Sadler 34?

[pugwash60]

I'm thinking of buying bigger boat, I want something reasonably easy to handle alone, comfortable at sea and with good sailing performance. I'm upgrading from a long keeler and want a skeg hung rudder and probably built in the 80s or early 90s. I'm very interested in the Sadler 34 which looks ideal to me. I'm told that they tend to smell a bit, I'm presuming that if this is the case it's probably due to water in the foam, do owners have problems with water ingress, presumably it's harder than normal to trace and can go un noticed for some time. Are there obvious places where it gathers where it may be possible to remove the inner skin to dry it out and patch up the foam and / or examine for dampness? Are there known common problems other than the chain plate fittings to look out for? Are the windows a leak prone area, and are they relatively easy to remove and re fit if required?

The other thing is that I tend to spend a lot of time at sea sitting at the forward end of the cockpit and reading, the track goes right across the cockpit here, is there room to squeeze an average sized bum forward of the track or is it right in the way?

Other Boats on the short list are Scanmar 33 and Nich 35 do others spring to mind that I should be thinking about? Ideally I'd prefer tiller steering and a stern suitable to hang my self steering on, although I suppose I could fabricate a bracket to fit most things.

 

[john]

Hi

As a long standing owner, I've never heard the one about the interior smelling! My understanding is that the he foam is closed cell, so can't absorb. Like most yachts the chainplates will need rebedding from time to time (i've done it twice in 14+ years of ownership) and thats a straightforward job. I had my windows resealed by a company 10+ years ago and they haven't leaked a drop.

The track across the companion way isn't a problem in practice and we tend to sit length ways with our backs to the bulkhead on a good full length cushion.

There will be lots more expertise to come on here, including someone who will link to the picture of the Sadler 34 still reassuringly floating after being rammed by a coaster.

My final take is that the only thing lacking for me is a larger double berth, and I don't think it is worth changing such a wonderful boat for just that reason - I'll try and lose some weight instead, though I can't do much about 6 foot 6 height!

John

 

[vyv_cox]

I have owned one for almost 20 years now, so you may consider me biased if you wish. Here are my comments to your points:

Smell is a new one on me, never in ours and never mentioned as far as I know on the S&SOA forum, which I have used regularly since it commenced.
Water in the foam is a bit of an urban myth. I have heard of a couple of cases in which water got between the foam and one of the skins, mainly because somebody has added a fitting and not sealed it properly, in one of the 'wet' wells, i.e. the engine bilge or the shower tray. One place that water can gather is in the ducting between the heads and the chart table. This is because someone has used the shower, undoubtedly the worst bit of design in the boat. The foam is completely closed cell and will not absorb water. When I cut some out to fit my yacht legs I immersed it in water for weeks to see what would happen. Result - nothing.
The lowest point inside the boat is in the bilge above the keel, so drilling a small hole in the inner skin here would drain any water away and reassure you without creating any problems.
You seem to know about the lower shroud plates, there is lots on the forum about them and it is not difficult to fix.
The windows can be problematical. After years of rebedding the glass in the frames, which lasted for various lengths of time from days to a few weeks I have now bitten the bullet and had them done professionally. Time will tell but others who followed the same route have been successful.
One of the great features of the 34 is that its cockpit is remarkably comfortable and the place you mention is our favourite. The trick is to retain the mast track stops, a primitive design that takes a bit of getting used to. However, the track ends are comfortable to sit on. Adding blocks and cleats to haul the traveller across turns comfortable seating into a spiky torture, so learn to live with the stops.
These are minor points in what is a great boat. It's no accident that so many sea schools use them, although theirs may be the ones that smell!.

 

[Goldie]

"I'm upgrading from a long keeler"

What makes you say "upgrading?" Changing yes, but does the shorter keel necessarily mean it's an upgrade? Ok, I'm being a bit mischevious - some would say 'defensive' there . I used to look after a club owned Sadler 34 for a couple of years and don't remember ever having a 'smell' amongst the end of charter comments. They sail really well (I once experienced sustained 45 kts gusting 55) and manouvre easily so ok for single handing in harbour situations. I think P bracket issues have been reported on occasion (it could be an A bracket, it was a few years ago now) but otherwise, it was an easy boat to look after and like. The down side of the double skin construction is that if you do get a leak, tracing it can be very difficult because where the water makes itself known may bear no resemblance to where the water is actually getting in!

