Replacement for time expired Coastal flare pack

[davidmh]

Time to replace this flare pack, no racing just cruising up to say 7-10 miles offshore. 27foot yacht.
A new flare pack of 2 red Hand 2 orarange smoke and 2 parachute are about £100 and last 3 years. The replacenent seems to be electronic flares with user replaceable batteries..
What is the forums views and experience
David MH

 

[lustyd]

I think a lot of us have come to the conclusion that flares are for coded boats as the hassle outweighs the benefit these days.

EPIRBS and PLBs give a very high chance of rescue without the fuss and expense.

This is all doubly true when crossing the channel as time expired flares on board are illegal in France.

On my boat we have no flares except in the liferaft and no LED flares either. I don’t consider that very risky despite our high mileage and wide cruising grounds. We do have EPIRB and a PLB along with the usual radios and phones/starlink.

 

[PaulRainbow]

I think a lot of us have come to the conclusion that flares are for coded boats as the hassle outweighs the benefit these days.

EPIRBS and PLBs give a very high chance of rescue without the fuss and expense.

This is all doubly true when crossing the channel as time expired flares on board are illegal in France.

On my boat we have no flares except in the liferaft and no LED flares either. I don’t consider that very risky despite our high mileage and wide cruising grounds. We do have EPIRB and a PLB along with the usual radios and phones/starlink.

Stopped buying flares a few years ago, we only coastal cruise so i can't see the point.

 

[Boathook]

I got rid of flares quite a few years ago. Rely upon epirb, plb, vhf, mobile phone and led flare. I realise that the mobile is no good mid channel and the led isn't much good in daylight.

 

[thinwater]

Even the US Coast Guard is transitioning to non-pyrotecnic signalling.

https://cUSCG transition to elelctroninc signally devices.ontent.govdelivery.com/accounts/USDHSCG/bulletins/3e1a974

Heck, many of us never venture beyond cell phone coverage. That said, I also carry a few old flares (packed with silica gel) in the case as a back-up. IME, old flares that are well stored are reliable. But electronic signally has many advantages:

• Lasts 8 hours or more.
• Recognizable SOS pattern, not just a distant light for a few moments.
• Safer in use.

I once did a test for a mag, having a helper set of lights and flares 2 miles away. The SOS signal was FAR more noticeable, particularly if there are any background lights. A distant light is probably just another boat. An SOS can be nothing else.

 

[LittleSister]

I think there is a role for flares, especially in the sort of mainly coastal sailing I do, in attracting the assistance of boats (and perhaps others) nearby.

EPIRBS, PLBs, etc. are good at what they are good at, which is something different from flares, but they are expensive and also time limited, albeit without the disposal problem.

I'm unsure about the value of LED flares.

i have let off old hand flares in the past, some 20+ years old, and all worked though the 'reds' were more of a pink, and I don't know whether they lasted the whole prescribed duration. I had just one that seemed noticeably short-lived, and as a result was concerned about how to dispose of the remains in case there was unburnt fuel in it. In the end I put it on a bonfire and ran for it, but if it did re-fire any remains, it was unnoticeable among the bonfire remains.

But I still have several rocket flares from those sets, plus some more recent out of date hand-held out of date, plus a set of truly ancient mini-flares with IIRC a sort of pistol type holder for firing them. Where I now live letting off the hand-helds in my garden is not appropriate.

At one point I did take some to a chandler that was offering disposal for a fee, but they said they'd run out of storage space and couldn't take them.

I am hoping that at some point there were will be one of those occasional one-off collections at some place and time I can get to.

 

[lustyd]

but they are expensive and also time limited

Cheaper and longer lasting than flares so I’m not sure this makes sense.

 

[William_H]

No experience but here in West Australia we are obliged to carry flares if more than 400metres off shore. Electronic fares are acceptable if (GPS) EPIRB is also carried.
Here is a link witha list of acceptable electronic flares. Flares and EVDS ol'will

 

[stuartwineberg]

I went for led flare plus a couple of buoyant smokes as not confident that an led flare would be useful in daylight

 

[ashtead]

I have a led one plus a few which might be reaching use by date next year. Smokes seem like a good idea agreed.

 

[wonkywinch]

Smoke helps identify you from the air especially if there are other boats around. Secondly it assists the pilot with surface wind direction, and to some extent windspeed.

