Rudder Bearings/Creaking

[lustyd]

Hi all, I'm troubleshooting a creaking rudder on my boat.

This developed on a recent trip but I jumped in the water last weekend and it's definitely not something trapped down there. I've also ruled out the steering, the noise is definitely coming from the rudder itself. We have rod steering so this was pretty easy to rule out in our case. I also ruled out the autopilot ram which I have good access to.

So, all that really leaves is bearings I think. Given that the boat is in the water, and the access to the rudder stock itself is pretty poor, I'm thinking next step is to spray some teflon lube into the bearings and see if that improves things whether temporary or not so I can at least confirm where the racket is coming from.

Any other thoughts or advice on the above? We will be lifting out in a month or two anyway but would be nice to have a plan if any major work needs doing.
Thanks!

 

[Tranona]

Sounds like the bearings need replacing. They will probably be acetal self aligning. Not familiar with the details of Jeanneau but pretty sure you will find accounts of replacing them or owners association sites. You will have to drop the rudder to get at them so you will need to prepare for this when you lift. With Bavarias you can do lots of prep beforehand like removing the steering so that only the retainer that holds the top of the stock neds to be detached to let the rudder drop.

Not sure Teflon will make much difference as the bearing is water lubricated.

 

[lustyd]

Not sure Teflon will make much difference as the bearing is water lubricated.

Thanks. Jefa says they need to be lubricated occasionally with a product like this. They certainly aren't water lubricated, they're inside the boat. Right now I'm just trying to identify the problem area and teflon should at least reduce the creaking noise if not fully fix it if it is bearings. No maintenance has been done since I bought the boat, as I'm sure is very common, so hopefully just dry or dirty. If I can identify the issue and it comes back I'll certainly arrange to replace them.

 

[lustyd]

Also, what does the panel think about the safety of accepting the noise for a few weeks? The rudder stock enters the boat pretty much at the waterline so I don't think we're in any danger of sinking and the steering still works.

 

[lustyd]

They will probably be acetal self aligning

Sorry didn’t fully read this earlier. Are those just plastic sleeves? From what I can tell the 36.2 has Delrin tubes as bearings rather than actual needle bearings as some have.

 

[Tranona]

They can be either. Originally solid acetal but more recently changed to roller. Replacements from Jefa can be either solid or roller. This jefa.com/ftp/old_boat_spare_parts/Bavaria/Bavaria37_M37_2000-2002/Bavaria_37_type_M37_short.pdf is the arrangement on my old 37 and pretty much the same as other models. Suspect not much different from your boat although the lower housing in the stern tube is probably different and hopefully better than the original Bavaria.

The point I was trying to make about spraying with Teflon is that while the top bush is dry and accessible, the lower is not plus the lower part of the tube will have water in it even though it is just on the waterline. The main cause of creaking is either the bearing being distorted in the housing which happens often with the Bavaria arrangement or corrosion or the aluminium stock. You will only find out when you drop the rudder. Pretty sure you are not the only owner who has had this problem so a bit of research will pay off before you drop the rudder.

 

[MagicalArmchair]

Sounds similar to the challenges I had on Mirage (Bav 40). I had painted copper based antifouling too close to the aluminium rudder tube, causing that to corrode which in turn crushed the Teflon washer. That then threatened to seize the steering entirely .

Seizing up rudder on passage: How to replace your rudder bearings – Sailing Mirage

Dropping the rudder and the repair itself sounds alarming, but is really quite simple.

 

[Neeves]

As Tranona says you need to be ready to drop the rudder just before she is put on the hard, once on the hard there will not be enough room to drop the rudder and the yard may have other uses for the hoist. So check how the rudder is secured and thus removed and do as much work as possible before hand and have all and any tools ready. Just make sure the rudder cannot fall out accidentally - they are surprisingly heavy.

You obviously need the opposite in reverse.

The yard needs to know what you are doing.

Its usually not difficult - but it is a yacht.

Jonathan

 

[lustyd]

once on the hard there will not be enough room to drop the rudder

Thanks for highlighting, not a problem where we lift out, and we have a deep keel so the boat is quite high. We only need to drop by maybe 70cm and this would be doable in their cradles

Its usually not difficult - but it is a yacht.

Isn't that the truth, I'm sure the boat will find a way to make it a three week ordeal

 

[Neeves]

My experience is limited to our cat.

I'm in the aft locker ready to release the final 'thing' that is retaining the rudder. Once released the ideal is that the rudder slides out, in which case you need someone, preferably 2 ready to catch the rudder - its nice if you have a thick doormat incase it comes more easily than you thought. I found the rudder needed persuasion to fall out and jiggling the rudder left and right and simultaneously pulling down worked - again 2 people outside.

Unless you can get off the boat - you are just a spectator.

Some yards are fussy about having people on a yacht when it is lifted - that's a problem you need to sort out with the yard. In HK they did not mind, when we had our X99. It was lifted with a single strop through a hole in the cabin roof and attached to the keel. The strop was not located quite right and when lifted was stern down. I thought water containers would get the balance right - the yard had a man standing on the bow - life in those days was cheap. So JoXepheline was lifted with one of those giant forklifts and carried across the yacht to our cradle (we dry sailed) with a man standing on the bow.

Happy days

Jonathan

But I suspect every rudder is different.

Jonathan