Bigplumbs
Well-Known Member
I saw a nice quote on a sign today it read..... Don't spend so much time making a living that you don't have time to make a life
Role of asset depreciation in larger (60f) boats
- Thread starter prinex
- Start date
Bigplumbs
Well-Known Member
No but it might mean that more people have some food to eat and clean water to drink
ari
Well-Known Member
Zing
Well-Known Member
if you rephrase the question as to how to spend €1.2m to give the maximum pleasure a thought comes to mind. How about spending that money on high class Russian hookers? What does it get you over 12 years? A simple calculation says that is €2,300 per week. That’s €1,000 for two nights a week with a bit of cash to pay the bar bill. That’s not unappealing and it does buy you a lot and I’ll bet you don’t use your boat that much anyway. What’s more, I’m not sure it will give the same pleasure if you did?
Bigplumbs
Well-Known Member
No doubt the amount of money that you have is perfectly acceptable though..?
well I will tell you how much I have and you decide if you do the same. As a gauge I think in round terms if your net worth is about 1-2 million UK £ you have plenty.
Bouba
Well-Known Member
While a few of us are looking at the ultra wealthy and mumbling about inequality, billions are looking at us. And they are angry
Bigplumbs
Well-Known Member
Very true and why shouldn’t they be
ari
Well-Known Member
Martxer
Well-Known Member
surely equality is impossible in society anyway. Everyone is different and everyone is motivated by different things. Some people are motivated to sit on the sofa in pyjamas all day others can manage to get up go out and stab someone for a few quid. Others work hard and keep themselves motivated by buying things they want be that 3 boats and a pool or the latest I phone
PowerYachtBlog
Well-Known Member
The boat show fluff and that they make you feel they are building it for you (in reality with 90% of boat builders is not the case) is why new boats sell.
In the end thank god for that as without this we would have no used boats to buy.
I think if the dealer is good in giving after sales (some are much better to others), and you are not so experienced in boat ownership going new is a wise choice.
I must add that new boats prices have literally explored in the last 2 to 3 years.
Why a Princess V50 open is now a 1 million plus boat from the 700k it was when it launched as V48 is beyond my understanding.
In the end thank god for that as without this we would have no used boats to buy.
I think if the dealer is good in giving after sales (some are much better to others), and you are not so experienced in boat ownership going new is a wise choice.
I must add that new boats prices have literally explored in the last 2 to 3 years.
Why a Princess V50 open is now a 1 million plus boat from the 700k it was when it launched as V48 is beyond my understanding.
oldgit
Well-Known Member
Want a nice boat, use your head . Brains will always produce a lot more dosh than Brawn. Nice boats come as result of thinking not sweating.
Best of all get a mate with nice boat and let him have the worry of paying for it, half the fun of ownership is sharing with others. its not much fun on your own.
Work smart not hard.
Best of all get a mate with nice boat and let him have the worry of paying for it, half the fun of ownership is sharing with others. its not much fun on your own.
Work smart not hard.
GravyStain
Well-Known Member
In which case, I'm very disapointed.
BoatNoob
New Member
To the OP, don't be crazy and listen to salesman or market hype that you need a 1.2M yacht. Show a bit of patience and get something you like for 3-400K Invest the depreciation and in 15 year the 7-800K not spent (& invested) will be worth 1.2M again. If your then young enough do it all over again.
Of course you could always do the George Best wise investment strategy of spending it on women and drink. then wasting the rest.
Of course you could always do the George Best wise investment strategy of spending it on women and drink. then wasting the rest.
Bigplumbs
Well-Known Member
It’s called greed
Bigplumbs
Well-Known Member
You really can't see the irony can you? Oh well...
Nope
Bouba
Well-Known Member
Buying new is not a crime. People buy new boats new cars new houses all the time.
Having the knowledge, skills, time to invest in a used boat is good. Something to be applauded. But no need to disparage anyone buying new.
Having the knowledge, skills, time to invest in a used boat is good. Something to be applauded. But no need to disparage anyone buying new.
Portofino
Well-Known Member
The old adage springs to mind what they say about fools and money ?= Soon parted springs to mind .
This threads about depreciation of 60 ftr boats and the relative value of buying a used depreciated out lower boat and getting it like you want simultaneously while still using it .
In this case a nice SL 58/62 or similar or a glassed up plastic fantastic latest smaller 50 ftr FB saving circa @€900 k
Whats your advice between theses two .
