Red Diesel saga

[Heckler]

He could speak Dutch! I am of the same opinion as you and his attitude is exactly what is going to break up the EU!
That is the reason we are where we are!
No wonder peeps talk about Brussels as the description for all that is wrong with the EU!
Bring on the referendum is what I say, then we can get on with trading with the whole of the world without any constraints, especially with our kin in the Commonwealth.
All those cheap boats in the Carib and States, no more CE approved bullshit! Ooh bring it on!
Stu

 

[theoldsalt]

If UK leaves the EU it would not change the Belgian situation. Red diesel might still be illegal over there. So I do not see that this issue should affect an in/out referendum. However if UK does leave the EU red diesel may become illegal in all EU countries (for pleasure boating).

 

[RichardS]

If UK leaves the EU it would not change the Belgian situation. Red diesel might still be illegal over there. So I do not see that this issue should affect an in/out referendum. However if UK does leave the EU red diesel may become illegal in all EU countries (for pleasure boating).

I would have thought that leaving the EU would change the Belgian situation. The Belgians are presumably peeved that the UK are not, as they see it, following the EU rules on fuel taxation. If the UK is not in the EU we can implement whatever rules we wished, subject to EFTA requirements, if we join that.

Of course, the Belgians would still be free to ban British boats for whatever reason they wished and we could retailiate however we wished. (better get those Euro-fighters in place before we leave the EU!)

Richard

 

[Boo2]

garage white is often less than UK marina red

But until they start siting garage pumps on marina pontoons that's not much help... Sunrunner has 220l of tankage and I really could not be bothered to fill that from 20l jerry cans.

Boo2

 

[Boo2]

The sooner we tell the EC to kiss my aspidestra the better, roll on the referendum!

Leaving the EU will in no way positively affect this - Belgian law is Belgian law and if they decline to apply comity in this situation then red diesel will be outlawed whereever the boat hails from. In fact, it is our membership of the EU which has permitted the UK government to take the stand it has in our defence.

Boo2

 

[Daydream believer]

(better get those Euro-fighters in place before we leave the EU!)

Richard

Would have to run on white though. Otherwise we will be banned from fighting

 

[martinriches]

The sooner we tell the EC to kiss my aspidestra the better, roll on the referendum! Brussels are hell bent on more integration, well sorry, the whole mess is going to come grinding to a HALT!
S

Leaving the EU won't change EU regulations.

 

[sailorman]

But until they start siting garage pumps on marina pontoons that's not much help... Sunrunner has 220l of tankage and I really could not be bothered to fill that from 20l jerry cans.

Boo2

what is your annual consumption with your UFO 34

 

[KINGFISHER 9]

Apart from lugging the jerrycans are there any problems with running a marine diesel on 'garage white'? ... Any additives required?

 

[theoldsalt]

Apart from lugging the jerrycans are there any problems with running a marine diesel on 'garage white'? ... Any additives required?

Please don't start the "red vs white and high vs low sulphur and old vs new engines and adding 2T oil vs not" debate. It's been covered ad nauseam several times before.

 

[prv]

Apart from lugging the jerrycans are there any problems with running a marine diesel on 'garage white'? ... Any additives required?

Since nearly all so-called "marine diesels" were actually designed for shorebased generators, dumper trucks, lawn tractors, lorry refrigeration plant, etc, the answer as far as the engine is concerned is "no".

There is some suggestion that fuel with a proportion of bio-diesel might promote bug growth in the tank, but on the other hand road diesel is inevitably much fresher and the tanks are cleaner than many rusty old bunker barges on the water. I've had a dirty fill from a fuel barge that I'd never have had on the road, and Ariam's longstanding bug problem (now fixed) was entirely fed on red diesel.

I'd have no problem at all putting road fuel in Ariam's tank.

Pete

 

[pks1702]

With 800 litres onboard we wanted to be sure so last year wrote to Belgium Finance Department for clarification; we had the reply below albeit after the date for the trip.

It did seem to indicate by implication some sort of change from 31st Oct.

