Sybarite
Well-Known Member
Two possibilities; which would you choose ? :
1) Traditional windvane
2) Autopilot kept charged by a trailing generator.
1) Traditional windvane
2) Autopilot kept charged by a trailing generator.
Self steering; which is the better system?
- Thread starter Sybarite
- Start date
michael_w
Well-Known Member
Both sides of the same coin. Depends on size of boat, sailing envisaged, electrical capacity, finances. It is not an either/or question. It's complicated.
That said, given a good reliable electrical supply, A second complete autopilot, can be a very cost effective option.
That said, given a good reliable electrical supply, A second complete autopilot, can be a very cost effective option.
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VicS
Well-Known Member
Which would I choose? Autopilot over windvane because it still works when there's no wind. The trailing generator I dont know enough about to comment on.
temptress
Well-Known Member
We have recently made that decision and gone for option 2 - an Autopilot (well actually 2 autopilots - complete AP as spares), upgraded charging and electrics. I was a very hard decision and was not driven by cost.
auditdata
Well-Known Member
Yachting World Atlantic Gear Test
Autopilots 83% of the fleet
Wind self Steering 15% of the fleet
Reliability rating Autopilots 85%
Reliability rating Wind self Steering 69%
Seems Autopilots are the way to go.....but wait for the onslaught of opposing views. It's a bit like and anchor thread!
Autopilots 83% of the fleet
Wind self Steering 15% of the fleet
Reliability rating Autopilots 85%
Reliability rating Wind self Steering 69%
Seems Autopilots are the way to go.....but wait for the onslaught of opposing views. It's a bit like and anchor thread!
uxb
Well-Known Member
Both!
It's a very nice feeling sailing along with the wind vane nodding happily to its self whereas seeing the wheel jerk back and forward is plain annoying.
It's a very nice feeling sailing along with the wind vane nodding happily to its self whereas seeing the wheel jerk back and forward is plain annoying.
Talulah
Well-Known Member
Some people attach a small tiller pilot to their windvane.
Power consumption is then a lot less than the inboard autopilot but overcomes the windvane steering/no wind problem.
Power consumption is then a lot less than the inboard autopilot but overcomes the windvane steering/no wind problem.
MASH
N/A
I suppose it depends very much on where you're going and how extended the legs are. As said above you'll almost certainly have an autopilot anyway so the question becomes, "Do I add a towed genny or a windvane".
The clincher for me would be how well the autopilot can handle heavy weather and storms, and running in tradewinds which is just when you really don't want to be doing it by hand. A windvane will do both well by all accounts. I doubt the same could be said for many - if any autopilots.
If you relied on an autopilot you'd need two at least for redundancy and though the water gen is not quite so critical you might be seriously inconvenienced if it failed.
The clincher for me would be how well the autopilot can handle heavy weather and storms, and running in tradewinds which is just when you really don't want to be doing it by hand. A windvane will do both well by all accounts. I doubt the same could be said for many - if any autopilots.
If you relied on an autopilot you'd need two at least for redundancy and though the water gen is not quite so critical you might be seriously inconvenienced if it failed.
bbg
Well-Known Member
Vendee Globe fleet essentially chose your option 2. Not without problems, but traditional windvanes are old technology.
Not so say they don't have a place, but the circumstances in which a windvane would be the preferred option are becoming, IMHO, limited.
It is interesting that you limit the charging mechanism to ONLY towed generator. Is there a reason for that? If that were the only means to charge it might change the equation.
Not so say they don't have a place, but the circumstances in which a windvane would be the preferred option are becoming, IMHO, limited.
It is interesting that you limit the charging mechanism to ONLY towed generator. Is there a reason for that? If that were the only means to charge it might change the equation.
V1701
Well-Known Member
Ideally both but if I had to choose I guess autopilot - more advantages for when singlehanded & works when there's no wind...
Billjratt
Well-Known Member
Don't like trailing generators - you can't get energy for nothing... If there's no wind, the engine would be on and generating, so autohelm would be sensible.
If it's ideal long distance sailing weather we're talking about, then this owner seems to have the right idea.