Factory pic ( see there web site for more ) circa £1.2 Million depending on spec for one of theses below .
Or one of theses or similar below £300 K - looks pretty fresh inside not much if anything to refit actually.
link here for closer scrutiny =San Lorenzo (IT) San Lorenzo 62 Used Boat for Sale 1995
Oh and invest or do something else with the difference ( the 900 K ) eg buy some more properties or stick it on the markets as an example .
If it’s liquid on the markets return 16/18 % , that’s as I have already said €144 K each year and more if compounded up over a 10 y ownership , more than enough to do it up , and offset any extra running costs .Berthing difference in Liguria the ops location is not that much anyhow .
Hard to see any down sides here , can you ?
Summary Bouba
1- what would you advise and why ?
2- see any down sides ? Do bare in mind the capitol appreciation of the 900 K investment (s)
DAW
Well-Known Member
Perhaps this is just an attempt to introduce some financial discipline and correct pricing into an industry that seems to have been loss-making for most of the last 10-15 years.
Whether you look at the big UK builders or their Italian equivalents, many have undergone some form of financial crisis and change of ownership during this period. It's easy to blame the temporary drop in volumes as a result of the financial crisis, but the reality is that most of these builders were in financial difficulty or on the way towards it well before this. New owners arriving from outside the marine industry have changed management, introduced more rigorous financial discipline and attempted to turn their loss-making trophy assets into profitable (or at least breakeven) businesses capable of servicing some of the acquisition debt. This has been done partly through manufacturing lead improvements, but also an attempt to raise prices to what the financial people consider to be more realistic levels.
It's also worth mentioning that today's boats are very different to those built 10-15 years ago. Increasingly complex household and domestic systems, the introduction of more sophisticated and expensive styling and finishes (not necessarily an improvement and not to everyone's taste, I know) and the inclusion of stabilisers, etc., all now expected by buyers, have a big impact on manufacturing cost. The interior of the average 40-60 foot boat is now finished more like an expensive luxury apartment than a boat and extensive carbon fibre, sliding roof, raising/lowering doors, stabilisers, etc. are all considered to be "standard" equipment.
Also, don't forget that the advertised price for a new boat is just the starting point in a discussion that usually results in a very heavy discount to the list price.
If you take a look at the publicly available financial statements of the UK and Italian builders, their profit margins while better than before are still fairly anaemic by the standards usually expected in a bespoke manufacturing business.
DAW
Well-Known Member
As someone who has bought both new and used boats over the last 10-15 years, I think there are pros and cons to both alternatives and for many people its not just a question of how much each costs. When I look at my history of boat ownership, the new boats have generally cost me more money in absolute terms, but not when you consider maintenance, depreciation and running costs as a percentage of the initial value of the boat.
For me, its not sensible to compare something that is 20 years old with something that is brand new just because they are the same size and have the same number of cabins. A lot depends on what you want to get from boating, how experienced you are, how much time you have and what budget you are operating with. For an experienced boater with plenty of time and enthusiasm, interested in maintenance and projects, and operating on a constrained budget, the older boat obviously makes a lot more sense. However, for someone relatively inexperienced, short of time, or just not interested in dealing with the problems of an older boat and looking for dealer support, and most importantly operating without any significant budget constraints, then perhaps the new boat is a more sensible option.
Also, which boats you are comparing, how old, how much, what work is needed, etc. all make a huge difference to the analysis. As an example ... I bought my current boat (a 2019 Sunseeker Predator 57) brand new because the purchase of a used boat (a 2012 Manhattan 63) fell through due to a failed survey. Having sold my previous 2007 Portofino 53 as soon as it went on the market, I was facing a summer without a boat and so bought the stock boat at a healthy discount to the list price and took delivery almost immediately. The purchase cost of the Predator 57 was similar to the cost of the Manhattan 63 plus the repairs, refurbishments and upgrades I was planning (perhaps 5% more). I have no regrets about opting for the slightly smaller Predator 57 ... its a great boat and I've been very happy with it. Today, two years later, a 2019 Predator 57 is worth 20% more than a 2012 Manhattan 63 and for the last two years while the boat was under warranty I've had no maintenance costs. So does this mean buying new was a sensible financial decision?
GravyStain
Well-Known Member
Good points all round.
I fall into the 'Financially constrained' group so my choice is a newer small boat or an older larger boat. I think that's probably most people on here... As long as your eyes are wide open, then all options can work i think.
