Seasickness & sailing schools/instructors

[Pete R]

One of the big problems with seasickness is that it affects different people different ways. Mind you one of the worst things for a sufferer is some mach man telling them to buck up. Some people can work through it, I can still remember a young radar operator who would do his 4 hour watch standing at the PPI with a bucket wedged between his feet, and he never missed a contact. Equally there are others who need to curl up and die. Some are best up on deck, whilst others are better down below sleeping. Always having some food in your belly is good as you have something to bring up, every one has their favourite. Finally getting your sealegs is real, the longer you spend at sea the better you get at coping.

I am not susrpised that so many got so sick just a few hours into a rough passage, it was inevitable.

I agree there is no one remedy that fits all. A good skipper would hopefully try anything to get that person back functioning again but if it don't work then its time to go somewhere safe.

 

[RobbieW]

I agree there is no one remedy that fits all...

Sitting under a tree works in most cases

 

[Ludd]

Ginger

is reputed to have originated(as a palliative for sea sickness) with the Chinese .

 

[Resolution]

As a chronic sufferer I have found the battery powered ReliefBand quite amazingly effective. That's the watch-like thing you strap to the inside of your wrist, where it gives a hefty electric shock every few seconds.
Almost as good, and useful when the batteries have run down, is simply to apply heavy pressure with your thumb to the inside of one wrist.
And one last point if a guest starts to feel ill, is to give them a pill but make sure they hold it under their tongue to dissolve slowly. Don't let them swallow it. The theory (I was told) is that under the tongue it will be absorbed into the blood stream, in the stomach it will just swill.

 

[fireball]

Stupid IPC won't let me edit posts on phone I mention to show your NOT seasick

Well I don't know if it is an actual requirement but I got ds prac ok and I do get seasick.

As searush says. Mine is pure anxiety which is daft because I know in going to be ok but the body or sub conscious just worries about it.
Eating isn't an option - I can nibble a few bits but mostly it makes me feel worse. The water bottles are great though - even if you're not actually sick you still need to drink.
I'm lucky enough that I can be sick and just carry on. Even on the wheel - ap goes on then I'm ok for a while longer.

Can I just say though - if you have someone onboard feeling queezy - don't ask them how they are or if you can get them anything. Just have a bucket/bowl handy and offer them normal rounds. Talking about it just makes them concentrate on the problem more and usually makes them worse. Keep an eye yes. But don't make a fuss please !!

 

[rib]

a good curry the night before/during can help some peeps too

 

[xyachtdave]

Talking about it just makes them concentrate on the problem more and usually makes them worse. Keep an eye yes. But don't make a fuss please !!

My psychologist brother brought his 2 girls sailing and constantly asked them if they felt sick!

'No?'......'Are you sure??'

 

[maxi77]

I agree there is no one remedy that fits all. A good skipper would hopefully try anything to get that person back functioning again but if it don't work then its time to go somewhere safe.

I would hope a good skipper would have known before he set sail what the chances of his crew becoming hors de combat in the conditions he expects to meet. I know I can work through mal de mer but I am equally aware that a high percentage cannot, especially those with little experience of extended periods of roughweather.

 

[rib]

all ways eat something that tastes good coming up

 

[fireball]

My psychologist brother brought his 2 girls sailing and constantly asked them if they felt sick!

'No?'......'Are you sure??'

I'd have shuved him overboard.

All the skippers ive sailed with have asked once and left it at that. You can see they check - but that's all. Surprised one crew too when he went down below - lucky bigger could rebuild an engine in any weather.

 

[KenMcCulloch]

I often get a bit seasick when I haven't been to sea for some months but regular exposure to motion seems to create a fair bit of immunity. My last minor bout was in November when I spent two hours with my head in the bilge trying to reasemble a shaft coupling. That was tied up to a pontoon on a particularly nasty day.....

 

[Thincat]

I don't think that anyone could be more prone to seasickness than I am. I have tried everything and the only thing that works for me is singing out loud, very loud. it settles the stomach immediately.
I must find and learn some new "old sailing songs" for next summer and fit new speakers to the cockpit.

 

[Boomshanka]

The only thing that might make me slightly queasy is when I can't see the horizon on a moonless, cloudy night passage with a bit of a swell running. Helming helps, but I normally go straight for a Stugeron or two and never a problem after that.