 

[Refueler]

I have two thoughts on Flares :

1. I replace in stages ... ie if I have 4 flares .. I replace 1 or 2 now .... then replace the others later ... spreading the costs.
2. I do not dispose of old flares unless they are seriously old ... (on ship - we used old flares as demonstration for crew - first of all putting out a VHF call to advise any ships in area that we were going to be firing off flares).

LED 'flares' ?? Not sure if I am for them .... I carry a bright LED flashlight ... far cheaper ... easy to look after and serves many purposes ...

 

[mjcp]

I realise that the mobile is no good mid channel

That's not quite the case anymore:

iPhone satellite SOS (iPhone 14, September 16, 2022 and newer models, iOS 16.2/16.4 or later). No phone signal needed. SMS based SOS via satellite -> routes to emergency services.

And many iPhones are now water proof too (enough for this sort of use case at least), unsure about the pixels.


Android satellite SOS

• Pixel 9, Pixel 9 Pro, Pixel 9 Pro XL, Pixel 9 Pro Fold, and Pixel 10
• S25 etc - coming soon apparently.

The local mountain rescue team had their 1st callout via a watch recently - a brave new world !

M

 

[Mark-1]

Not totally relevant but youtube presented me a vid about "V Sheets" yesterday.

https://www.whitworths.com.au/safety-v-sheet

Essentially, a more formal version of hoisting your oilies up the burgee halyard but in the busy summer waters many of us sail in that's exactly what you need.

Seems to be more popular in the Southern Hemisphere and I'm too tight to buy one, but worth noting, I thought.

 

[thinwater]

Whether or not you like the idea of electronic visual distress signaling devises (eVDSDs, or what we are calling LED flares) you should learn to recognized the SOS flash. There are two styles, one that is in color and one that is only white. The color version includes an IR component for SAR using night vision.

(Obviously, the gray is the "on" time and the white is the "off" time--weird that they reversed them.)

They are night time only. The kit includes a flag, but obviously, smoke is much better.

----

The reality is that in this age most signalling is by cell phones, just because that is what people are used to doing. Not sayin' it's best.

cell phone vs. VHF

 

[petem]

Only smokes for me now.

Parachutes seem too dangerous and of limited use in daylight (which is the only time we're out at sea).

 

[RunAgroundHard]

I’ll continue to carry pyrotechnics until it becomes too difficult to carry and dispose or they get banned.

I believe they offer a worthwhile alternative method of alerting distress compared to conventional and new technology. I think that the probability of having to use them is diminishing significantly compared to the other kit I carry for alerting distress.

 

[flaming]

I'm still mandated to carry flares to comply with the racing regs. And in general I still feel that they do 2 jobs that nothing else does as well, and that the LED options are not, yet, matching.

The jobs that they do better than anything else are attract the attention of those closest to you (and therefore best placed to help) when you have no power or they aren't monitoring their VHF. And the "final mile" homing of rescuers to your location. Especially if those rescuers are NOT fully trained S&R professionals with all of the kit.

I can foresee a time when other available items can do those jobs as well as flares, but not yet.

 

[ylop]

Smoke helps identify you from the air especially if there are other boats around. Secondly it assists the pilot with surface wind direction, and to some extent windspeed.

Although your ensign will give them similar information. The key benefit to me is the ability to pick out your boat from multiple in busy areas and potentially for someone nearby, perhaps in a RIB, to come and help (ribs are noisy, so hearing maydays are not easy, and plotting a GPS location is not trivial on an open boat).

The local mountain rescue team had their 1st callout via a watch recently - a brave new world !

Interesting - I haven't kept up with the watch marked, but I did notice that the latest Pixel watches can satellite call without having your phone on you. Not cheap, but perhaps if you are thinking of trackers for everyone its worth considering.

Seems to be more popular in the Southern Hemisphere and I'm too tight to buy one, but worth noting, I thought.

Wow that seems expensive! Our american cousins seem to prefer one with a black square and a circle on an orange background - often included alongside other safety stuff as a "kit" and I assumed were about £2 each!

The kit includes a flag, but obviously, smoke is much better.

The smoke may be more distinctive but if used too soon will be gone - whilst the flag would still be fluttering.

The jobs that they do better than anything else are attract the attention of those closest to you (and therefore best placed to help) when you have no power or they aren't monitoring their VHF. And the "final mile" homing of rescuers to your location. Especially if those rescuers are NOT fully trained S&R professionals with all of the kit.

Don't forget your fog horn for intitially getting attention

 

[chriscallender]

Pretty sure a burning tar barrel is still internationally recognised as a distress signal. I don’t carry one, I wonder if anyone made a bad situation worse that way .