Reversing woes.

solent clown said:
I am supposed to be the clown around here. You made me chuckle then:D That steel's days are numbered, come a summers low tide, and a plasma cutter it will no longer be a landmark. :encouragement:
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:D
Unles they're going to chop it off well below water level, I think I'd prefer it where I could see it :(
 
I have a fin keeler with excessive prop walk to port in reverse. Boat is a pig going backwards under engine but reacts very sweetly with way on and the engine in neutral. I find if I give short bursts in reverse and then put it in neutral, I can steer really well in the neutral bits. Little busts of reverse just to keep the way on. I'm not in a river though so no current to compete with where I am
 
Euphonyx said:
I have a fin keeler with excessive prop walk to port in reverse. Boat is a pig going backwards under engine but reacts very sweetly with way on and the engine in neutral. I find if I give short bursts in reverse and then put it in neutral, I can steer really well in the neutral bits. Little busts of reverse just to keep the way on. I'm not in a river though so no current to compete with where I am
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Prop walk can be awesome fun though - means you can easily turn your boat in her length... great for going around in circles, not so great for going in a straight line astern I suppose...

On another point, my Flexofold decreased my propwalk - at times I do miss it...
 
MagicalArmchair said:
Prop walk can be awesome fun though - means you can easily turn your boat in her length... great for going around in circles, not so great for going in a straight line astern I suppose...

On another point, my Flexofold decreased my propwalk - at times I do miss it...
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I think it's great - a totally predictable stern thruster and a bit of wind gives you a mostly predictable bow thruster too. It does mean we have to go into reverse before turning into the line of boats so there's enough speed to go straight but propwalk gives you that lovely twist in the final docking manoeuvre if you need it.
 
SAPurdie said:
[I tried wading through the thread but lost the will to live...]

Have you tried going into the mooring astern?
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I am sorry you found wading through such a task. I had a lot of helpful people post in a very short time.
In answer to your question, yes, I had tried going in astern, with little success initially, hence the thread, and the practice yesterday that finally yielded results. In a previous post I mentioned we managed it several times yesterday. Today however was another story initially, as the tide was on the ebb, and there was a strong crosswind. I attempted many times to get it right, but reading my scribblings from advice on here on my notepad, I took the time to use the wind in my favour instead of trying to fight it. We approached at a completely different angle, with the wind behind us, then turned sharply into the finger. We almost looked like we knew what we were doing!
 
Hey,
Is this a daily exercise, by Christ you should start posting times and charge for the entertainment value. I'm going to come down and watch, I'm sure id learn a lot. Sounds fun. wish I could get to my boat everyday. sod it I'm moving.

Steveeasy
 
steveeasy said:
Hey,
Is this a daily exercise, by Christ you should start posting times and charge for the entertainment value. I'm going to come down and watch, I'm sure id learn a lot. Sounds fun. wish I could get to my boat everyday. sod it I'm moving.

Steveeasy
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hee hee, we do try to get out at least twice a week, even if it means me starting work at 5am to get a days work in before we go sailing. Today's comedy would have been clearly visible from Ocean village as we were trying out our lazyjack modifications, and testing hoisting the sail with them both up and down, into the wind etc. We must have looked ood hoisting sail, then dropping it again several times. Even after clearing the lazyjacks we have had trouble hoisting the main at random times - today was warm and calm enough for me to have a proper look up the mast and figure out the main halyard was tangling on an unused fitting. We had a proper domestic when karen panicked the first time, all forgotten once she had the mainsheet and tiller herself for the first time, and she caught a gust that had her whooping with joy as the boat heeled over and picked up her skirts. What seemed like half an hour on the water had us sprinting back for the tide two hours later :encouragement:
 
My serious suggestion would be to comb the waterfront to find a old boy who had been sailing all his life. Bribe him with beer and compliments to come and show you how he would do it. Nothing is new and in 50+ years experience he will have done this before and make it look easy. He will also enjoy the opportunity to share his expertise.
When renovating my old timber framed house we hit a serious structural issue with a major beam that my very competent builder could not solve without spending £10,000 plus. He bought his 80 year Dad over and he smiled and suggested a £250 solution that was brilliantly simple and worked perfectly.

