Seacock stuck?

[nigelmercier]

Replace with DZR as advised.

I've also got a sticky seacock that I want to replace. I have no idea of the thread size, I'm guessing about 2"...

Any suggestions where to buy one?

 

[VicS]

A.S.A.P. supplies http://www.asap-supplies.com/ probably

But you'll need to know the size before ordering

 

[rob2]

Look on the bright side - you're sorting this out with the boat already out of the water! A lot of thru hull fittings have lugs in them so you can insert a tool to stop it turning. Just find something that locks in there and someone can hold it steady while you unscrew the ball valve. The valve has been bedded on PTFE tape to ensure a seal (it's really a lubricant, so it let's you screw it down a bit harder) which will also make it easier to unscrew. Most are one-piece construciton so you can use either of the hex ends to get a spanner, or more likely a stilson, on it. Once it's off, you may be able to scrape or chip the worst of the rubbish out and immerse it in some vinegar to get it really clean.

It has been suggested that it is chromed brass, but it's hard to tell from a photo - it could be stainless which looks much greyer than we're used to when in its unpolished state. Either way, once clean you'll be able to see from both sides whether the plastic sealing ring is OK. If not, then you'll have to replace the whole thing.

Should the worst happen and the hull fitting moves, don't panic. At least now you can remove that too and reseat it on fresh mastic, gives peace of mind and really doesn't take long. I have known others to set the ball valve onto the stem before finally screwing down the hull fitting as you can then position the handle just where you want it.

Rob.

 

[nigelmercier]

Just find something that locks in there and someone can hold it steady while you unscrew the ball valve.

A socket with a groove cut down each side works well.

 

[Rossynant]

Any suggestions where to buy one?

Put in google (or other) DZR BSP valve, marine grade
Got mine from store, but a boat engineers close by sell the same on ebay, same price. Big size like 2" cost some, so shopping on the net may be best way.

At this moment ebay is cheaper than asap, same valve, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-BSP-DZR...tEquipment_Accessories_SM&hash=item3372749211

Or it's possible to get proper bronze, but from USa - still make them.

 

[nigelmercier]

At this moment ebay is cheaper than asap, same valve, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-BSP-DZR...tEquipment_Accessories_SM&hash=item3372749211

Thanks, I couldn't find a 2" one on ASAP, hence my question.

I'm going to have to do some measuring on photographs to check the size.

 

[VicS]

Thanks, I couldn't find a 2" one on ASAP, hence my question.

I'm going to have to do some measuring on photographs to check the size.

ASAP have 2" ball valves . Brass, bronze, DZR and stainless steel.


http://www.asap-supplies.com/marine/ball-valves

2" is big though its the bore of the pipe it will screw onto. OD of a 2" BSP thread is 2.347"

 

[prv]

Thanks, I couldn't find a 2" one on ASAP, hence my question.

Strange. I bought one from them a matter of weeks ago. Can't see why they would suddenly be missing from the site, they don't hide things even when they're temporarily out of stock.

I'm going to have to do some measuring on photographs to check the size.

Be aware that no part of a 2" BSP valve is actually two inches in diameter. The measurement refers to the size of black iron gas pipe that a Victorian fitter would have cut the thread onto the end of. Wikipedia (and no doubt other sites) list the actual dimensions for the various BSP thread sizes.

Pete

 

[Rossynant]

Thanks, I couldn't find a 2" one on ASAP, hence my question.

Just noticed your boat location - weeeeell... most equipment from big corporations cost the same amount in euro as in pound. Just a thought.

Originally I was shopping for a boat in europe close by - forgive me but I like old british boatbuilding philosophy - so i got english boat but still some of gears are better in germany or france, and you pay in euro Just a thought.

Measure with valve in hand....

edit: of course ASAP has the valve (that's how I found the current price) , as some other stores as well. But on something worth 50 it's worth to check the possibilities

 

[nigelmercier]

Be aware that no part of a 2" BSP valve is actually two inches in diameter...

So these are measured by the BSP pipe size, thanks. For some reason I was thinking it was the the OD of the hose.

In that case my smaller seacocks are ¾" BSP as the threads measure about 1", so it is likely the larger ones are 1½", but I'll have another look at the pictures I have.

 

[VicS]

So these are measured by the BSP pipe size, thanks. For some reason I was thinking it was the the OD of the hose.

In that case my smaller seacocks are ¾" BSP as the threads measure about 1", so it is likely the larger ones are 1½", but I'll have another look at the pictures I have.

OD of a 3/4" BSP thread is 1.041"

 

[Boo2]

ASAP have 2" ball valves . Brass, bronze, DZR and stainless steel.

Note that ASAP's bronze valves have chrome plated brass balls. If you want a proper marine valve from ASAP I'd go for their DZR versions which have DZR balls.

Boo2

 

[Tranona]

So these are measured by the BSP pipe size, thanks. For some reason I was thinking it was the the OD of the hose.