FWIW, for best performance a 34 with the Stephen Jones designed keel (post circa 1990?) would seem to be the one to go for if performance is important to you. It's too long ago for me to recall the comfort of squeezing my bum around the track I'm afraid. Good luck in your search.

 

[mikebryan]

Also owned my Sadler 34 for twenty years, never had a problem with smell, in fact I have never had a problem with the boat.

For me she has classic lines, which I never tire of looking at. The sailing performance is predictable, which is for me, as a single hander, more important than outright speed. I really enjoy owning her, even after so many years. I can endorse Goldie`s comment about the Stephen Jones deep keel. I had one fitted about ten years ago, made a world of difference.

Would never contemplate selling my Sadler 34

 

[jbweston]

I used to have a Sadler 34 and liked her a lot. I changed her because she was showing her age and I wanted a newer boat with some different features.

So I'd sound two notes of caution:

1. All Sadler 34s are getting on a bit now. Because they are good boats many have had lots of use (some in sailing clubs) and so you might need to look quite hard to find one that hasn't been hammered.

2. The main practical problem I found is that they are hard to rewire because of the visually very attractive double skin construction. This looks great, provides good insulation and therefore freedom from condensation, but it makes rewiring (or new wiring) hard as you can't run it between the skins and so have to tuck it where you can. There are ways round this like using wireless instruments (which I chose to do). And of course rewiring in the cockpit lockers and engine compartment isn't difficult as they are like any other boat there. Because of their age you are going to have to rewire some time soon if it hasn't been done already.

I never found the mainsheet got in the way of sitting comfortably. But I found all the reefing lines, spinnaker up-down-etc hauls for two spinnaker booms and spare halliards all came back to the cockpit and were coiled against the cabin bulkhead and they were more of a problem - wet and lumpy against my back. That depends how your chosen boat is rigged - no spinnakers and roller headsail would reduce the knitting.

All-in-all a very good boat. I sailed all over the Channel and down to Brittany and back, often singlehanded. My most memorable trip (apart from across from Gosport to Cherbourg at night in the pouring rain, all alone and staring alternately into the gloom and into the radar!) was by myself back from Brest to Gosport in October via the N Brittany Coast and Channel Islands - a lovely week in great weather. I was very happy with her.

 

[Slowtack]

Anything you want to ask about Scanmar 33 - please do.
Have mine since 2005 and no regrets.

 

[pugwash60]

Thanks very much everyone for your informative replies which have re assured me a lot. My worry on the water ingress thing was on account of having taken several years to track down a drip on my own boat and with the double skin I'd probably not have noticed that there was a drip in the first place. I'm particularly pleased that sitting at the Fwd end of the cockpit isn't a big issue. I presume the shower isn't designed to drain into the ducting, but sometimes the shower well and pump don't work?
On the Upgrading word please don't be offended, it will be bigger, newer and professionally built as opposed to my currently home finished one, hence the upgrade. Nothing against long keelers apart from the odd curse in marinas when things don't go according to plan. Looking at my original post I can see what you mean, it sounds like I'm slaggin them off but far from it, one has to be so careful what one says online, and I didn't phrase that well.

Thanks for the offer on the Scanmar too, one concern might be tacking, is it easy enough to steer from ahead of the binnacle whilst hauling the sheet, I'm used to a tiller which I can steer with a leg whilst cranking in the sheet, and have you had any problems which would be worth my while knowing about if I was looking at one in case it had the same?

 

[vyv_cox]

The shower on the 34 is quite frankly a joke. In the first place it is located in the heads space that is predominantly built in wood. On the starboard side are the hanging lockers that have zipped cloth doors, also far from ideal.

Any water that misses the shower tray is free to run under the saloon door as there is no threshold step. It then sits in the forward bilge cavity, which accounts for the fact that on many boats the steel washers beneath the forward keel bolts are rusty, but no others are.