 

[ffiill]

Just a personal opinion as I dont suffer from it unless I try to ignore the boats movement.I far more often get landsick when I come ashore!
It always suprises me on a ferry to see people walking in a straight line;sat down watching a television;walking with their head not moving up and down etc when the boat is doing exactly that.
When I am on a boat in rough weather I sway with the boat;take ite compression with my legs;move my head with its motion;I am totally aware of its motion..If forced to sit still and pretend its not happening then I begin to feel quesy-same on an aeroplane or in a car.

 

[Marmalade]

close focus on something down below will do it for me every time, as will certain types of motion - people I've sailed with for a long time have more likely than not seen me chunder - although once I've chucked-up I'm usually OK.

Golden rules for me which work most of the time:

1. Take stugeron the night before and keep topped up
2. Never get hungry; never get full. Don't eat greasy stuff
3. A trick on the helm always helps
4. Get your head properly down if you're going to - ie horizontal and eyes shut
5. Sail with sympathetic people. There's nothing worse than a smug git. If you encounter one - throw up on him.

 

[little_roundtop]

My worst bout of seasickness was on my first Channel crossing years ago. We left Yarmouth very early, so no breakfast, I got very wet shortly afterwards (rain and seaspray) and a short while later I caught a whiff of the engine exhaust and I was done for.

The rest of the crew took me below and laid me on the cabin floor within easy reach of the heads - but still in my wet gear. And then they forgot me! I got colder and colder and almost any movement brought on a bought of dry retching. I knew I was running the risk of serious hypothermina staying in my wet gear so fought through the retching and managed to get all my wet gear off and got into my sleeping bag (that alone took the best part of an hour I reckon). The effect was almost instantaneous, once I was dry and warm I began to feel much better.

Now when I get a seasick crewmember I get someone to get their gear off and get them into their sleeping bag - in their berth if they can stand it or on the cabin floor otherwise. And I make sure to check on them too!

 

[Babylon]

Just going back to the OP's original point:

Also, I think this perhaps points up a limitation of those little RYA books with diagrams instead of write-through text - a little pic & an injunction to 'keep warm' under the heading 'personal comfort' is not the same as spelling out 'keep warm, fed & not too tired or you will be sick as a parrot'.

I personally think those little RYA books are examples of the most effective instructional literature I've ever come across, especially for novices, with the watercolour illustrations conveying perfectly the scenarios being described. But they're not intended to be detailed or comprehensive - hence the many other specialist books out there, from heavy-weather through to sail-trim, etc.

It is the job of the instructor to put flesh on the bare bones of the syllabus, and if some are deficient in this area then it is probably worth contacting the RYA and pointing this out. They can issue a short release to all their approved schools underlining all the known causes and range of remedies (different things will work for different people), and enjoining them to ensure all their instructors (including external ones) are aware of these. This will probably result in a higher proportion of first-timers not giving up sailing as soon as they set foot ashore once again after the hateful effects of experiencing seasickness - and ensure that the RYA as an organisation gains more members!

Causes:
- Hunger
- Cold
- Fatigue
- Fear
- Greasy foods
- Caffeine (esp coffee)
- etc

Remedies
- etc, etc


Go Lucy Go!

 

[Bosun Higgs]

Seasickness is a very unpleasant condition & it's very real, but there are a lot of things you can do to mitigate it - so why do so many sailing instructors still seem to be so ignorant on the subject? And why doesn't the RYA make sure that they're not?

If you do your yachtmaster you dont get taught how to maintain your boat either. Its not what the course is about and its not in the syllabus.

Everything you said about seasickness I already know though I couldnt tell you where I picked it up from. I'm surprised you needed telling when you are aware that you suffer from the problem.

Incidentally it is partly in the mind and not everything you have been told works for everyone. And there are lots of people who swear by all sorts of nostrums from wrist bands to those funny specs the french have invented. The medics will tell you its all about different signals from the eyes and the ears so the looking at the horizon bit does help.

Personally I find it makes me sleepy and if I can go down below and have an hours kip, sea sickness has then disappeared.

 

[Nico]

My worst bout of seasickness was on my first Channel crossing years ago. We left Yarmouth very early, so no breakfast ...

