harder to whisk away than funds I'd suggest that the important thing is to make sure that the yacht is available to you once funds are transferred and then simply transfer funds by an agreed mechanism. As long as you have a contract stating that the yacht title and ownership has been transferred upon receipt of an agreed sum of money by whatever method to whatever recipient and you can show that this has taken place the law in most countries will simply let you take the boat away.

I have to say, 2 of my last 3 boats I have sold privately and found this to be a much easier process for both the buyer and seller. I paid for adverts, the same as someone would "pay for" the service of a "broker" - the buyer paid me upon receipt I gave him the registration. One buyer sat by the boat until his bank confirmed payment to the account details I had given him - I set up a special "pot" with a zero balance, and was therefore happy to show him the balance when his money arrived. Job done. No third parties with the ability to run off with invisible cash.

 

[STATUE]

I have to say, 2 of my last 3 boats I have sold privately and found this to be a much easier process for both the buyer and seller. I paid for adverts, the same as someone would "pay for" the service of a "broker" - the buyer paid me upon receipt I gave him the registration. One buyer sat by the boat until his bank confirmed payment to the account details I had given him - I set up a special "pot" with a zero balance, and was therefore happy to show him the balance when his money arrived. Job done. No third parties with the ability to run off with invisible cash.

Hi Genoa,

Thanks for that good guidance.

Which advertising routes did you use ?

Many thanks

 

[Genoa]

Which advertising routes did you use ?

Many thanks

ybw.com of course (and local harbour office)

 

[rwoofer]

Nobody is defending anybody, least of all me.

Just stating the FACTS for those too lazy to read it up for themselves.

Suggest you talk to John Rodriguez who posts here as jonic and is president of the YDSA if you have any concerns about security of client accounts. Then you will get the facts from another source.

Just to add to the Peters case. This was a landmark case, not just for yacht brokers but for any of the many different types of business that use client accounts. It was a unique set of circumstances which revolved around a principle of Trust law that had never been tested in the courts. The judgement clarified the law and as a result the form of client accounts now used was set up to reflect that judgement and results in security for clients funds which can now not be used for the firm's business, nor taken by the bank. The former has always been fraud, but is now much more difficult and the latter was possible in earlier types of account. Important though to understand that neither of these things happened in Peters.

If stating the facts, which are all in the public domain is "defending the crooked" than I am guilty. Nobody was convicted of any crime, nor was the case about any criminal act. It was solely about who had a claim on the funds in the client account.

Sorry about the number of words but if you want an explanation of what was a very complex situation then you need lots of words.

Tranona,

I know you've made these points quite regularly, but having seen them numerous times, I still find myself sceptical of the security of funds. The key word you use is reputable - with a reputable dealer your money is safe. It is the unreputable dealers that matter and they are not always easier to spot in advance, as i discovered when another well know dealer went bust during a new boat purchase that i was doing at the time.

The fact that so many people still feel uncomfortable (even if misplaced) suggests that the marine industry still has a lot of work to do to remove barriers to purchasing. Given the economic downturn I'm really surprised this still remains as an issue.

 

[Resolution]

The fact that so many people still feel uncomfortable (even if misplaced) suggests that the marine industry still has a lot of work to do to remove barriers to purchasing. Given the economic downturn I'm really surprised this still remains as an issue.

Yacht broking is a pretty small segment of British industry and it is hard to build up a business of any substance. It is also horribly cyclical. All good reasons to be careful, stick to the better known names and keep checking before entering into a big transaction. Follow the expert advice of the likes of Tranoma and you are unlikely to have problems. Dive off into cowboy territory and who knows?