red ensign - flag of convenience

[chrisb]

I have been looking on the Noonsite that is jimmy cornells site for cruising yachtsmen.Apparently in the med the red ensign is seen as a flag of convenience which allows unscupulous yachties in particular charterers to escape local standards [especially spanish] regarding safety.I take this to mean skippers with certification and carriage of liferafts etc.I have always felt proud to fly the ensign whether defaced or not and the maritime heritage associated with it . What do scuttlebutters think ?

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[snowleopard]

you can\'t have it both ways...

there have been many posts complaining about present or possible future regulation of boating in the uk. for the most part we have avoided most regulation which suits the private sailor but conversely allows rogue operators more freedom along with the rest of us.





<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[AndrewB]

Mostly its about tax avoidance. Yachts flying red ensigns are badly regarded in some parts of the world, unless they are self-evidentally stinking rich, which leaves us Brits with a problem. A tatty ensign distinguishes the genuine British blue-water yacht.

 

[alant]

Thought MCA were monitoring anything in Med, & standards of manning were being enforced..

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Koeketiene]

What standards?

<hr width=100% size=1>Experience is a good teacher, but she sends in terrific bills.

 

[Mirelle]

Port State Control detentions - British flag ships

From today's Lloyd's List:

BRITISH flagged vessels saw a 50% jump in the numbers detained by port state control authorities worldwide last year, writes David Osler.

The news is bound to add weight to accusations by unions that the Red Ensign is degenerating into a flag of convenience.

According to the Maritime and Coastguard Agency, some 12 UK registered vessels were detained last year, compared with just eight in 2002.

However, the agency insisted that it was not worried by the rise, which it attributes to two factors. The first was the increased size of the UK register, which has grown strongly in recent years. The second was the increased levels of inspections generally at ports.

But a spokesman for officers’ union Numast argued that the development should sound alarm bells.

“We have felt for some time there is a danger that standards could be sacrificed in the ongoing effort to attract as many ships as possible,” he said.

“Certainly it is something we have already raised with the government.

“It will need a lot of attention to ensure the worst fears are not realised.”

But an MCA spokesman denied the accusation of complacency. Britain remained one of the world’s leading flags, he insisted.



<hr width=100% size=1>Que scais-je?

 

[ParaHandy]

Re: red tat ...

excellent advice .. left mine hingin' last week and now tatty although not quite on a par with the pair of grundies favoured by claymore ...

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Sybarite]

Many large yachts are run as charter businesses. From the tax point of view if they are registered as offshore companies in the channel islands or, for example, in the Ile of Man, they have (if not tax free ) very favorable fiscal conditions. I believe that this is a bigger influence than compliance with safety standards.

John

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[AndrewB]

Re: Port State Control detentions - British flag ships

Is there any indication whether any of these vessels are yachts? Is there clear demarkation between between vessels detained for safety reasons under port state control, and those detained for customs/immigration offences?

I'm not sure that port state control is necessarily a good indicator of the scale of safety standards, because the suspicion is ports find getting rid of the problem to someone else less trouble than taking action themselves.

Dover detained a Panamanian registered cruise liner Ocean Glory a couple of years ago, resulting in disgruntled American tourists aimlessly roaming the town along with the asylum seekers. There had been a fire aboard, but much was made of the hygiene standards. There was some local opposition and a feeling that it would have been better just to pass the problem on, rather than leave the ship mouldering in a corner of the dock during the legal procedings, infesting the place with cockroaches. The ship proved to be totally rotten and was, I believe, eventually sold for scrap (it's probably a ferry in the Philippines now).

 

[JPGruntfuttock]

After experiencing several dangerous incidents, in Greek waters, with Red Ensigned fast cruisers in the 30-50 ft class, I happened to ask a fellow Brit why he flew the defaced blue ensign which folklore had it was the favoured badge of Admirals and some sort of Aftersole, I think he said.

He told me that after many years of sailing under the Red, he preferred the considerable personal embarrassment of wearing the Blue but at least showing that he really was a Brit on a British boat, to the embarrassment of being associated with the behaviour of louts on chartered boats wearing the red ensign as a flag of convenience.

The Red Ensign is fast becoming a flag of shame in central Med waters in his view, it seemed to me after my experiences, he had a point. What the local fisherman who's little open boat was part swamped by a red ensigned 45' gin palace in the Levkas canal, thought, history doesn't record. Although the look that passed between us probably said it all. My anger at the loutish behaviour was fully justified, my shame at the association by flag remains strong enough to this day to answer this post.





<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[AndrewB]

Blue isn\'t necessarily Brit!

In most parts of the world, a blue ensign will generally get you mistaken for an Ozzie (even though their ensign is actually defaced red, Ozzie yachts are permitted to fly their national flag).

But in the US its something else again. Blue is the preferred choice of many US owners of 'flag-of-convenience' yachts. They haven't a clue what the distinction is, but blue goes better with the colour scheme. Specially as while red comes only in bog-standard tomato ketchup, 'blue' ensigns can be found in all shades from robin's egg to midnight. In Florida, word has got about that blue can be personalised with the owner's motif of choice in the fly. My favourite so far was Tweetie-Pie (apologies if there really is a Royal Club with a cartoon character as its emblem!).

 

[alant]

Oz v Kiwi Flags

Anyone know why the Oz flag has an extra star when compared with Kiwi flag?

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[JPGruntfuttock]

Re: Blue isn\'t necessarily Brit!

Must admit I have had a lot of fun this winter explaining the relationship between and rules governing the use of the 3 colours of ensign to Californian yachties.

As I guess there are fewer genuine British flagged yachts on this coast than in Florida, I seem to have got away with some fairly outragous explanations, so far.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Twister_Ken]

The extra star

is either David Campese or Shane Warne

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.writeforweb.com/twister1>Let's Twist Again</A>

 

[Rowana]

Re: The extra star

<<is either David Campese or Shane Warne >> and is dependant on the shape of your balls!

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Rowana]

Speaking of balls. . .

. . . this is the start of the Aussie rules season.

Now THERE'S a game to watch! !

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[pugwash]

Re: Oz v Kiwi Flags

The boring answer is that it's the Southern Cross plus a large star representing the federation of six states.

<hr width=100% size=1>