Some of the water runs down the hole alongside the mast compression post through which the cables for the mast emerge from the ducting below. This is the one that is often wet. This can also be a problem if there are any leaks from the toilet hoses. I have made a small diverter in Milliput to direct any such leaks into the shower tray. I also find that a wine bottle cork fits the hole fairly well but needs some cutting to allow the cables through.

Another quirky design feature exists in the galley. This took us a long time to diagnose, so it may be useful. When we bought the boat there were signs of long term water accumulation at the base of the locker under the sinks. There were water stains there and the sink drain seacock handle was very rusty (missed by the surveyor). Over some years we occasionally found significant amounts of water in the recess where the seacock exits the boat but we could never find a leak. Having owned the boat for more than ten years we finally found the source. The fresh water tank was full and we were close hauled on starboard tack when we saw water running from the Whale manual water pump at the galley, past the gash bin lid and down to the locker below. Once the boat came upright the water ran into the recess. It only happened when the tank was full and its level was above that of the tap. We fixed it by putting a small rubber cap over the tap spout.

 

[JumbleDuck]

The fresh water tank was full and we were close hauled on starboard tack when we saw water running from the Whale manual water pump at the galley, past the gash bin lid and down to the locker below. Once the boat came upright the water ran into the recess. It only happened when the tank was full and its level was above that of the tap. We fixed it by putting a small rubber cap over the tap spout.

My boat has a very similar feature, particularly when the water tanks are full.The Whale outlet (tap? faucet?) has a twist-to-seal arrangement on the end, like this

but I don't find it very reliable and usually take it off when I want water to come out at more than a dribble.

 

[vyv_cox]

Our whale device is the V-pump

We have had several of them as they are particularly poor. We were only ever able to buy one with the shut-off seal. We have now replaced the manual pump, which was supplementary to the pressurised system, with the rather beautiful tap for our Seagull IV filter.

 

[JumbleDuck]

Our whale device is the V-pump

We have had several of them as they are particularly poor. We were only ever able to buy one with the shut-off seal. We have now replaced the manual pump, which was supplementary to the pressurised system, with the rather beautiful tap for our Seagull IV filter.

I have one of them for the sink in the heads, where it's useless for washing hands because you can't pump and wet hands effectively at the same time. A baby foot pump is on the list ...

 

[Slowtack]

I often sail my Scanmar single handed, steering and sail handling is not a problem. No need to go forward of the wheel for tacking or gybing under main and headsail. There are 4 x 40 dual speed self tailing winches as standard equipment. One pair forward in the cockpit for when you have crew. The other pair are located aft and ideally placed for use from the normal helming position behind the wheel. I use the aft winches for the headsail sheets when singlehanded. The mainsheet is just forward of the wheel and also in easy reach. I use double reefing lines all led aft so all three reefs can be made and unmade from the cockpit.l The boat is well suited for shorthanded and singlehanded sailing.

 

[richardbrennan]

You ask for alternatives; have you considered a Westerly Fulmar?

 

[richardbrennan]

Or a Vancouver 32?

 

[Ravi]

To the OP -
I went to see a very cheap one in Greece, dreaming of a bargain, and it was in an alarming state. If you have your eye on that one, you might want to save yourself the airfare.

 

[vyv_cox]

To the OP -
I went to see a very cheap one in Greece, dreaming of a bargain, and it was in an alarming state. If you have your eye on that one, you might want to save yourself the airfare.

There are some dreadful ones on sale. Quite a few were school boats that took some very heavy hammering. Still plenty of well cared-for ones though.

 

[westhinder]

Another alternative: a Rival 34 would tick all your boxes.

 

[Seajet]

Having sailed alongside a Sadler 34 and a Rival 34, how many circles would you like the Sadler to do around the Rival in say, 10 minutes ?!

 

[westhinder]

Having sailed alongside a Sadler 34 and a Rival 34, how many circles would you like the Sadler to do around the Rival in say, 10 minutes ?!

Precisely as many as an Anderson 22: zero