The problem is to find the real deal and not a yacht club bar stool “expert” who really can not help you.
 
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Re: Cracked it!!!

solent clown said:
Hurrah! After a couple of hours messing about today, going up and down river backwards, backing in to finger pontoons, coming alongside, and edging up to mooring buoys, I can finally steer the bloody thing backwards! We must have looked quite a sight, bimbling around past the marinas, merrily going astern, performing figure of 8s and other strange feats of reverse manoeuvring past all the people out working on their boats.
One other problem i found, which was contributory to my previous woes, is that the tiller to rudder shaft coupling has a great deal of play in it, about 30 degrees under load in reverse - The nut on top has worn in to the tiller top metal thingie, the name escapes me right now, that the wooden tiller slots in to. It seems whoever fitted it last did not deem a washer necessary so the nut has eaten down through the metal.
I am hoping that when the boat is in mud, I can get something to support the rudder while I fix it, as the top nut is the only thing holding the rudder in and i do not want it sinking into the mud to be gone forever. Any ideas?
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Glad to see its getting better.

Ianc gave you good advice. If you want to back up. Use low revs and let the speed build up slowly. Of course you need a wee bit of room. Daydream gave good advice about getting some practice in.

I would add a little. Practice "turning short round."
With a bit of practice. A small fin keel boat can be almost turned on a sixpence. or at least not much more than in its own length.
With most boats its easiest to turn to starboard.

Find a bit more open water. not open its easier to see what's happening if there is something close by.
Stop the boat. An essential skill by itself.
The first thing you will notice. As you go aster to stop. The bow will go to starboard and the stern to port on most conventional right hand props.
When stopped put your rudder hard to starboard(when you've fixed it) (tiller to port side)
Give a little burst ahead. but not a lot just a second or two till the boat just begins to move ahead.
Then out of gear into astern and a brief burst of revs astern just a second or two. until she just start to come astern
Then ahead again and repeat.

The prop wash helps every time you go astern. and the water past the rudder helps every time you go ahead. Trick is to barley move ahead or astern.

You might find. going in bow to. coming out astern but stopping and short turning works. May be not with a strong wind blowing into the shallows.
But its always easier to back into the wind.
sometimes its good to have more than one trick up your sleeve.

Anyway have fun.
 
Dutch01527 said:
My serious suggestion would be to comb the waterfront to find a old boy who had been sailing all his life. Bribe him with beer and compliments to come and show you how he would do it. Nothing is new and in 50+ years experience he will have done this before and make it look easy. He will also enjoy the opportunity to share his expertise.
When renovating my old timber framed house we hit a serious structural issue with a major beam that my very competent builder could not solve without spending £10,000 plus. He bought his 80 year Dad over and he smiled and suggested a £250 solution that was brilliantly simple and worked perfectly.

The problem is to find the real deal and not a yacht club bar stool “expert” who really can not help you.
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Unfortunately, while that may work, it may not as well! I've been sailing since I was more use as ballast than crew, and generally can handle a boat. Unfortunately, because I started very young, a lot of it is almost instinctive, and I react to many things without being able to rationalize it immediately. Just for example, I had a long break from sailing, and when I went back I was helming my brother's boat. He complimented me on the adjustments I was constantly making in response to the waves; I was not aware (up to that point!) that I was doing it! And similarly, I am often more aware of surrounding wind patterns as shown by catspaws and wind shadows than others.

The result is that I am a lousy teacher of sailing, because I can't (easily!) explain in advance what I am doing. When I can explain things, it is because I have spent considerable time and mental effort on analyzing what I do anyway!
 
it is interesting to hear from so many people on their ways of doing things, it was very useful to write down most of the suggestions, and try them all out. We got the hang of it quite quickly in the end, and it holds no fears for us any more, yesterday with the wind was another story for a while, but again we took the advice from here and applied it to good effect. The other thing I sussed yesterday was holding the boat still in the water. The great advantage of doing it at this time of year is the river was very quiet, only one other yacht, and he was motoring, some canoes and ribs, and one utter pillock heading towards Northam bridge at about 15 20 kts in a speedboat. It was almost my first river rage as we attempted to slowly give chase until karen pointed out he was going under the bridge and we have a mast...
 
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