Any clarification Sailorman and Guapa can establish on their trip this week would be appreciated, looking to potentially go back again. If we had a few litres in the tank I would risk it but a fine on 800 could really spoil things :ambivalence:

 

[awol]

Please don't start the "red vs white and high vs low sulphur and old vs new engines and adding 2T oil vs not" debate. It's been covered ad nauseam several times before.

Indeed it has been covered before but obviously there are those who are unaware of the issues. Perhaps if you could provide a synopsis for them you would be doing the forum a service?

 

[Koeketiene]

Any clarification Sailorman and Guapa can establish on their trip this week would be appreciated, looking to potentially go back again. If we had a few litres in the tank I would risk it but a fine on 800 could really spoil things :ambivalence:

The fine is a 'flat fee' of €525. Regardless of the size of your tank or whether it's full or (half) empty.

 

[KINGFISHER 9]

Indeed it has been covered before but obviously there are those who are unaware of the issues. Perhaps if you could provide a synopsis for them you would be doing the forum a service?

Thank you ...I didn't know it had been covered before .... theoldsalt appears to be a trifle pompous ... maybe he's just sad and lonely and the forums are his only pleasure.

 

[Boo2]

what is your annual consumption with your UFO 34

Don't really know yet, but we filled up 3 times on the way down from Pwllheli. The old tank was smaller though.

Boo2

 

[pks1702]

The fine is a 'flat fee' of €525. Regardless of the size of your tank or whether it's full or (half) empty.

Thanks for that.

While unpleasant it is not the oft quoted figure per litre I have seen.

Worth a chance :encouragement:

 

[Daydream believer]

Please don't start the "red vs white and high vs low sulphur and old vs new engines and adding 2T oil vs not" debate. It's been covered ad nauseam several times before.

Perhaps some forumites want to discuss it further.
Just because you do not, it does not mean that they cannot.
Would you prefer that we object to any thread you might post on the grounds that we are not interested?
You do have the option to move on to another thread.

 

[Koeketiene]

Any clarification Sailorman and Guapa can establish on their trip this week would be appreciated, looking to potentially go back again. If we had a few litres in the tank I would risk it but a fine on 800 could really spoil things :ambivalence:

Further to this thread I've been in touch with some contacts in Ostend.
. The RNSYC HM says that he hasn't seen Customs (Douane) around this year. Maritime police do make the occasional rounds checking random boats. There are some UK registered boats in Ostend at the moment and those that were boarded by the maritime police were asked to produce passports, ship registration papers, radio licenses and - surprisingly - Schengen crew list.
- An RNSYC committee member who's something big in the local Chamber of Commerce says that the situation this year is the same as last year. Officially red diesel is a no-no. Unofficially a blind eye is being turned till the final EU ruling - expected spring 2016.
- Spoke to the Douane POC at the MIK in Zeebrugge and he pretty much confirmed the above. UK registered yachts (and others) are not actively being targeted in search for red diesel aboard - there is no witch hunt. However, should you fall foul of the law and you do have red diesel in your tanks that could well be added to the list of charges.

Some advise based on personal experience - take it or leave it:
- Maritime police and Douane are just doing their job. Don't get stroppy with them. Nelson was English, you are English, but that does not make you Nelson. And the red or blue bit of cloth flying from your stern does not make your craft sovereign British territory. If you attract the attention of officialdom and you let your attitude run away with you, you may well end up getting the book thrown at you.
- Never volunteer information. It makes you look shifty and with something to hide.
- Dealing with officials anywhere there a lot to be said for appearing less intelligent/more stupid than you really are.
- We have been boarded in Holland, Belgium, France and by the UKBA. Civility goes a long way - except with the UKBA storm troopers. The French gendarmes even turned a blind eye to our out of date flares. It's hard to throw the book at someone who's pouring you a cup of coffee.

 

[prv]

those that were boarded by the maritime police were asked to produce [...] Schengen crew list.

That's interesting. Is there something specifically Schengen about such a list, or is it just a handwritten list of, say, names, DoBs, and passport numbers?

Pete