If it's ideal long distance sailing weather we're talking about, then this owner seems to have the right idea.
rob2
Well-Known Member
3Actually windvane and autopilot technologies are both pretty much of the same age. There are pros and cons to both, but most people have an autopilot for use near land and such manouvres as holding head to wind for hoisting sail. They are fine out at sea, although obviously a drain on the batteries, especially if under sail at night. There is some entertainment to be had fiddling with the "sea state" settings to get the straightest course for the conditions and to suit the boat.
Windvanes do come in various configurations, probably the most common now being the servo pendulum which provides the most power to steer and has feedback built into the geometry of the gear so that it steers in a more natural manner, with the input reducing as the heading returns to that set. Of course, with the gusty and shifting winds we seem to have had over the past couple of years they are of limited value when close to land or in crowded waters as the boat will veer with the wind. No power requirement though and great once you have a bit of offing to allow it to do its own thing.
Both are a great boon when short handed or when the trip is long enough to require the crew to stand watches. For myself, I would start by getting an autopilot and aspire to getting a vane system as well when the money is available.
Rob.
Windvanes do come in various configurations, probably the most common now being the servo pendulum which provides the most power to steer and has feedback built into the geometry of the gear so that it steers in a more natural manner, with the input reducing as the heading returns to that set. Of course, with the gusty and shifting winds we seem to have had over the past couple of years they are of limited value when close to land or in crowded waters as the boat will veer with the wind. No power requirement though and great once you have a bit of offing to allow it to do its own thing.
Both are a great boon when short handed or when the trip is long enough to require the crew to stand watches. For myself, I would start by getting an autopilot and aspire to getting a vane system as well when the money is available.
Rob.
michael_w
Well-Known Member
Don't like trailing generators - you can't get energy for nothing... If there's no wind, the engine would be on and generating, so autohelm would be sensible.
If it's ideal long distance sailing weather we're talking about, then this owner seems to have the right idea.
I wonder which order the vane gears were fitted. I've sailed with both the Monitor and the Hydrovane. The Monitor knock spots off the Hydrovane.
ghostlymoron
Well-Known Member
Windvane is better if you're sailing with steady winds like in the trades. Autopilot better around the coast and for short passages.
timmygobang
Well-Known Member
Both as per the reasons by other posters who say both.
But must also add, if you can afford say a hyrdovane, you can probably afford a tiller pilot
And as mentioned a autopilot is less likely to handle heavy weather well.
Also if you get a hydrovane you have the added advantage of backup steering should you experience rudder failure.
But must also add, if you can afford say a hyrdovane, you can probably afford a tiller pilot
And as mentioned a autopilot is less likely to handle heavy weather well.
Also if you get a hydrovane you have the added advantage of backup steering should you experience rudder failure.
robmcg
Well-Known Member
I would also say both - used in different circumstances. My dilemma is slightly different. I have a (new to me) boat with an Aries windvane fitted - it is in excellent condition. I have a Hydrovane in the spare room at home. Which one should I go with??
timmygobang
Well-Known Member
I would also say both - used in different circumstances. My dilemma is slightly different. I have a (new to me) boat with an Aries windvane fitted - it is in excellent condition. I have a Hydrovane in the spare room at home. Which one should I go with??
Can you use Aries as a form of emergency steering?
capnsensible
Well-Known Member
Personal preference, Hydrovane.
Koeketiene
Well-Known Member
Have thought long and hard about this.
We have an inboard autopilot which suits us for our current sailing.
It copes reasonably well with heavy seas, but it is very power hungry when doing so.
I might be showing my age, but I never truly trust electrics/electronics.
We do carry spare parts for the autopilot (apart from the compass and the hydraulic ram I carry an entire system as back-up (RFU, CPU and Control Panel)).
But what if the batteries fail? Maybe not likely, but still possible.
I once hand-helmed in heavy seas for 28hours straight (apart from a 2 hour catnap) an experience I am in no hurry to repeat.
And that was on a relatively short offshore passage - the thought of finding myself having to hand-helm in a similar situation mid-ocean fills me with horror.
Therefore we will be going down the 'both' route.
Looking at either Monitor and Aries.
Monitor would be my first choice, but financial limitations may take me down the second-hand Aries route.
Just my £0.02
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Talulah
Well-Known Member
The Monitor requires additional kit to use as a rudder.
http://www.selfsteer.com/partsService/monitor/index.php
M-RUD
