selden gennaker bowsprit

[Bosun Higgs]

I have long lusted after one of these sprits to allow me to fly a downwind gennaker. My boat is reasonably heavy and a bit short of sail area, but tbh I'm not wildly keen on the spinny when racing and would never use it 2 up for cruising. So summer sails downwind are usually pretty sedate and motor assisted at that.

But I've only met two people with the sprit and a gennaker on a cruising boat ( mine is a Starlight 35 not a J boat or a First) and neither were exactly over the moon with enthusiasm for the set up.

Anyone on here using a sprit? Anyone using a gennaker on a flexible furler for downwind work?

 

[flaming]

I have long lusted after one of these sprits to allow me to fly a downwind gennaker. My boat is reasonably heavy and a bit short of sail area, but tbh I'm not wildly keen on the spinny when racing and would never use it 2 up for cruising. So summer sails downwind are usually pretty sedate and motor assisted at that.

But I've only met two people with the sprit and a gennaker on a cruising boat ( mine is a Starlight 35 not a J boat or a First) and neither were exactly over the moon with enthusiasm for the set up.

Anyone on here using a sprit? Anyone using a gennaker on a flexible furler for downwind work?

Not used that setup, have done quite a bit of sailing on J boats.

I will be very suprised if you can get it to work properly below 150 - 160 degrees. Yes the 109s can sail as low as 170 without collapsing the kite, but that takes all the crew weight to roll the boat to windward, and a kite with a really unstable leading edge, and the constant trimming that requires...

As you won't have either (and a significantly heavier boat to boot) I think the setup will probably be great for the 100-150 range, and a clear advantage over your genoa, but don't expect to be able to get downwind with it.

That's what you have the spinnaker for....!

 

[doris]

Got this set up on a ehler 39.

You will not get below 140 with a stable sail. But then if you put a symetrical kite you would still sail the angles in light wind. For cruising definitely worth have the prodder on the front, for racing I am unconvinced either way as the hike in rating for an articulated pole raises lots of questions.

We are great believers in snuffers (Flaming will difer) cos our kites are 120m and thats a lot on ones jack. On your boat a letter box drop will be fine so long as you have a loose footed main. After 5 seasons of asyms and a prodder I would probably go the same route again for cruising, not sure about racing. Not having any pretty coloured downwind sails would be a definte no no.

 

[Sans Bateau]

I think FullCircle of this parish has one.

 

[Bosun Higgs]

Thanks Doris but the main issue for me is a duff foot and the difficulty of foredeck work with the pole when just myself and swmbo on board.

Racing fully crewed we use the kite though with the boat being a cruiser and not as well laid out for such things as a race boat, spinny handling takes us longer than I would like and is more prone to cock ups.

But why can't I get a gennaker to set below 150 or so when I can get my genoa to do that. OK I have to goose wing the genoa below 160 but surely a gennaker is the same. Am I missing something here?

 

[dmmbruce]

Page 63 - 66 of this month's PBO might help your thinking.

Mike

 

[johnphilip]

Seldon pole

I have fitted a Selden pole to our 33' to fly the cruising chute. It does now seem to be more stable and works better both with beam winds and further off the wind. We do goosewing the sail reasonably successfully but you tend to sail to the wind direction to keep it filling rather than closely keeping to a compass course. (Thank goodness for GPS to get us back to destination)
One issue fitting the pole is that to extend it I have to take the anchor off the bow roller and stow it in the locker, you may be luckier. Do check out the fitting fully before purchase, get the right front fitting and make sure you can get the bolts through the deck to a secure point at the stem. When working out which pole to get remember there is a restriction on the recommended cantilever from the front fitting, you may be surprised how little projection you get beyond the pulpit, but even a modest pole gives better downwind sailing.

 

[doris]

Thanks Doris but the main issue for me is a duff foot and the difficulty of foredeck work with the pole when just myself and swmbo on board.

But why can't I get a gennaker to set below 150 or so when I can get my genoa to do that. OK I have to goose wing the genoa below 160 but surely a gennaker is the same. Am I missing something here?

In this years 2 handed Triangle we had a pair of 'new' knees and the prodder set up makes the foredeck work much easier.

As regard wing angle....mybe you have a significantly larger fore triangle ie. your mast is relatively further back than mine which enables you to keep your genoa working deeper. My jib flaps uselessly at 150plus. If you can go down to 160 all the more reason to get that prodder on and enjoy some painless downwind cruising.

 

[FullCircle]

I still haven't had enough practice with mine, but we have got it sorted, we think.

I bought the largest diameter bowsprit, so I could have a 1.1m length out the front.
I have the Crusader Magic Furl continuous line drum, with snap shackles for the line to attach to the stanchions leading aft. The clue seems to be to tighten the furling halyard until the bowsprit just begins to visually deform upward, and then the furling torque rope seems to work best, and the sail goes in nice and tight.
I use 2 sheets and gybe round the outside of the chute forestay.

I have a standard length spinny pole for attaching to the sheet for going dead downwind. I do this nearly every time, because the River Crouch normally has the wind going straight down the river. Its a doddle to gybe.

The sail starts to get out of control at just over 15kts, so I put it away then.
I mean to try a Genoa/Chute twinned out downwind with no main, but that is for another season.

 

[Quandary]

My Finngulf came with one of those (its on the extras list but Finngulfs Uk importer had preordered with it) as my wife has inexplicably developed an aversion to kites I was happy enough to have it. I had the choice of three North gennakers included in the deal and went for the biggest (in white in case she mistook it for a spinnaker) It has been someting of a disappointment, not many handling advantages over a proper spinnaker and a lot less flexibility. It is nice for reaching in lightish winds but takes far too much effort and faffing about to get any useful performance out of it down wind. I carry a spinnaker pole and boom out the genny more often for running. Its range is so limited that it is not very often used, for instance we would not bother to get it out when it is raining as it then needs to be stowed wet. You can see the pole bend close reaching if it freshens though the pad eyes and projection are to Seldens spec. so do not be greedy with the projection. Just nothing like the fun you get from flying a decent spinnaker. The forward ring is incorporated into the pulpit leg but still interferes with furling the through deck furlex if the halyard is eased just a little too much as the snap shackle strikes it as it rotates but the foredeck on this boat is very narrow by todays standards so is a bit crowded.
I think if you are accustomed to a spinnaker the gennaker is no substitute but marginally better than nothing, for an area with predominantly light reaching winds it might be better.

 

[Chi34]

I think a chat with a sailmaker is in order.
If you want an assy for running, it can be cut for that and will sail deeper than an all-rounder assy. This is probably not a sail for a furler.
On the other hand, a flat assy on a furler will fly very close in light weather but not deep.
And once you get your head round gybing downwind, it's a breeze for shorthanded sailing. Not sure if the pole makes much difference, except for tangles with the anchor etc.