Getting back to the OP the problem seems to me to be those in a position of authority (instructors or skippers etc.) don't suffer and therefore don't empathise, so tend to forget that seasickness is one of the most important issues in sailing. As somebody who suffers, I'm always sympathetic and all the solutions are generally well known and well described above. I'll start with making sure that everybody is fed and there are easy options available if it cuts up rough. Where possible I'll get a potential sufferer to take the helm for a spell. Once somebody is sick then the best thing is to get them horizontal down below.

I've been on board boats where the skipper hasn't really bothered to sort out food, such as the race to Cherbourg where we left the dock around five a.m. for a seven o'clock start. When I asked what the eating arrangements were (normally we'd eat some sort of casserole/stew before the start) I was told that the skipper had had a big lunch and there were some chocolate bars and crisps on board.

The most unsympathetic skipper was on my comp crew course twenty years ago. Our instructor, an old school type in his sixties, told us that there was no such thing as sea sicknesss and it was caused by eating "spicy foods" such as chilli before hand. Idiot.

For me I have become more resilient over time but that is in part due to eating well and doing the right thing such as getting horizontal when going off watch and not spending twenty minutes at the nav table in lumpy seas. A few years ago on a Fastnet we had a problem with blocked heads and I found I was able to dismantle the heads in quite lumpy conditions without feeling sick. This I attributed to simple acclimatisation: I'd been at sea for four or five days by then. When I went ashore at Plymouth I could barely stand up!

 

[Submariner!]

This was a good thread to start. I have been a qualified instructor for over 20 years and have to say that in the training updates we have done, we have not really gone too much into this subject beyond the obvious safety links -

1 - The link to Hypothermia
2 - Clip on before you are sick
3 - be sick on the downwind side.

In practice I am much more alert to sea-sickness in the crew and how its going to affect the balance of the programme we are running in any specific course or cruise. Its quite a difficult balance as if a person is badly ill, they have to be managed and supported but at the same time, we have a programme to run for the rest of the clients.

The management response will be different depending on the crew experience and the sort of activity we are running - here are a few examples -

Day Skipper Course / Comp crew (there is often a mix of these two levels on board): At this level, we get plenty of people who are not experienced and not always aware that they may suffer from sea sickness. There is a wide range of skills we cover in this course. If people start to get really bad on day one, I will generally manage the situation whilst at sea to keep the person comfortable and initiate the plan to detour to a sheltered place and cover another subject such berthing etc. We return to the passage making next day.

The key thing here is for instructors to be flexible at the start of the course whilst crew adjusts to the moving environment.

Longer passages - Cross Channel: Normally people fronting up for these activities will have some experience and will be aware of how they may react. Before setting off, I will explain to the crew what sort of weather they will encounter. One specific area where people turn a bit green is coming down below to put on more cloths. In poor weather the act of going to the toilet (removing foulies, life-jackets etc will turn an otherwise unaffected crew member green.

The idea is to keep an eye on the crew as individuals or as a whole to gauge how people are feeling. If there is a significant malaise amongst a number of people, then I will broach the subject along the lines "guys, its a bit ****ty here- what are you thinking? Perhaps its a good day to go to the pub and talk about sailing"

There are a lot of grey areas here and you need to strike a balance as you do not want to be turning back in a force 2 for a person getting slightly queasy. It should be crew awareness and common sense in the end!

Couple of other tips -

On one occasion, I had one lady who signed up for an ocean cruise. I knew her very well from previous courses and knew that e would be flat out for a couple of days with sea-sickness. Turning back would not be an option as she would probably kill me! Anyhow, I persuaded her to go and see her GP to get a stronger remedy. She was prescribed patches with slow release medicine. It worked - sort of.... Still spent some tie flat in her bunk, but really enjoyed the trip.

Crews may present themselves on-board with a number of remedies. You may think these may be weird and ineffective, but good skippers will always be supportive and not rubbish the remedy.

During a trip, a seasickness sufferer may ask you to go for a walk with them down the pontoon - As they set out the case about why they wish to leave the crew due to sea sickness. Listen. If there mind is really made up, don't try to talk them out of it - They will have agonised on the subject for some time before approaching you. Its often a big decision.

There may be an occasion where a crew member is undecided whether to pull out or not. Again, this is a decision for the crew member to make. Be aware of the most up to date weather forecast and ensure that you give the crew member the best information you can about the potential sea conditions on the return or next leg.

To sum this all up; be aware of how the crew is handling conditions, communicate well and be flexible.