In that case my smaller seacocks are ¾" BSP as the threads measure about 1", so it is likely the larger ones are 1½", but I'll have another look at the pictures I have.

If it is the loo outlet on your Bavaria then is a standard inch and half.

 

[Murv]

Thanks very much all, your advice is greatly appreciated.
Struggled for ages with it yesterday, the hose that's fixed to the top of it seems to have been almost melted on, the ridges on the tubing are far smoother where it connects the valve and there's no way it's shifting without cutting it off.
Also had no luck at all unscrewing it, not quite sure how much pressure I can put on it before the hull cracks, but straining hard enough to make my eyes pop with a very large adjustable had no effect whatsoever.

Will have another go at it next weekend once I've cheered up a bit!

 

[Tranona]

The hose will be a really tight fit - often necessary to heat them to get to fit over the spigot so not surprising difficult to move. Latest sanitary grade hose is much better in this respect so you might find eventual replacement easier. Have you squirted WD 40 up the outlet hole? Might help free off the crud that is stopping the ball from moving.

If you do get to the stage where nothing shifts it, then best in the long run to take an angle grinder to the outside flange, cutting at the edge of the bore and pulling the whole lot inside. Undo the hose from the loo end (or cut) and replace the hose and fittings with new. Another job and expense, but worth it in the long run.

 

[ghostlymoron]

You were not being stupid, the valve body is indeed in two parts, that's how they get the ball in! It's pretty unusual to dismantle them, though.

I've tried dismantling mine - it's not possible without some serious engineering equipment (which I do not have).

 

[Steve C Cronin]

Thanks very much all, your advice is greatly appreciated.
Struggled for ages with it yesterday, the hose that's fixed to the top of it seems to have been almost melted on, the ridges on the tubing are far smoother where it connects the valve and there's no way it's shifting without cutting it off.
Also had no luck at all unscrewing it, not quite sure how much pressure I can put on it before the hull cracks, but straining hard enough to make my eyes pop with a very large adjustable had no effect whatsoever.

Will have another go at it next weekend once I've cheered up a bit!

That is the very nature of the beast! The hose hardens with use and especially in winter it is difficult to shift. If you are replacing it, then cut it off, don't struggle. When fitting the new, which you should check is a proper odour impermeable type, use a hairdryer to keep the end supple and some silicone grease or washing up liquid to lubricate it.

Once you can see into the top of the valve, you are in a good position to insert some penetrating lubricant which if left for even just a couple of hours will greatly assist in freeing off the valve so that after working back and forth a couple of dozen times and the application of a heavier, more permanent underwater grease, mightn't require valve replacement at all. I insist that everyone adopts the regieme of closing both seacocks after toilet use EVERY time. This not only encourages good safety procedures but ensures that the seacocks remain free all season - mine are the originals and coming up for 12 years old. Remember too that since female urine contains more calcium than male urine, a sealoo used by the ladies is going to need proportionately more maintenance. I can confirm this to be true by our experience with two loos on our boat.

As to loostening the valve body from the skin fitting, there are appropriate spanners made and one would be a wise investment. To avoid turning the skin fitting in the hull and breaking the sealant, note that on the outer end of the fitting there are two indents or sometimes lugs. These are to take a special tool which an assistant needs to bear against as you unscrew from the inside. However, a good alternative can be an old heavy file held in a pair of vicegrips. Good luck, once you've done it for the first time and have the right kit, you'll get the feel of it much better in future.

 

[Murv]

Fantastic, thank you.
Right, feel far more confident about tackling this at the weekend, will report back with good news next week (trying to keep the positivity flowing!)

 

[Murv]

Have you squirted WD 40 up the outlet hole? Might help free off the crud that is stopping the ball from moving.

Must admit I haven't done this, I need to pop down to the boat tomorrow (friend of mine is starting on the cambelt) so will give it a good spray then as it may soak in by the weekend.

 

[lenseman]

I assume it is anyway, can't seem to turn it.
any tips for freeing it up? I don't want to put too much pressure on it as I'm bound to fracture the hull the way our lucks been going with this bl**dy boat!

Assuming you are on your own and trying to free off the sea-cock lever, because you are applying direct force to the lever you are playing against the sea-cock fitting to the hull, which can be detrimental to the integrity of the hull fitting.

You need to apply the opposing force to the body of the sea-cock and this can be done easily by using a long pair of Stilson's tightened up on the top two flat flanges in your photograph either side of the PTFE tape just below the flexible hose and jubilee clips. These Stilson's need to be as long as possible, preferably with handles 24 inches or longer (mine are 36 inch).

. . .Long Handled 'Record' Stilson's

Then when you come to apply a force on the red lever (pushing away from you) the reaction force can be applied to the handle of the Stilson by pressing down hard on its handle. In this way you should only be applying effort into the Sea-cock itself.

Gentle warming of the body of the sea-cock before you start would be advisable (a blow lamp on low heat).


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